Apparently Galford's dog Poppy is a playable character. Here are some screens. It looks authentic enough IMO. Discuss.....
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Apparently Galford's dog Poppy is a playable character. Here are some screens. It looks authentic enough IMO. Discuss.....
Looks like some ROM screengrabs more than anything.
Or plain old phonies.
They're quite possibly ROM screengrabs. 304 x 224 is the resolution and that tipped me off, given that this what the Neo-Geo runs at and also that these are pixel-perfect quality.Quote:
Originally Posted by Click_Stick
I've got a feeling that they're also fake- when one has access to the ROM, an arcade graphics editor/sprite ripper, and good Photoshop knowledge, they can do anything as far as doctoring a screen shot goes. Odds are good that this is a hoax, but I wouldn't mind eating these words.
Interesting. Since PS2 Shinobi had ninja dogs, I dont see why not Galfords best friend cant do some fighting as well :)
You guys know about Sanjuro, a sprite swap of Genjuro without the long hair, and he wields a large wooden mallet-type weapon instead of a sword?
Saw Sanjuro in action at TGS, dunno how to unlock the character though.
Yeah I know of Sanjuro. From what I can tell he's some sort of joke character. I assume he and the other boss characters are playable somehow. We'll probably find out sooner or later from either the ROMZ or somebody using a debug bios on their MVS cart.
Hey Poppy! (Woof!)Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
That was a very informative video Seven Force. :lol: Poppy being selectable is great. :tu: Now I don't have to pick that silly American Ninja. :D
All I have to say now is if it is true... SOLD! :D
http://users.adelphia.net/~werewolve...y-walk-rpg.gif
Interesting that the wolf sprite in the first screen and the third screen is identical.
EDIT: Well, after watching Seven Force's video, it's gotta be more than a simple screen fake.
It's Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure all over again.
Wof Wof!
He even inheirits his master's Strike Heads!
....
Thanks Seven Force :D
...why the fuck does this game look like it features mostly ancient ripped sprites and recycled backgrounds?
I've got a bad feeling about this...:(
It's half and half. Some of it's old, some of it is new and a bit of it is really old, but it's not like Samurai Shodown sprites are disgusting or anything. Just pretend it's Samurai Shodown 4 Turbo Edition or something....
Because it's on Neo Geo and this is SNK.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zerodash
Because SNK continues to use 14 year old hardware for their games?Quote:
Originally Posted by Zerodash
This is a goddamn joke. They are taking a giant dump on the old games and all of their fans by releasing this recycled background/sprite shit in the age of Guilty Gear X. There is simply no excuse for re-using decade-old sprites.
I figured that when SNK was "reborn" they would realize just how stupid it is to release Neo-Geo games in 2003. Guess that wasn't the case. They deserve to go out of business.
Bah. I love the Neo Geo. Yes, I'd prefer SS5 in high res on new hardware, but I'll take a Neo game.
Yea, and this type of bullshit is exactly why SNK won't bother for the forseeable future.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chibi Nappa
Again I say "bah". All of you guys can sit here and complain. I'm going to go play SS5 and Metal Slug 5.
2-d fighter fans are desperate people. We'll play whatever we can get. We'll buy almost anything. Low-Res or Hi-Res, we need something to tide us over till Sammy gets their fighting games to console or at least to this side of the Pacific. SNK Playmore knows this. They know we can't wait several years for fucking lazy ass Capcom to bring out another Street Fighter, VS game or whatever. They take advantage to make themselves some scratch. Hi-Res would be nice, but it's not like shiny graphics are somehow gonna make the gameplay magically better and/or different. I assume gameplay is usually what people buy games for. On a sidenote, SNKP seems to be making decent cash if they can churn out this many games and hire Falcoon.
Yeah SNK needs to drop that ancient hardware... well at least Capcom vs. Sammy (or whatever it ends up being called) has a better chance of being some nice 2D hi-res graphics :)
Look at me I'm a graphics whore!
Cool!
:lol: Brilliant!
Yes, it's old hardware.
Who cares?
We're getting some damn good games, that's really the bottom line. I say, keep the MVS games coming as long as they're profitable.
SNK/Playmore stays afloat releasing games on Neo-Geo hardware thanks to their network of fans who are confusingly dedicated to the MVS/AES line.
SNK may stay afloat on Neo-Geo hardware right now thanks to their fans, but their market certainly isn't going to grow past that anymore. They're essentially just working to serve the hardcore fans they currently have, and aren't looking anywhere past that. If that's fine by them, then I can't argue. I'd like to see them at least try to bring current hardware and current consoles to their main focus, and let the Neo-Geo expire. I don't think all their fans would dissapear if that were to happen.
That said, I'm looking forward to playing Samurai Spirits Zero, but I won't begin to care until a console port is announced (the AES doesn't count, it's an irrelevant system).
Yep. Let's keep in mind that SNK went bankrupt supporting the Neo-Geo... and then by some miracle they are back in business and they are doing the same shit over again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilykat
Azure, poor management and weak Neo-Geo Pocket sales ran them down to the ground the last time though so we have no idea if the Neo-Geo was profitable or not. This time around they seem to have a decent plan. Release MVS cartridge for arcade operators and rich guys, 1 or 2 months later they whore out AES cartridges to the nutballs, then finally 2 months after that they release next-gen console version of game for the masses. Sometimes they make a strange game on the side (KOF 3D in this case...) to make even more profit. I'd say that ain't half bad a plan. The arcade gets enough time to make a profit off of the MVS before the console release, the Neo-Geo whores are kept happy and the masses get the game when it's still somewhat fresh in their minds. Heck they even licensed out the KOF properties to Sammy for even more dough and exposure. Next year they have stacked release list so they can't be hurting too badly for the money unless each and every single game bombs (unlikely). Meh....
