Controller Functions: How Much is Too Much?

The one constant in the gaming industry over time has been the notion that the more buttons on the controller the merrier. The VCS's single button has ballooned into 12 (including L3 and R3) plus three directional devices on the Dual Shock 2. Are all of these buttons necessary for advanced gameplay, or do they simply allow the developer to spend less time tuning play mechanics? It seems to me that intuitive gameplay and increasing button population are contradictory. If that is indeed the case, what is the ideal number of buttons?

I don't care how many buttons a pad has, as long as the developer doesn't get lazy and forget to include a custom configuration. ;)

The SS controller is the best, really...

I've not really liked any analog controller thus far, so I can't say I'm in favor of them.

But 2 shoulders + 6 face buttons should be enough for anyone. The only change I would ask for is a select button (useful for taunts or whatnot).

I agree that there is a such thing as too much. There were some Saturn games which used all 6 face buttons that I simply had trouble keeping track of all the buttons. The Saturn pad is still my favourite ever.. but I think I prefer 4 face buttons because it makes more intuitive control schemes.

What I think is unnecessary are the extra shoulder buttons on the PS2 pad. In most games I don't like the extra buttons there.. but sometimes they can be brilliantly used - like in RAD for controlling the mechs (shame I absolutely can't stand every other part of the game aside from the actual gameplay).

I guess I don't mind the extra buttons and the really important thing is for developers to not use all of the buttons just because they are there.

When it becomes uncomfortable to use.

Too many shoulder buttons - read: PS/PS2. I hate a bunch of small, no-give buttons smacked on top of a controller. I rather have two responsive, deep buttons - read: DC.

Also: I don't think anyone needs an air-conditioned pad.

The only thing I don't like about 88 buttons is the fact that you can't use many older pads (SS etc.) without losing some moves. Ahh, I'll play Halo with a Saturn pad, who needs to shoot?

The Jaguar. 'nuff said.

I always thought the snes controller was damn near perfect so in the same fashion imo the PS2 controller is even better.

What Saturn controller does everyone use because I have the standard non nights controller and it sucks.

It feels like cheap flimsy plastic...

I wanted to add that the Genesis 6 button is nice also ;p

And to answer the question at hand, yes too many buttons suck arse....

The original standard US saturn pad was pretty bad, the second US pad and the Japanese pad are really nice.

I think the dual shock's pretty much it. Not saying it's the ideal controller, but it's just about at the ideal number of input devices/buttons. If anything it has too many (L/R2 and L/R3).

I don't think any console's going to go much further anytime soon. The cube and DC both removed buttons, the PS2's the same, and the Xbox is about par.

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Originally posted by JMET
I always thought the snes controller was damn near perfect so in the same fashion imo the PS2 controller is even better.

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I am curious.. what exactly is it about the SNES controller that you find so special? I think it was ok.. but it was not terribly ergonomic or comfortable or anything. The D-pad could be much better, as it was just a crappy plussy (the ones Nintendo still plagues us with). The one significant thing about the SNES pad is that it was (probably) the first one to have shoulder buttons... That truly was a great innovation, but since then shoulder buttons have been much improved anyway (Saturn has perfect digital ones. DC/Xbox/GCN improved them by making them into "triggers"). I'd say it was pretty good for it's time but I would not want to use one now.

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What Saturn controller does everyone use because I have the standard non nights controller and it sucks.

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The Japanese one became standard in NA after a while. The original NA Saturn pad was pretty wonky, but the second one is pretty much digital control perfection. There was a poll here recently about the best controller and Saturn won in a landslide.

Here's the good one:
http://www.makkunn.com/sirocon.JPG
(The NA one was black, obviously)

I actually liked the first U.S. Saturn pad. I found it to be far better than the PSX pad. The only time I despise a game using too many buttons is when it is needless. As long as a button is used for a sensical function in a game, I don't mind it too much.

I simply liked the snes pad no particular reason..

The N64 controller imo was plain ass.

As for the Saturn controller I must have the first because of indenting at the top, mine comes to a peak with a flat top...

The D pad is also flimsy shiny plastic crap...

Not sure when it becomes too much, it all depends on the game and the accessibility of the buttons. For instance, take my keyboard when playing FPS': That's a lot of buttons and I use at least 10 for your standard game (that'd be counting movement keys as well, btw), and if required can move up to 20+ or so quite easily.

For gamepads I'd have to say that six face buttons and good analog shoulder buttons (i.e. NOT the Dual Shock) make a great balance amongst a large number of functions and ease of use. But even more so then too many functions do I worry about then design of the controller to begin with. I really don't get the SNES pad love, I find nothing special about it aside from a crappy d-pad.

Beyond Steel Battalion's crazy controller, the only standard issue controllers I felt got out of hand were the Atari 5200 and Jaguar controllers. The number pads just do nothing for me, and take up space that didn't need to be used.

