A Gamer's Manifesto - What's wrong with video games today...

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25 May 2005, 03:14 PM
shmup-o

A Gamer's Manifesto - What's wrong with video games today...

A Gamer's Manifesto

I may not agree with all of their opinions, but I can see where they're coming from with nearly all of them.

However, a few stand out to me...

Quote:

Immersion and the invisible hand of God

If pretty graphics are king, it's time to remember what pretty graphics are for: immersion. For whatever its faults, Doom III knew this.

Immersion means soothing to sleep the part of our brain that remembers we're not intergalactic bounty hunters or world-class athletes. And that part of us is rudely jostled awake when our snowboarder bounces off an invisible wall in midair because he strayed from the race area. I understand you can't have infinite space, guys surfing right off the mountain and taking a snowboard tour of Asia. But put a cliff there. Cliffs are solid. Empty air is not solid.

Almost every game does this. In Lord of the Rings: Return of the King there's actually a "run out of a crumbling building" level and where stones rain down on your head and block your path. So the biggest difficulty in the level is that you can't jump over a knee-high stone because THERE IS NO FUCKING JUMPING IN THE GAME.

Game makers: it doesn't have to be a jumping game for you to give the characters the basic ability to jump low obstacles that all humans have. And when I walk up to little ledges that are 10-inches off the ground, a ledge a toddler could crawl over, and you arbitrarily don't let me pass because it's not a jumping game, you remind me of what I'm really doing: playing a game. We're to the stage where it should be a minimum requirement in the game universe: rock should act like rock, air should act like air and humans should move like humans.

Chances of that happening...

The new hardware can certainly handle it; realistic physics are part of the chunky graphics stew the new games are so good at brewing. This should only get better, unless, as I suspect, the game makers secretly hate us.

and my fear for the future...

Quote:

16. Don't use the online capability as an excuse to release broken games

The first time we hear the word "patch" in relation to a PS3 or XBox 360 game, we're taking the console back to the store. Filled with our shit.

But surely the console industry, always more business savvy than their PC counterparts, will avoid making us gamers their unpaid beta testers.

Chances of that happening...

...again depends on how many turd-filled consoles they get stuck with. In other words, the consumer always gets exactly what they'll put up with.
25 May 2005, 03:18 PM
Joust Williams

"you remind me of what I'm really doing: playing a game"

If you need reminding, then you are 3 years old. This suspension of disbelief stuff is junk. I HAVE A CONTROLLER IN MY HANDS

are you tired of playing with unrealistic controllers? hell no http://www.xavix.com/
25 May 2005, 03:21 PM
George

I always made comments about the counter-immersive measures some games have, especially a lot of Zelda games.

"A leaf blocks your path, you must get the golden rake of raking in order to clear it"

*Dungeon, boss involving rake*

*Clear the leaf without much fanfare, lather, rinse, repeat*
25 May 2005, 03:25 PM
Diff-chan

I always hated Japanese RPGs for that same reason. In battle scenes, you would be flinging huge fireballs, casting down meteors from heaven, summoning gods to do your bidding, but once the battle scene ended... a character would die from a stab wound (General Leo, FF3) or a wooden door would block your progress.
25 May 2005, 03:31 PM
Jeremy

Pretty good read. The patch as an excuse to release a broken game has already happened with WM 21, and I'm sure it'll happen again in the coming generation.
25 May 2005, 03:33 PM
Joust Williams

Yeah, but when it happens to good games, it will be lame. No one gives a shit about Wrastlin21
25 May 2005, 03:38 PM
Yoshi

Quote:

Originally Posted by diffusionx

I always hated Japanese RPGs for that same reason. In battle scenes, you would be flinging huge fireballs, casting down meteors from heaven, summoning gods to do your bidding, but once the battle scene ended... a character would die from a stab wound (General Leo, FF3) or a wooden door would block your progress.

IBTN

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joust Williams

Yeah, but when it happens to good games, it will be lame. No one gives a shit about Wrastlin21

And this news too. :lol:
25 May 2005, 04:15 PM
galvatron

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joust Williams

"you remind me of what I'm really doing: playing a game"

If you need reminding, then you are 3 years old. This suspension of disbelief stuff is junk. I HAVE A CONTROLLER IN MY HANDS

are you tired of playing with unrealistic controllers? hell no http://www.xavix.com/

I agree with you, but I also agree that gaming is better off without the things this guy is complaining about. It's all about making the game intuitive and not asking the gamer trick questions (mind you, I don't mean that games shouldn't allow/require you to be clever). In real life, if there's a rock in my way that is 3 feet tall, I hop on top and go over it, I don't say "I can't jump" I'm screwed...make the main character Johnny 5 and I totally understand that he can't jump. An example of a "fair" puzzle the part of Eternal Darkness where you have to get a fuse box working without a fuse. I immediately solved it and felt pretty good I thought of something clever to do. Others got stuck and maybe looked up a guide, but I'd image the people that thought the solution made no sense were in the minority. Assuming common sense solutions won't be ruled out is something I think most gamers would, at best, appreciate, or, at worst, readily accept.
25 May 2005, 04:19 PM
cka

I can understand releasing a patch if some really huge game-breaking bugs are found, that's fine, but otherwise I'm not taking any patch for a console game.