Those masses are the same type who say "Man, this game looks like shit, Guilty Gear X2 looks so much better" and pass it over. I'm curious to see such how well the KoF double pack is going to sell, and if the mainstream public will pick it up, since it is dated. Yes, alot of you will say "Screw the mainstream", but a good selling title gives SNK alot more money to work with, so maybe they can draw new sprites.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
SNK stays afloat, yes, but at what cost? Anicent hardware and recycled sprites. I'd love to see one of SNK's releases on a console system look profitable, because that gives them more money to develop with. I'm still a bit confused over why they don't just focus on Playstation 2 and the next gen sytems, instead of thinking of them as an afterthought after Neo Geo.
Maybe it is being a graphics whore, yes, but SNK hasn't really come all that far since the 90's. Hell, games like KoF 2001 have actually looked worse, when it comes to backgrounds and all that. And the last time I've seen a Neo Geo arcade machine was about six months ago, shoved in a corner with Metal Slug 4 and something else... so I'm assuming you're talking about the japanese arcade market, since the US dosen't have much of one.
Yeah, I'm pretty much refering to the arcades in South East Asia and South America. North America's arcade scene is pretty much dead. SNK makes a lot of money in places like Mexico. Heck, SNK Neo Geo USA pretty mostly serves the South America region.
As for the masses, they didn't seem to mind KOF 99 for the Playstation. That shit sold like 500,000+ copies and that was a weakass port. Guilty Gear XX, while is a nice looking game and plays great in my opinion, didn't exactly have fantastic sales. Not every one of the masses is a pure graphics whore. All SNK has to do to make a decent profit off of the KOF2000/01 pack is sell like 30,000 copies. A task that is pretty much possible for them.
Man, some of you are so hung up on graphics. What happened to enjoying good old fashioned gameplay?
It's more than just graphics. I get frustrated that a company with such a great history and talent such as SNK has resigned itself to being a niche relic, content just to serve it's dwindling number of fans. I'm not saying a break from their current hardware and current will meet them with massive mainstream success, but joining other developers in the 21st century couldn't hurt. Even if SNK has to do something as bold as taking a risk.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
Metal Slug 5? The tenth installment of King of Fighters? I'm having trouble maintaining interest in their library. SNK has the potential to really reinvigorate themselves and I'd hate to see them pass it over. Neo-Geo devotees always lean on the crutch response "the gameplay is all that matters", yet it seems many of them fear change as much as SNK itself does.
Furthermore, I know the arcade market is still vibrant outside the US, but SNK has to put more emphasis on current consoles. It's great that they can get speedy conversions of their games to the AES from the MVS, but the that KOF2001 is just about to be released on the PS2 in 2003 is kinda sad.
I look forward to maybe playing Samurai Spirits V on my PS2 in 2005.
I would love to see SNK make a hit game on a next gen console, make a ton of cash, to use that to really give KoF a facelift. I think, right now, it's that SNK dosen't have the cash to totally re-do it's sprites and such, because I would have imagined they'd have done it by now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilykat
I want to get and play KoF 2002, but only for cheap and only because of the character they put back in for the dream match. I'm not excited for the graphics or how it plays, because I know it'll play like KoF 98 or similar (since they removed strikers).
People care more about the roster and characters then the actual game, which is good on one hand (people are very loyal to the characters), but bad on another hand, because well, a bland game dosen't interrest anyone.
KoF 2001 is one of the ugliest 2d games i've played, espically with those backgrounds. But I guess that's more Eolith's fault than SNK's?
Wilykat:
That was a much better explanation. This I can truly understand. I guess SNK's thinking is that every single time they have taken a huge risk, they've got raped. (Hyper Neo-Geo 64, Neo-Geo Pocket) They seem to be prepared to take a decent risk with KOF 3D and SNK Playmore US President Ben Herman mentioned the idea of a new Baseball Stars, 3D Metal Slug etc. It'd be great if they made a new Cool Cool Toon, Iron Tank, Ikari Warriors, Crystalis, their other old stuff or some new shit, but in this day and age of innovation in games not being accepted very well they I guess seem still a bit skeptical. I don't want them to end up like Sega did during the whole Dreamcast thing.
KOF 2001 coming out over here just now near the end of 2003 is somewhat discouraging, but them trying to get out SNK VS Capcom Chaos in the first quarter of 2004 over here isn't too bad. I give them till summer to get Samurai Shodown 5/Zero on PS2.
Neo-Geo fans are very stubborn to change and I'd assume most of them would leave after SNK finally stops Neo-Geo support. Then again, lots of people seem to be hesitant towards change in their favourite video game series.
Enough of my rambling! I'll just wait and see what happens next....
I'm a huge NeoGeo fan, and I'm considering just not caring anymore about SNK because they won't change. What, ten years from now, are they still going to be making games on the Neo hardware?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
SNK's artists are good enough, and their game designers are strong enough, that I think they could afford to lose those Neo-Geo fans. It's seriously such a small audience, a drop in the ocean compared to the entire game industry. We're talking what, 3,000 or 4,000 people here? Not a whole big audience to lose when Sony has sold 50,000,000 systems.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
Not to mention that there is a difference between giving your fans what they want, and letting their stubbornness retard your company's growth.
All very good points. Ironic that SNK's slogan is "The Future Is Now". Anybody feel I should just change this thread name to something else?
This is probably one of the most funniest threads I have
ever read in a message board :lol:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Veteran
Bwahahahahahahahahaha!!!!! Good work diffusionx!
