Controller Functions: How Much is Too Much?

Quote:

---

Originally posted by JMET
I always thought the snes controller was damn near perfect so in the same fashion imo the PS2 controller is even better.

---

I am curious.. what exactly is it about the SNES controller that you find so special? I think it was ok.. but it was not terribly ergonomic or comfortable or anything. The D-pad could be much better, as it was just a crappy plussy (the ones Nintendo still plagues us with). The one significant thing about the SNES pad is that it was (probably) the first one to have shoulder buttons... That truly was a great innovation, but since then shoulder buttons have been much improved anyway (Saturn has perfect digital ones. DC/Xbox/GCN improved them by making them into "triggers"). I'd say it was pretty good for it's time but I would not want to use one now.

Quote:

---

What Saturn controller does everyone use because I have the standard non nights controller and it sucks.

---

The Japanese one became standard in NA after a while. The original NA Saturn pad was pretty wonky, but the second one is pretty much digital control perfection. There was a poll here recently about the best controller and Saturn won in a landslide.

Here's the good one:
http://www.makkunn.com/sirocon.JPG
(The NA one was black, obviously)

I actually liked the first U.S. Saturn pad. I found it to be far better than the PSX pad. The only time I despise a game using too many buttons is when it is needless. As long as a button is used for a sensical function in a game, I don't mind it too much.

I simply liked the snes pad no particular reason..

The N64 controller imo was plain ass.

As for the Saturn controller I must have the first because of indenting at the top, mine comes to a peak with a flat top...

The D pad is also flimsy shiny plastic crap...

Not sure when it becomes too much, it all depends on the game and the accessibility of the buttons. For instance, take my keyboard when playing FPS': That's a lot of buttons and I use at least 10 for your standard game (that'd be counting movement keys as well, btw), and if required can move up to 20+ or so quite easily.

For gamepads I'd have to say that six face buttons and good analog shoulder buttons (i.e. NOT the Dual Shock) make a great balance amongst a large number of functions and ease of use. But even more so then too many functions do I worry about then design of the controller to begin with. I really don't get the SNES pad love, I find nothing special about it aside from a crappy d-pad.

Beyond Steel Battalion's crazy controller, the only standard issue controllers I felt got out of hand were the Atari 5200 and Jaguar controllers. The number pads just do nothing for me, and take up space that didn't need to be used.

PS2 & Xbox controllers have about as many buttons as I'd care to use. I could stand to see 6 action buttons on the PS2 controller's face and keep the R1/R2/L1/L2 buttons on top. But that would be it for me.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by JMET
As for the Saturn controller I must have the first because of indenting at the top, mine comes to a peak with a flat top...

The D pad is also flimsy shiny plastic crap...

---

Oh, then you don't really know what you're missing... the first controller was a total PoS. I'm glad they realized it and switched over to the Japanese style one later on.

And Mech, what's wrong with a + pad anyway? I don't see people dissing the dual shocks, which are far worse. But are + pads somehow more inferior than say the Saturn pad? I still love the SS pad the best, mind you, but the SNES controller is a decent runner up.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Tsubaki
And Mech, what's wrong with a + pad anyway? I don't see people dissing the dual shocks, which are far worse. But are + pads somehow more inferior than say the Saturn pad? I still love the SS pad the best, mind you, but the SNES controller is a decent runner up.

---

The problem is not so much the plus shape... because a plus shape can be done well. Dreamcast proved this. When I first saw the DC controller I was worried about the D-pad... but I was happily surprised that it was wondeful because it was high, deep, and easy to point in all directions.

Some plus pads are absolutely horrible though.. and these are usually Nintendo ones. I don't know why Nintendo can't remove itself from this bad design. GBA is the perfect example a a horrible thumb-killing D-pad. It's shallow and hard to make directional movements (which is especially annoying in isometric games). It also requires more thumb repositioning than a nice deep one like Dreamcast had. It's basically the worst possible ergonomic design for a digital directional control pad (well, except maybe the PSX/PS2 disaster).

GCN uses an identical one if I am not mistaken. It's been forever since I used a SNES one, but I just looked at some pictures and it's not far off. I don't really see what's so special about the SNES pad at all really. It's a really old non-ergonomicly designed controller with a lousy d-pad.

As for the Saturn d-pad... it's perfect. You thumb can live right there on the centre of the pad and move easily in any direction simply my tilting in that direction. It's deep, comfortable, and easy to use. I think that's why that controller is as popular as it is - along with it's ergonomic design and excellent button response.

On a related note.

Quote:

---

What I said back then:

What an odd complaint.

I actually think it's strange when a developer doesn't use every single button in a game. And why would anyone feel overwhelmed if a game had a function for every button? The only time I could see this as a valid complaint, would be with the rainbow six games on dc, each key performed what seemed to be a million functions, but if a game does not multitask each button, then I see no reason to complain.

---

Also, I find it odd that people prefer to have only two shoulder buttons, almost every PS2 game I play usually maps important functions to all four shoulder buttons, for example, I use every single shoulder button whenever I play GTA or THPS. I'd hate to play these games on a pad that only had two shoulder buttons, especially THPS, sure, it worked fine with THPS2 on the DC, but now that you can do reverts and spine tranfers, using only two shoulder buttons for every function is just not practical.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Regus
Also, I find it odd that people prefer to have only two shoulder buttons, almost every PS2 game I play usually maps an important functions to all four shoulder buttons, for example, I use every single shoulder button whenever I play GTA or THPS. I'd hate to play these games on a pad that only had two shoulder buttons, especially THPS, sure, it worked fine with THPS2 on the DC, but now that you can do reverts and spine tranfers, using only two shoulder buttons for every function is just not practical.

---

I'll admit that having the two shoulder buttons can have some unique applications. The best one I can think of is Robot Alchemic Drive where you use the bottons to step each leg front or back....

But I think what it comes down to is the fact that you can't really have deep analogue triggers and 4 shoulder buttons.. and a lot of people really like the deep analogue triggers that Dreamcast, Gamecube, and Xbox have. They have a lot of uses... especially for a genre like racing.

I guess either option could be better depending on the specific game... but it also seems to me that more games are suited to take advantage of deeper triggers than the 4 simple PS buttons.

I don't think it's so much a problem with controllers having too many buttons, it's the games that have too many damn controls coded into them. I can only imagine the horros of using a controller to play a game like Jedi Outcast (for example)... You need a button to cycle through weapons, force, items, along with an attack, alt attack, use, jump, force use, movement, strafe, first-person camera adjustment, bla bla bla. Games get more complicated to control, so people are forced to design controllers with 30 bajillion buttons. Case in point: Steel Batallion. :p