And I have a hilarious feeling that if this does somehow happen that sony/microsoft would require you to pay for the download with all this micro-marketplace bs on their online infrastructures and I'd lol all the way back to eb with my copy of the game.
25 May 2005, 04:24 PM
voltz

I always get stumped when it comes to doors blocking your path and you need to find a key.

WTF!??

I always figured logic will tell you to either break the door down, shoot the lock, or grab something you could pick it with. Does it always have to be so gayishly scripted in you have to find a key when you can IRL take the shortcut and save yourself the trouble? Also in games like resident evil, you have to pull this same crap when EVERYONE else has free access to the entire mansion/labs/police station etc etc and they're like "oh it's you!" when we finally meet up. I'd be like HELLO, could you let me barrow the key before I decide to put a cap in your ass?!

Oh and since Jill is the master of unlocking, maybe she should take a look at that doornob and get the idea she can unlock it?

I'm glad Outbreak figured some of this out.
25 May 2005, 04:29 PM
Prince Planet

Quote:

Originally Posted by cka

And I have a hilarious feeling that if this does somehow happen that sony/microsoft would require you to pay for the download with all this micro-marketplace bs on their online infrastructures and I'd lol all the way back to eb with my copy of the game.

Are you saying that you anticipate the companies charging for a downloadable patch to make the originally purchased game work? Giants like MS and Sony warrant a measure of distrust, but I really can't see that happening.
25 May 2005, 04:33 PM
Fe 26

I wish I had a johnny five game

"Your momma was a snow blower."
25 May 2005, 04:43 PM
EvilMog

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronPlant

I wish I did have a johnny five game

"Your momma was a snow blower."

"thats what I said, DERF"
25 May 2005, 05:52 PM
Shapermc

Quote:

Originally Posted by cka

I can understand releasing a patch if some really huge game-breaking bugs are found, that's fine, but otherwise I'm not taking any patch for a console game..

Any game breaking bug should have been found in the beta-testing stage of the game. Part of the reason I choose consoles over PCs for games is because I don't have to deal with patches and configurations or anything like that. Console games should not have game breaking bugs, and if they do you should be able to send in your game for a full refund.
25 May 2005, 06:12 PM
Jeremy

Joust, regardless of the game, it's lame. Basically saying that it's okay because it's a wrestling game is incredibly short-sighted.
25 May 2005, 06:29 PM
Joust Williams

No, I'm saying it's OK because it's a shitty game.
25 May 2005, 06:44 PM
Jeremy

That's certainly a fine double standard.
25 May 2005, 06:47 PM
Joust Williams

1st of all, I was teasing.
2nd of all, a crappy game with no decent features is going to be a crappy game patch or no patch.
25 May 2005, 06:50 PM
Diff-chan

3rd of all, people stopped caring about wrestling games with WWF Attitude on N64.
25 May 2005, 07:52 PM
Fe 26

people cared about wrestling games?
25 May 2005, 08:13 PM
johnk_

see: Korly
25 May 2005, 08:15 PM
Mr_B

Patches are inevitable. You won't see to the degree of its sister in the PC world, because the developers are working with a standardized piece of hardware. Most patches in pc games are to fix the 1000's of different hardware configurations not giant game bugs, although there are those in existance too.

Wrestling games went downhill after the N64 era. The best parts were the make-believe wrestlers, who were based of real ones but given goofy names.

Saladdin and Powder Keg still rock the house...
25 May 2005, 08:15 PM
Diff-chan

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronPlant

people cared about wrestling games?

Back in my EB days, I had to call a 250 person preorder list for WWF Attitude.
25 May 2005, 10:50 PM
StriderKyo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joust Williams

Yeah, but when it happens to good games, it will be lame. No one gives a shit about Wrastlin21

You just hurt the feelings of trailer parks and gay communities everywhere.
As for this manifesto, screw it. If games don't have arbitrary rules, then they'll all pretty much play the same.
26 May 2005, 02:05 AM
Kev

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvilMog007

"thats what I said, DERF"

Los Lobos Kick Your TEETH!
Los Lobos Kick Your FACE!
Los Lobos Kick Your ASS INTO OUTER SPACE!!
26 May 2005, 02:08 AM
Revoltor

It's Los Locos

Los Lobos are a rock group.

Loco = Crazy
Lobo = Wolf
26 May 2005, 01:31 PM
toxic

15. Stop the Short-Sighted Business Bullshit

Patents. Did you know there's a patent held by some microscopic software company on spherical camera controls in realtime 3D, and they're starting to level lawsuits against EVERYONE? Did you ever wonder what happened to force feedback, controllers that push your hands around so you can feel the action in the game as well as see it (we're talking real force feedback, not controllers that vibrate like pagers)? Somebody has a patent, that's what. Did you know you can't have mini-games during a loading screen because of patent law?
26 May 2005, 02:50 PM
Fe 26

Fucking greedy smart people. More people should be like Ben Franklin. He just made stuff. None of this "Like wtf, you are using something I thought about a few years ago, give me some moneys."