I'd believe that if the future of video gaming was decade old sprites and rehashed gameplay.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
I'd love to see a new or updated version of Crystalis, but all SNK makes anymore are shooters and fighters. Which is horrible, because Crystalis ranks as one of my all time faves.
Maybe new to these forums, but not new to SNK.
I just thought it was funny how someone can bitch so much at
at a gaming company and its fans because they can't obviously
afford to buy the original arcade games.
No, they want them on their beloved ps2s, xboxe's or cube's.
If you don't like the way it is, don't buy the games, easy as that.
For the time being enjoy your inferior ports while you can.
Thanks, 7F. Looks like we've got a real deal. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Seven Force
SNK does need to diversify somewhat. We really need a Blazing Star 2, followed by a compilation pack for the PS2 and/or Dreamcast. This is more important to me than a new Garou.
I'm not against SNK moving to new hardware- it's not all about the graphics, since you can only hold so much on a cart. The 68000 has limits on how much cart space it can access. If you want larger rosters, then new HW would be a good move. Having 60 fighters on one cart is something I can't see happening. Hell, a NAOMI cart can hold 1376 Megabits- and a NAOMI GD-ROM would be definitely more than enough (1 GB = 8000 Megabits, enough to relieve SNKP of any worries about space).
LOL, the typical elitist asshole SNK response. Came out, right on cue - "youre not cool enough to spend $300 on a single game running on 14 year old hardware, so of course you hate it". Hey, wanna buy my copy of Mickey Mouscapade on the NES? Ill give you a good price, $230. How's that sound?Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Veteran
We just want SNK to move on from this incredibly outdated hardware so they can produce games that can match up to whats out there. I mean, cmon man, Samurai Showdown 5 is the first SamSho released in what 1995, and yet SNK used some rehashed sprites. They dug into their archives from 8 years ago to get some fucking ancient sprites. That's bullshit. Why couldnt they just draw new sprites? Jazz the game up? Put it on a modern arcade kit so they can blow everyone away like they did when SamSho first came out?
It's not unreasonable to expect 2003 production values from a 2003 game.
Especially when there's shit like Guilty Gear X out there, which has amazing 2D graphics and kickass gameplay. And yes people here level these same complaints at Capcom when they peddle their rehashed sprite bullshit on gamers, but at least they try to change the gameplay a bit.
And you know... I wont play their games. And neither will 99.999999% of gamers, as well. Because the games look like they are a decade old. And they play like the games that were out a decade ago. And then when SNK goes out of business again you all at Neo-Geo.com can cry like little girls and complain about how the sheeple don't get your anachronism of a gaming company.
Neo-Veteran:
:rolleyes: This has nothing to do with people being unable to afford any freaking games. This has to do with SNK Playmore half assing on their recent games, their inability to adapt to the present, their milking of a few franchises when they have so many other great resources to work with and lack of willingness to take risks. It seems you are scared of change or something. I think your blind loyalty to a freaking machine has made you lose some brain cells.
Oh yeah, last time I checked most MVS cartridges are at the same price or slighty higher or lower than current next gen games. Why do you Neo-Geo loyalists always talk about how expensive the games are? Does it make you feel like a big man that you have purchased expensive video games? Does it make your E-Penis grow or something? Sheesh......:rolleyes:
How much we pay for a game is supposed to make a game (or a person) better? What a crock of shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Veteran
Just becuase there are 100 overpriced copies of game X in existence, it doesn't make it any less ancient.
Am I not the only one who predicted a response like this would surface in this thread? "Got a problem with SNK? TOO BAD, BUY OVERPRICED GAMES ON OUTDATED HARDWARE OR SHUT UP!!". :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Veteran
If you think investing thousands of dollars into original Neo Geo hardware and software (MVS or AES) is the only qualification for one being able to discuss the direction the company is heading in, the quality of their software, or their business model - that's just weak. Of course, I wouldn't ever bother bringing this discussion to a Neo-Geo specific message board as I imagine the insanity reaches a fever pitch there.
As for inferior ports, I guess that just speaks volumes about the incompetence of whomever team of programmers is in charge of DC/PS2 ports.
...Especially when it's SNK themselves at the helm. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilykat
Yes, which is why whenever people call to attention the inferior console ports of Neo-Geo games, I'm mainly left wondering why there's any reason for them not to be perfect ports. Outside of issues like a possible lack of a low-res video mode on the PS2 (not sure if this is the case).Quote:
Originally Posted by Seven Force
If the DC can handle Guilty Gear X, then I'd imagine it would have NOOOOO problem making an arcade perfect port. We're at the time now, where next gen console can eat up and spit out the neo geo, so the whole "inferior port" is just because of SNK, and NOT because of hardware.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilykat
When the ps2 can run Guilty Gear XX without a hitch, I *HIGHLY* doubt Metal Slug 3 or a KoF should pose any sort of a problem, unless SNK halfassed a port.
And it seems they love next gen consoles MORE then their own machine, because I don't remember their ports getting better backgrounds and added characters. Why do SNK loyalists have to say to that? Oh, wait, I know, "KoF 2001's new backgrounds are STUPID", like the original's backgrounds were some kind of work of art :lol:
allright, you can be that dog! EH POPPY? WOF WOF!!!
*wipes a tear from eye*
ah......never gets old.
After watching a few vids at Challenger-Am.com, I've come to the conclusion that Yunfei is really cheesy with that whole gliding thing.
Like the DC, PS2 can handle real low-res perfectly, as you can see in the KOF2000 port or any standard PS game you play with it. But people cried for VGA/hi-res support, you know...Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilykat
Actually that is incorrect. The original company got bought out by Azure *A Pachinko company of all things*, and they pissed off any real profits that S N K had going off to a good start during that year and pretty much drove what was left of it into the hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by diffusionx
There was an artical later about this discussing Playmore currently trying to sue Azure for poor management of S N K's properties.