PS2 & Xbox controllers have about as many buttons as I'd care to use. I could stand to see 6 action buttons on the PS2 controller's face and keep the R1/R2/L1/L2 buttons on top. But that would be it for me.

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Originally posted by JMET
As for the Saturn controller I must have the first because of indenting at the top, mine comes to a peak with a flat top...

The D pad is also flimsy shiny plastic crap...

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Oh, then you don't really know what you're missing... the first controller was a total PoS. I'm glad they realized it and switched over to the Japanese style one later on.

And Mech, what's wrong with a + pad anyway? I don't see people dissing the dual shocks, which are far worse. But are + pads somehow more inferior than say the Saturn pad? I still love the SS pad the best, mind you, but the SNES controller is a decent runner up.

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Originally posted by Tsubaki
And Mech, what's wrong with a + pad anyway? I don't see people dissing the dual shocks, which are far worse. But are + pads somehow more inferior than say the Saturn pad? I still love the SS pad the best, mind you, but the SNES controller is a decent runner up.

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The problem is not so much the plus shape... because a plus shape can be done well. Dreamcast proved this. When I first saw the DC controller I was worried about the D-pad... but I was happily surprised that it was wondeful because it was high, deep, and easy to point in all directions.

Some plus pads are absolutely horrible though.. and these are usually Nintendo ones. I don't know why Nintendo can't remove itself from this bad design. GBA is the perfect example a a horrible thumb-killing D-pad. It's shallow and hard to make directional movements (which is especially annoying in isometric games). It also requires more thumb repositioning than a nice deep one like Dreamcast had. It's basically the worst possible ergonomic design for a digital directional control pad (well, except maybe the PSX/PS2 disaster).

GCN uses an identical one if I am not mistaken. It's been forever since I used a SNES one, but I just looked at some pictures and it's not far off. I don't really see what's so special about the SNES pad at all really. It's a really old non-ergonomicly designed controller with a lousy d-pad.

As for the Saturn d-pad... it's perfect. You thumb can live right there on the centre of the pad and move easily in any direction simply my tilting in that direction. It's deep, comfortable, and easy to use. I think that's why that controller is as popular as it is - along with it's ergonomic design and excellent button response.

On a related note.

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What I said back then:

What an odd complaint.

I actually think it's strange when a developer doesn't use every single button in a game. And why would anyone feel overwhelmed if a game had a function for every button? The only time I could see this as a valid complaint, would be with the rainbow six games on dc, each key performed what seemed to be a million functions, but if a game does not multitask each button, then I see no reason to complain.

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Also, I find it odd that people prefer to have only two shoulder buttons, almost every PS2 game I play usually maps important functions to all four shoulder buttons, for example, I use every single shoulder button whenever I play GTA or THPS. I'd hate to play these games on a pad that only had two shoulder buttons, especially THPS, sure, it worked fine with THPS2 on the DC, but now that you can do reverts and spine tranfers, using only two shoulder buttons for every function is just not practical.

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Originally posted by Regus
Also, I find it odd that people prefer to have only two shoulder buttons, almost every PS2 game I play usually maps an important functions to all four shoulder buttons, for example, I use every single shoulder button whenever I play GTA or THPS. I'd hate to play these games on a pad that only had two shoulder buttons, especially THPS, sure, it worked fine with THPS2 on the DC, but now that you can do reverts and spine tranfers, using only two shoulder buttons for every function is just not practical.

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I'll admit that having the two shoulder buttons can have some unique applications. The best one I can think of is Robot Alchemic Drive where you use the bottons to step each leg front or back....

But I think what it comes down to is the fact that you can't really have deep analogue triggers and 4 shoulder buttons.. and a lot of people really like the deep analogue triggers that Dreamcast, Gamecube, and Xbox have. They have a lot of uses... especially for a genre like racing.

I guess either option could be better depending on the specific game... but it also seems to me that more games are suited to take advantage of deeper triggers than the 4 simple PS buttons.

I don't think it's so much a problem with controllers having too many buttons, it's the games that have too many damn controls coded into them. I can only imagine the horros of using a controller to play a game like Jedi Outcast (for example)... You need a button to cycle through weapons, force, items, along with an attack, alt attack, use, jump, force use, movement, strafe, first-person camera adjustment, bla bla bla. Games get more complicated to control, so people are forced to design controllers with 30 bajillion buttons. Case in point: Steel Batallion. :p

I will have to get such a controller for my Saturn, and the PS2 controller kicks arse...

The four shoulder buttons on the Dual Shock can all be put to good use (case in point, switching weapons and different shooting options in Contra: Shattered Soldier).

The L3 and R3 buttons (pushing in the analog stick) was a great idea (see Ape Escape and Halo) and it almost sucks that the Gamecube pad doesn't have that option.

I don't think the number of buttons on an upcoming next-gen controller will have that many more buttons. It will most likely have four shoulder buttons (two of them being analog triggers), six face buttons, two analog sticks with the option to push them in, and a (hopefully good) D-Pad. Anything more would be unnecessary.