It's a lot of red tape but a lot of crap happened that you can't wholly blame S N K directly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seven Force
There's one fact you're overlooking tho. Gaming is a hobby and for some it's an exspensive hobby. I know my Neo games cost a lot but it's my hobby and I'm a fan of the system.
I've also bought ports of S N K's game to show my support in them trying to be diverse with their support. There is so much more that they can do but their arcade market even on this hardware that is over 13 years old has a bigger following than you could possibly imagine.
I dunno why but I've considered it to be a serious fluke. They had tried to upgrade their hardware once and it flopped. So I guess they went with what had always worked.
Way to lay down the hammer man!
Oh, I was under the impression that the KOF2000 port was forced into a high-res mode like the port of Metal Slug 3 apparently is. Thanks for the clarification. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Recap
"Yea so Nokia tried to enter the handheld market once and it flopped". Like that Simpsons episode when Otto said "I tried, oh Lord did I try" when he really didn't do anything. Dude, SNK's attempt was shit. The Hyper64 is a piece of crap. Nobody should be surprised that that crap didn't take off. Don't tell me that they would fail if they tried to enter the 21st millenium now... if that happened, then they really do suck and don't deserve to stay in business.Quote:
Originally Posted by BonusKun
Like I said I dont think its unreasonable to expect 2003 production values from a game released in 2003. Im all for classic games, simplistic graphics, etc... when the games are actually classic. But SamSho 5 is a new release. I know people rip Capcom to shreds when they do that bullshit so why not SNK? Why is SNK offered a pass by the Neo-Geo fanbase?
Because, for the most part, SNK fans are elitist self-righteous assholes who love the fact that they spend $300 on a game because it puts them above everyone else who pays "only" $50 per game (and you ask me thats a lot of cash for a single game). Just look at what Neo-Veteran said for proof. And then SNK releases these bullshit ports which gives SNK fans even more ammunition... but really what is SNK doing when they release those trashy ports? They're just locking themselves out of a much, much, much bigger audience.
If SNK were to abandon the MVS I think a lot of SNK fans would be pissed off just because they wouldn't have that safety blanket anymore. Nevermind the real reason would be that SNK just doesn't want their games to look like shit anymore.
Well, the Hyper Neo-Geo 64 was nothing if not a bad idea. Almost all people calling for SNK to upgrade their hardware then and now still want to see them stick with 2D. SNK can't give up on new hardware alltogether after one aborted mis-step.Quote:
Originally Posted by BonusKun
Despite the fact that a PS2 + a $50 game would be well below the cost of a new, retail AES game. The MVS/AES has had an incredible run, but I won't understand the people who want SNK to stick with it into the future.Quote:
Originally Posted by diffusionx
LOL, is that difficult for all you heavy SNK enthusiasts/armchair historians to spell "ARUZE"? Here, I'll help: A R U Z E.
As far as NeoVet's or whatever his name is "logic" goes..... Well I pretty much only play MVS games. And I can't seem to find a better KoF than 98 or better SS than 2. SvC Chaos isn't half as good as MotW and I'm only going to buy Matrimelee because I enjoyed Groove On Fight so much. I have yet to spend more than $75 for a cart (MS3, Kizuna Encounter and Dodgeball each cost the same) and I have a feeling that most of the people in this thread that Mr Man is trying to flex his silly little fruitcake attitude toward could afford that. The brand new MVS release of SvC is only like $150 already. So that's a pretty thin argument to bring to a table that had been intelligently discussing what SNK could do to better itself.
I own and play the MVS carts I like because they are what they are: Great games. SNKP using new hardware will not in any way sleight the great games that were released for the MVS or make me want to play them any less. But the fact of the matter is their flagship series' are suffering in the gameplay department as well as not being graphically up to snuff.
And let's talk about working for SNK or SNKP or whatever. If any of the old artists and designers are still there they must hate this shit. "Yay, I get to work at a company that only lets me rehash the stuff I thought of almost a decade ago." I can't imagine that that's very rewarding. Or how about the new kid: "Yay, I work for a company where I get to think up ways to rehash something that someone else thought of nearly a decade ago." Also rather abysmal.
That said, SNKP still has alot going for it. I just hope they don't continue to pursue their options in beating dead horses. They've done that for awhile now and I've gotten a little tired of it.
Pa
I have no comment (just don't look at my sig)! :D
This is what I want to know as well. Why Capcom gets ragged on for using old sprites, but for SNK it's "hey let's not focus on the graphics".Quote:
Originally Posted by diffusionx
I guess the difference is that Capcom DO develop for newer hardware, so they have absolutely no excuse for doing it.
I can't see how making games for current consoles is in anyway detrimental to anything. The games will be cheaper, more people will buy them, and SNK will make more money, which means bigger budgets for their games.
It's very simple. Capcom is a bigger company with a lot of money whereas SNK is a smaller company that barely has any money. With Capcom's higher budget and use of slighty superior hardware I expect at least better results. Capcom gets ragged on for using old sprites because at least SNK had varied art styles for their sprites while Capcom kept using the same ones over and over again during the heyday. Arjue explains it pretty well actually.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roufuss
I must of had it blocked out of my mind. :lol: Didn't want to remember too much about that stupid piece of shit company. Ugh, they're a sponsor for PRIDE! :yuck: ARGH!!! Even still, they don't deserve to have their name spelt correctly anyhow. Oh well....Quote:
Originally Posted by PaCrappa
And Capcom has a higher budget because it dosen't develop on an ancient system, and barely post profits. For every million seller Capcom posts up, SNK has what? I don't think it'll have a million seller... and then we see excellent risky stuff like Viewtiful Joe because Capcom DOES have a higher budget BECAUSE of the million sellers.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
Just because SNK dosen't bother to make games for newer systems, it's ok for them to get by half assing it? I honestly don't think so. The day Capcom started working in 3d and focusing more on the home console market then the arcades, is the day their rivalry with SNK ended because Capcom hit a new level SNK *still* hasn't bothered to reach to.
I've also heard the excuse that SNK dosen't develop on newer systems simply because it dosen't have the experience, but hey, that's no one's fault but their own. So far we have such 2d masterpieces as Guilty Gear XX, and now Capcom's Viewtiful Joe, while SNK keeps rehashing from 1995.
I'm excited for Sammy vs Capcom just because I know it will play AND look good, and I imagine Sammy always had less of a budget than SNK has. I would ask "then why do Sammy's games look better?", but it's because they don't stick to ancient hardware.
This is why 2d is dying, at least in my opinion, because people see these games and say "man, it looks about as good as what I played 10 years ago", and just decide to skip it, whereas they see Viewtiful Joe and say "Hey, that game looks pretty stylish, I might want to give it a try".
Presentation counts for alot, and if SNK took one risk to make a higher budget, everyone would be happy.
Maybe I should make myself more clear on my position. I love 2d games, more than 3d, and I probably buy more old, dated 2d games than new games every year. But does any expect Konami to release a Metal Gear that looks like the one for NES? Or Capcom's next Resident Evil to look like the first one for PS One? It's just, it's 2003 now, and the bar has been raised for 2d, and SNK seems to hinder that. I'd love to see 2d come back more than anyone, but for that to happen it needs to break into the mainstream again. And today's AVERAGE consumer won't buy a game that looks like it was supposed to be released years ago. Companies are starting to show that yes, 2d games can be profitable, and if SNK would only step up to that, I feel 2d fighters could definately make a comeback.
Sammy is stinking rich. They're worth more than Capcom and SNKP combined. The Guilty Gear series is the bees knees over in Japan and I assume has a large budget.
The only reason Capcom is taking risks these days is simply because they're running out of money and need to turn it around. If they were as profitable as they were before, they would be like EA and Viewtiful Joe wouldn't exist. Capcom only inherited the higher budget because they milked the Mega Man franchise to horrific extremes. You can say SNK is rehashing, but if you legitimately believe Capcom is some sort of huge innovator then you're crazy. Capcom recently has made Viewtiful Joe, a bunch of Mega Man games, remakes of older games (running out of ideas maybe), a bunch of sequals to Mikami produced games, Breath of Fires, and a bunch of lesser, shitty, generic like games using Mikami's engine. Capcom is half assing almost just as much as SNKP.
SNK is a niche company. They will never sell as much as Capcom because their type of games just don't appeal to the masses. Go ask Sega how much money they made making a bunch of niche games using a high budget. That's right, they almost went bankrupt!
Who gives a fuck how it's spelled. It's still a Pachinko company. :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by PaCrappa
You may not think so but apparently a lot of people don't see it that way either. I'd like for them to take their programming skillz to the next level *funny i said that considering where I am* and try to do some serious cross licensing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roufuss
Amazing as this sounds kiddies, The King of FIghters 2K2 & SNK vs Capcom Chaos turned in a serious proft for Playmore which I can honestly say they must be doing something right.
Is this age of newer hardware and competeting companies & systems, it should be noted that the Neo*Geo was never meant to be a mass market system. Ever.
It's a niche system with a following of fans from people who played their games in the arcade, rom users, console ports, MVS home owners, & NGH home owners as well.
The cost of these games in this day and age is still pretty nuts & the 2ndary collector's market alone is disgusting but like I said it's a hobby and if you don't like it or it's too rich for your blood *sounds self-centered I know*, then don't buy it.
Just get the roms if you don't feel like spending $300.00 USD on a new cart. It's free and you can enjoy the game or you can wait for a port & maybe show a lil support that way.
It's a love/hate relationship with S N K's games so yes I know the hardware is dated and yes they could be doing something different on a newer hardware/system but it's their business and so far it's making them some money.
It's hard to argue with that.
Damn your good! All this SNK talk makes me want to buy all my old shit back. Good times....
I just realized who the fuck this is. The only person who uses the term 'Inferior Ports' has to be xtoo_short20x.Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Veteran
Hate to tell you this guy but that close minded opinoin you have about ports of S N K games isn't going to fly here. I'd suggest you'd not burn too many bridges yet. People on TNL love personalites like yours. :lol:
Oh crap! The Grant avatar just gives it away. Good observation. Crazy Neo-Geo.com posters.
And yeah I can believe SNK VS Capcom made a huge profit. How fast did the JAMMA board sell again?
Edit: 7 days till KOF 2003 beta test. We'll find out how much a rehash this is...
Worth more then Capcom? Since when?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
That's retarded. No company takes risks when they don't have money, that's exactly when they pull out the gaurenteed sales to get extra cash to take risks.Quote:
The only reason Capcom is taking risks these days is simply because they're running out of money and need to turn it around.
That stopped being valid during the days of the NES. These days that sort of sentence needs to be started with Resident Evil, but then you'd be leaving out their more recent money-makers like DMC.Quote:
Capcom only inherited the higher budget because they milked the Mega Man franchise to horrific extremes.
In comparision, yes, they are.Quote:
You can say SNK is rehashing, but if you legitimately believe Capcom is some sort of huge innovator then you're crazy.