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Originally posted by Cowdisease
The L3 and R3 buttons (pushing in the analog stick) was a great idea (see Ape Escape and Halo) and it almost sucks that the Gamecube pad doesn't have that option.

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I will agree with that. Adding the buttons there was a nice extra. To the same effect it was a nice idea that the Gamecube controller added a digital button at the end of the trigger. I am not sure how many games use that though.

i think the DC controller has the best overall setup. The actual controller may not be the most comfortable, but the tried & true four button diamond works very well.

I also like how the analog stick it set above the D-pad, which lets you use the d-pad like four other buttons. This worked very well in MDK2 and Sodier of Fortune, when the controller wouldn't have had enough buttons without it

I think it's more important how the developer implements the controls than the actual number of physical buttons on the controller. Aside from the screen, a good deal of criticism has been levied against the GBA because of the lack of four face buttons. After playing Metroid Fusion and seeing what can be done with a limited amount buttons, having separate buttons for each command as in Super Metroid seems almost superfluous. Granted this doesn't apply to every game, but creative control interfaces can overcome some of the shortcomings of limited control buttons. Now ergonomics is another matter entirely, and the GBA is desperately in need of help in this area.

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Originally posted by Tsubaki
And Mech, what's wrong with a + pad anyway?

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Most are stiff, cannot be broken in, and make anything with diagionals twice as hard as it should be. Especially evident in any game that requires quick precise movement, like fighting games.

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I don't see people dissing the dual shocks, which are far worse.

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Then you haven't been reading my posts, because I think the Dual Shock is a plague upon conrollers. And the Dual Shock 2 is that pad but with added useless analog functions that don't work right.

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But are + pads somehow more inferior than say the Saturn pad?

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Yes, if for nothing else the circular pad which allows the entire pad to roll easier, quicker, and be more responsive to angles.

Having a plus pad is horrible, considering that you're often trying to use 8-way control with only four directions. Does that sound right to you? It may be a crappy pad, but I'd rather use my Microsoft Sidewinder with SNES roms then I would my actual SNES. The level of control is easily twice as good, just because it's a circular pad.

This can be circumvented through other measures - as Sggg pointed out - that the DC pad did quite beautifully. Despite being a cross pad it could be broken in and thanks to its height there was no problem rolling the pad even without diagonals. Shame the other companies don't seem to realize this. Or care, whichever.

Maybe it's just the old Sidewinder model I have but I hate its d-pad. It feels nice and smooth to touch but I don't think it controls as well as most console controllers.

I probably have the same one as you, an older model with six face buttons, two triggers, and a mode, start, and "M" button going down the middle?

I don't like the d-pad much (double-tapping is a pain), but it makes rolling easy as hell and is better then the SNES pack-in. I was never able to do Sabin's special attacks in FFVI, but I could them in my sleep with that Sidewinder once I grabbed a rom.

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Originally posted by remotec
The original standard US saturn pad was pretty bad, the second US pad and the Japanese pad are really nice.

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I liked the original American pad better. It was more comfortable in my hands, but it was really awful for fighting games. Of course, I didn't like either Saturn controller for fighting games.

As far a analog controllers go, I like Gamecube's the best. Everything about it feel right: placement of the buttons, size and placement of the analog sticks, the weight and shape of the controller itself, etc. It's just a wicked controller.

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Originally posted by NeoZeedeater
Maybe it's just the old Sidewinder model I have but I hate its d-pad.

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The general love for sidewinders most people seem to have is lost on me. I think they're generally bad controllers, and I've used/owned every variation. The dpads are terrible.

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i think the DC controller has the best overall setup. The actual controller may not be the most comfortable, but the tried & true four button diamond works very well.

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I agree. It's surprising how many games benefit from a "second d-pad", from fps-ers on consoles to stuff like chu chu rocket.

Yeah Mech, that's the same Sidewinder I have. It's not bad. The button layout in great. I just wish the d-pad was a little more responsive.

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Originally posted by MechDeus
It may be a crappy pad, but I'd rather use my Microsoft Sidewinder with SNES roms then I would my actual SNES. The level of control is easily twice as good, just because it's a circular pad.

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What you really need is a PC Magic Box, which lets you use a Saturn pad (or DC/PSX/PS2) with your PC. I never ever enjoyed playing anything on my PC until I got one... but now that I have it any game is great. I'd imagine it would be a great improvement for SNES games.

As for the Sidewinder.... I never liked it. I didn't use it that much but it always felt cheap and flimsy. It's far from the worst thing ever and it was probably better than the grappy Gravis Pro I had and definitely better than a SNES controller. Sidewinder does not have any terrible flaws... but I never liked it it just felt uncomfortable to me.

This is why the PC Magic Box was quite literally a dream come true for me. ;)

Sidwinder? ugh... that thing has the most atrocious D-pad ever concieved. It's like a mouse button that clicks in four directions...

I really need one of those PC magic boxes