A lot of that is just name brand with the gameplay having little to do with its namesake. Name one single RPG in existance that plays like BoF: DQ. Their recent Megaman Zero games share traits with the X series but are far more advanced and well-done then any Megaman game since the original three on the NES.Quote:
Capcom recently has made Viewtiful Joe, a bunch of Mega Man games, remakes of older games (running out of ideas maybe), a bunch of sequals to Mikami produced games, Breath of Fires, and a bunch of lesser, shitty, generic like games using Mikami's engine. Capcom is half assing almost just as much as SNKP.
Yes, Capcom does milk the hell out of their franchises. Funny thing is, you just listed more franchises that Capcom can milk then SNK has total, and there are tons you didn't post. You can hardly say a company with so many different kinds of games is half-assing as much as a company that relies on two series. Take away Resident Evil and DMC (their biggest series in years) from Capcom and what do you have? At least ten other current series to build on, not counting anything new they create (like Viewtiful Joe and P.N.03). Take away KoF and Metal Slug from SNK and what do you have? Garou. My, quite a list there, isn't it?They're a niche company because they refuse to do anything about it. Cave is a niche company that, just SNK, hasn't done anything really successful outside of one genre. Difference is, Cave manages to update their graphics with every game and keeps them looking good.Quote:
SNK is a niche company. They will never sell as much as Capcom because their type of games just don't appeal to the masses. Go ask Sega how much money they made making a bunch of niche games using a high budget. That's right, they almost went bankrupt!
Besides, how do fighting games not appeal to the masses? Outside of rythym-based games it's the only continued proven genre to make money in arcades. But if they want to expect to make a lot of money they need to work on something more current and they need to update their art. Hell, if they at least started drawing their characters in a different art style it would at least show some effort. A lot of fans would cry out, "The hell is this?!" but at least then they could start moving somewhere and show they're willing to take a chance and put some effort into things. Even Capcom finally understood how far you can really push a series without at least changing the look.
SNK needs to stop KoF, make a couple more Garous, and then move on again. It won't pull in tons of cash, especially at first, but it's a step in the right direction.
*reads thread...checks url*
Spooky, I thought I was at n-g.com for a bit there.
I can access TNL again! WHO HOO!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Veteran
Neo_Vet: You poor, poor fucking retarded ass-donkey. Take that "inferior port" bullshit back to neo-geo.com. We don't do that here. I come to TNL so I DON'T have to hear that crap.
Man, they are going to have a field day here with you, that's no "bullshit lie".
Who was that that said, "Let's take the one missing frame that makes the whole game virtually unplayable and hang it up on a wall and cry for it"? Was that 88/Icepick? :lol:
I rather hate the fact that people keep bringing this "fact" up. Let's be honest here - yes, SNK did try to introduce "new" hardware, but it was such a shit attempt that you knew it was going to fail from the very start. The hardware was nothing special, and the games were forgettable attempts at 3D.Quote:
Originally Posted by BonusKun
If SNK had tried to actually bring about a next-gen 2D piece of hardware, or even switch to something like Naomi, THEN we can use their attempt and following failure as proof that maybe they should be sticking to the Neo. But they still, as of yet, have made no honest and serious attempt to move to something new.
Edit: Yeah, I'm late responding to this compared to everybody else. Sue me.
Wow, bring up Neo Geo and how they work on old hardware and a lot of people go nuts :lol:
All I'm saying is SNK could probably make better playing and looking games if they developed on newer hardware, I don't think there is anything to argue about that ;) It's like Ice Cream, sure by itself it's good, but with a topping it's just a bit better... but then there are those who just like it plain :)
They could always develop on another hardware, it doesn't necesarily have to be hardware developed by SNK because there are a few nice ones out there they could develop on :)
That's what I'm saying... WOOF WOOF! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Satsuki
I wonder if the different color version will be just another color of Poppy or even cooler Ruru's wolf Nako ^..^
http://users.adelphia.net/~werewolves/gifs/nakowolf.gif
this is a little late, but that noob pic diff posted is awesome. might be better than the old one.
Mech Deus hit the nail on the head, but Capcom has made a TON of new franchises in this age of next generation consoles.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
Devil May Cry, Maximo, Viewtiful Joe, P.N 03, Killer 7 (yet to be released but it counts), Onimusha, not to mention AMAZING updates to older games, such as Resident Evil. And that's just for the ps2 on up. And the times they do go with the older formulas, it's worked out ok, because the Zero series and Battle Network have done alright for Capcom. Breath of Fire: DQ plays like no other rpg out there, as MD pointed out as well. The only game you can come close to saying is being milked is Onimusha, with it's third game on the way, but the first two were excellent and the third changes everything a good deal. Alot of those games I've listed have been defined as the top of the league, and some even innovative (espically Viewtiful Joe).
To say that Capcom is bringing out new franchises because they are out of money is asinine, companies only make new franchies when they can afford to take a loss. You mention Sega, but it's funny that Sega brought back all their large franchises AFTER they filed bankruptcy and moved onto next gen systems.
What's SNK done that's new? Nothing. Another Metal Slug, another KoF, another SamSho, with the same ripped sprites. It's like if new Mega Man's were still using his NES sprite. To say Capcom is running out of ideas, when talking about SNK, is lunacy. I know they do occasionally break out a different sort of game (like Cool Cool Toon), but that's few and far between.
And to say we need another Garou... there's been like 10 of em already :\
After reading Bonuskun's post I feel compelled to reiterate that the "if you can't afford it, don't buy it because how else would I know I'm harder core than you" argument stinks. I repeat: There is absolutely NO need to spend anywhere near $300 for an original Neo Geo game. As mentioned before, I have most of the MVS titles (the only way to go for the true Neo maniac since they are the real originals and that AES or shall I say "NGH" crap is merely "inferior ports" due to the fact that you're practically forced to play them with that crappy child's toy of a stick and no stock AES has RGB output) I want and have yet to spend over $75 for any single game. Anybody playing consoles can easily afford just about any MVS cartridge except for maybe Bang Bead. And as far as I know, KoF 2002(sucked), SvC Chaos (sucked) and this new SS title (probably sucks) are the only MVS carts out there that still fetch more than $100 from the resourceful fan.
So cost is NOT a factor, m'kay? Let's leave that one out of the aforementioned otherwise intelligent discussion. The people here who express that they hope for a bigger and brighter future for the legacy of SNK (because under NO circumstances are they actually SNK anymore) are not doing so because they can't afford a $28 KoF 99 cartridge.
Carry on.
Pa
I'll let you in on a secret. I actually liked Wild Ambition and Samurai Shodown 64. The graphics engine wasn't that high in the poly count but I liked some of the games on that hardware.Quote:
Originally Posted by shidoshi
Buriki One was just..weird.
That racing game was cute and I saw it once in a standalone cab.
There was a gun game also even tho I can recall the name of it.
It may stink but it's the truth. Some people are more than willing to pay for a pretty package/insert/manual/baggie ect ect. Those are collectors so they will pay collector's prices.Quote:
Originally Posted by PaCrappa
Of course you should tell these people the cost factor in getting an MVS board, Supergun ect ect. The inital cost is a lil high but after you get all that, the system pays for itself with games so cheap to come by.Quote:
I repeat: There is absolutely NO need to spend anywhere near $300 for an original Neo Geo game. As mentioned before, I have most of the MVS titles (the only way to go for the true Neo maniac since they are the real originals and that AES or shall I say "NGH" crap is merely "inferior ports" due to the fact that you're practically forced to play them with that crappy child's toy of a stick and no stock AES has RGB output) I want and have yet to spend over $75 for any single game.
I tell people all the time that if they are just now getting into this hobby then it would be best to go the MVS route instead of Home Cart. Granted some home carts are really cheap but it's usually either mass produced titles like Samurai Shodown II or Sengoku 3 in where there are so many copies Shawn @ NG.com had to lower the price below his cost to move the damn things out of his store.
Oh and about that no stock AES RGB thing you're right but you can pretty much fix that easy enough the same way with either an RGB Mod, S-Video, Debug Bios ect ect & yes I also know you can do it with MVS boards now also.
NGH & MVS carts are the same thing. It's just the board in which the chips are layed out on that makes them different.
Heh that's about right.Quote:
Anybody playing consoles can easily afford just about any MVS cartridge except for maybe Bang Bead.
KoF 2K2 was much better than 2K1 and is probably the closest in comparasion to KoF '98 in what people referred as the best in the series.Quote:
And as far as I know, KoF 2002(sucked), SvC Chaos (sucked) and this new SS title (probably sucks) are the only MVS carts out there that still fetch more than $100 from the resourceful fan.
SvsC Chaos: Well I like the game but it's not on my gotta have it now list. Lots of issues within the game didn't set with me but a lot of other people like it.
Samurai Shodown V: I played this for awhile already. This game is a fucking piece of work. I've been on it for a week straight & am loving it. Once I had this game I dropped SvsC like a bad diaper.
Yes it IS a factor if you're wanting to buy Neo games to collect them in home cart format. If you want to play the games then go MVS.Quote:
So cost is NOT a factor, m'kay?
Oh you mean the fact that Kawasaki's *The guy who created the NeoGeo* sister bought the rights to S N K's properties*since he couldn't legally bid on his own properties* means that some of what's left of S N K still doesn't exist?Quote:
Let's leave that one out of the aforementioned otherwise intelligent discussion. The people here who express that they hope for a bigger and brighter future for the legacy of SNK (because under NO circumstances are they actually SNK anymore) are not doing so because they can't afford a $28 KoF 99 cartridge.
Playmore is trying but, it's not fully the same as it used to be and it never truly will but, most people see them as one of the last bastions of 2D gaming so to some people they could pump out a piece of shit in a plastic box and people would buy it.
I've been selective about the games for the Neo seeing as I skipped RoTD and the sequel and after seeing the MVS cart drop to a pitiful $68.00 bucks at one point for a complete kit, I'm glad I waited.
"If you want to play the games then go MVS."
I thought that's what we were talking about. Playing games. And if looking at plastic boxes with fancy inserts is better than just playing the game itself, how about Playmore or whomever making a new piece of proprietary cartridge based arcade hardware (you know, like at least semimodern) and then releasing a home system based on the exact same architecture and then whip up a bunch of the exact same thing that you could purchase for cheap in the arcade format, only with the addition of a plastic box, halfass "manual" and a slickly printed paper insert and continue to keep their "devoted fans' in this battered girlfriend that just can't seem to break free from the mindgames and random beatings type relationship.
The cost of one Jaleco Pony Cabinet with a single slot MVS board is almost exactly the same as a fully modded AES system and it comes with a 29" RGB monitor and real arcade controls to boot. And oh yes, you can also use it to play all the rest of your favorite high quality jamma arcade PCBs. Show me an AES that'll do that and I'll be a convert for life ;)
The thing with KoF 2002 is that it neither looks nor plays better than KoF 98 and it looks a damn sight WORSE than MotW. And I'll freely admit to spouting preconcieved notions directly out my ass regarding SS5, I just don't particularly care for that series. Last Blade pisses all over the poor things, to say nothing of Last Blade 2.
Is there really a Rage of the Dragons sequel?
Pa
Even if it wasn't me I'm totally taking credit for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by FighterX
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaCrappa
Nope. But because of having some ROTD characters and being made by the same team, some consider Toukon as a sequel to the mentioned game.
This comic i've just made expresses my feelings on the subject:
This comic i've just made expresses my feelings on the subject. Enjoy:
what what
FighterX: I think StriderKyo actually wrote that quote. Sorry Icepick...:lol:
MechDeus: Well maybe it was a bit extreme to say that Sammy is bigger than SNK and Capcom combined, but Sammy is bigger than Capcom. Capcom total assets for 2003 = 106,648 million yen. Sammy total assets for 2003 = 112,873 million yen. Minor yes, but still....:) My brain is too fucked up at the moment to respond to the rest of your post so I'll just agree with you instead. Victory is yours! I'm lazy....bah! :yuck:
As for the rest of this hilarious mess of a thread, I have no real response other than this: SNK seems to be making a good profit at this moment in time, despite the great displeasure a lot of their fans seem to be showing towards then. Until fans stop supporting the half assed product, their production values will never improve because right now they have no reason to do better. I hope they catch on and figure it out themselves, but I'm starting to have my doubts. So you fans out there, if you actually are sick and tired of the same shit, don't be a hypocite. Show your displeasure by not showing any interest in their product. If enough people do it, maybe SNK will notice and shape up. As for me, I'm not sick and tired of it yet so I'll wait till I hear beta test impressions of King Of Fighers 2003 a week from now.
On a remotely related note, the Capcom Financial Review is an extremely interesting read.
The Bastard, I assure you, if SNK came out with a game that looked and played as sick as Guilty Gear X I would be first in line. Guilty Gear X is if you ask me the best 2D fighter since SF3 and it shits all over anything Capcom has done since SF3, and anything that SNK has done since... geez who knows when.
But its still pretty pitiful to see SNK releasing this trash nowadays.
At this point I'm pretty much in agreement man, but I really need my SNK gaming fix no matter how average the KOF series is. Metal Slug 5 and Samurai Shodown 5 look and seemingly play alright by my standards though. As for next year's games, here's to hoping for less recycling...
So....
MotW is awesome.
I love KOF to death, but after the shoddy showings of the past few years, I no longer fail to get excited, but of course, I need my SNK fix, so I keep on playing.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bastard
I remember when I used to think, "KOF*next year*!? Oh SHIT!!" Now it's, "Who are they going to recycle this time....". The series has totally lost the soul that 94'-99' had. It's like they peaked at 98, and started going downhill ever since.
They seemed to have stopped listening to the fans also. How many requests have I seen for the return of Eiji Kisaragi? I've lost count. At least they are taking a step in the right direction by finally tying in Garou characters.
I meant in the vein of MotW. Another two of those will probably go as far as it will get taken and then it's time to start a new series.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roufuss
Wow.. GGX is pretty, but its animation, sound effects, music and gameplay certainly isn't doing any shitting on anything Capcom or SNK has put out. I found GGX to be decidedly craptastic. The gameplay showed promise, but it still wasn't as dial-ed in as Real Bout's gameplay or SFIII:Third Strike. And again, that animation = :xx: The announcer's voice is only slightly less maddening than X-Play's.Quote:
Originally Posted by diffusionx
I've never played GGX2 and I've heard great things about it, but after owning GGX, I really hold all those gushings suspect.
When I was at Nickel City, they had SvC Chaos set up next to Third Strike.
I was mostly playing Third Strike with some Alpha 3 breaks, but whenever I'd glance over and accidentally look at Chaos, my eyes would start bleeding.
It was very annoying.
I don't know about that....Metal Slug 5 looks amazing. I guess we'll see soon enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by diffusionx
I remember those conversations we used to have back in the day, about KoF and getting all excited for it. I think all our enthuiasm died around 2000, if I remember correctly, and the only time we talked about 2001 was the horrible backgrounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by FX-ism
And yea, how the new dream match left out a ton of cool characters. FX, maybe 2003 will spark our interest again? I'll be sure to send you an email with all the new happenings, since the beta test starts today.
Beta testing starts TODAY?!?!?!!?!? I thought it was gonna start on the 17th. Oh well, the sooner the better I guess...
"I don't know about that....Metal Slug 5 looks amazing. I guess we'll see soon enough."
With this I must concur.
What the heck is "Toukon"? RotD is pathetic but I still feel compelled to get answers to this one.
Pa
The only Toukon I know of is Toukon Retsuden.....It's probably Neo-Geo Double Dragon or Matrimelee he's talking about....
I doubt it's Matrimelee because that's a Power Instinct game. Recap's way too up on his game facts to make such a mistake.
Please Recap, what did you mean by "Toukon"?
Pa
Matrimelee's full original name: "Shin Gouketsuji Ichizoku: Toukon ~Matrimelee~". Since the main part in the logo is the kanji for "Toukon", I like to use this better than "Matrimelee". This is the way the game is known in Japan, too. And yep. It has ROTD characters as secret bonus.
Well then, you learn something new everyday...
Bonus? I really don't consider anything RotD related to be worthy of bonus material in any other game. I haven't played Matrimelee yet but there's no way it can be as lame as RotD. And that's not even to say that RotD doesn't play well. I have no idea! I've played it for a few but I pretty much immediately thought to myself "Oh, here we have yet another unnecessary MVS fighting game and the characters, background, premise are completely utterly insignificant, lame and poorly designed. It's like World Heroes for the new millenium."
For some reason just knowing that there's anything related to RotD in Matrimelee is undermining my faith in the overt enjoyability of the direct sequel to Groove On Fight.
Recap, thanks, even though what you just told me I did NOT want to hear.
Pa
Matrimelee is definitely better than RotD. Is it better than Groove on Fight however is debatable.
You'd be surprised of how big the legion of World Heroes fans is.
Anyhow, Toukon's not bad at all. It captures decently the original Gouketsuji saga style and the music is.. hmm... you need to hear it. Poor backgrounds, thoe.