New Car Fever!

I love looking at cars. Even if I have no money and no need for a new vehicle I drive through car lots every chance I get. Lately though, I'm thinking I may be able to get a new car. Uh-oh.

I'm at the point where the current car that I have is still at a good resale value which caused me to start kinda looking around at cars again. This is the car I currently own, a 2003 Toyota Corolla.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...E832008901.jpg
It's been a great car, but some noises it makes are starting to creep me out and the gas mileage probably isn't what it should be. What started all this was realizing I could get a brand new Civic for about $3000 more than what my car would sell for. I went to look at the Civics on the lot, but decided it would probably be better to wait for next years model since the current is so bland.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/takk28/1301.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/takk28/1298f.jpg
Then I found these "spy shots" of the '06 and I'm shocked by how much the sedan version looks like the car I already own. I'm dissapointed that it is even more bland looking than the current Civic model. It just looks too tall and less sporty. The coupe (bottom picture) looks a bit better, but still not very exciting.

I read somewhere that this is the last year Toyota is making the MR2 and looked around a bit to see prices on used ones. It seems like a pretty impractical car for most people, but I think it would be a blast to drive. More than two seats are unnesessary for me and I could give a crap about the zero cargo space. I've found used ones for very decent prices and it's just a design I've always found interesting. I would love to have a convertible. The one I found is a 2001, but it has less miles on it than my Corolla. I really want this, but buying used just scares me.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...1548942211.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...1548942212.jpg


Heres some pictures of other cars I've looked at and like. Post pictures of cars you like too I guess.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...large_4_ex.jpg
New Eclipse Raarrr...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...5door_0204.jpg
Mazda 3 Wagon, a neighbor has this car and I always find myself looking at it.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...-Tree-0001.jpg
Prius, yeah I know ugly blah blah, but all the futuristic things it has are cool.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...celica_790.jpg
Celica, I've always liked how this car has looked, minus all the plastic shit of course.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...28/2110485.jpg
Mid 90s Tacoma, only truck I've ever liked.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/takk28/g35c3.jpg
G35

Looks like I'm a Toyota whore.

I'll post more that I like later, but it's time to eat.

I just bought myself a Mazda 3 :D I love it to death... :sweat:

When I do get a new car, which won't be until after I graduate from college in about 3 years, I definitely plan on going with a hybrid. And I'd also like a SUV so right now the only thing I've been looking at is the Ford Escape Hybrid.

http://www.the-nextlevel.com/board/a...id=16197&stc=1

http://www.the-nextlevel.com/board/a...id=16198&stc=1

I also really like it in the color shown in the first pic.

It's funny how all the people who have bought the large SUVs in the past few years (like and Escalade, Envoy, Expedition) are going to get absolute shit for them when they trade them in. It's getting harder and harder to sell them now because of gas prices so the trade in value is going to shock a lot of people.

Xeno, Toyota has a Highlander hybrid now, you may want to take a look at it (I like Toyota more than Ford, so I'm biased. And in that same vein, perky, I'm sure that MR2 is ready to do a shitload of driving before it needs any real repairs. A little investigating could turn up a sweet deal).

It'll be interesting to see what kind of cars will be around in 3-5 years. Hybrids and whatever is next should be pretty damn good.

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Originally Posted by Rumpy

It's funny how all the people who have bought the large SUVs in the past few years (like and Escalade, Envoy, Expedition) are going to get absolute shit for them when they trade them in. It's getting harder and harder to sell them now because of gas prices so the trade in value is going to shock a lot of people.

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Its part of the reason GM is in such deep shit right now as well. The actually dropped thier new low cost Rear-Wheel Drive sedan platform they were working on, to concentrate on more SUVs, but the market is going to be toast in another couple of years. Gas Prices will never see The High $1 range again..

Me, I am on a 80's car kick of late, I am buying one of these beauties as a project car pretty soon..

http://www.the-nextlevel.com/board/a...id=16199&stc=1

1987 Dodge Daytona Shelby Z

Not the very car, but the same model, and color. 5sp, 2.2L Turbo, Sunroof.

Great thing about 80's Turbo chryslers, is the computer has been totaly reversed enginered and hacked to holy hell. 300HP is not uncommon Ill be shooting for 350 with mine when I start the big build-up.

Just go out on a sunday to a bunch of dealerships (of if there is an auto-mall nearby) and test drive every car you can.

And since 2006 models are coming out soon, dealerships will be looking to get rid of their 05 models, cheap.

If there is an Acura or Subaru place over there, you should test out an RSX-S or a WRX. Two of the nicest cars I've had the pleasure of test-driving. I didn't like the Mazda 3, though. The steering and suspension felt a little shoddy, and the interrior was cheap plastic.

Good luck.

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Originally Posted by perkyskirt

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...1548942211.jpg

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Do you want to make your penis seem even smaller? If so, go for this one.

Seriously.

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Originally Posted by Rhydant

I didn't like the Mazda 3, though. The steering and suspension felt a little shoddy, and the interrior was cheap plastic.

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Have you driven a Mazda 6 yet? It's really nice. I wants it.

If you want an MR2, go for the generation body style before. They are great cars, and look like little Ferrari's.http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/5790/mr20jf.jpg
Much sleeker, much better lines, and a hard/T tops. Way, way cooler.

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Originally Posted by Rhydant

Do you want to make your penis seem even smaller? If so, go for this one.

Seriously.

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So you're only driving your piece of shit car to give people the impression you have a big penis? That's odd.

Seriously.

Someone please agree with me that the 2nd gen looks SOOOO much cooler than the Spyder. The Spy sucks.

Dont buy new. There are a ton of certified pre owned with less than 20,000 miles (and if you are willing to look, less than 10,000) that will save you probably 2-3k.

Mazda's have an especially high "drive it off the lot" depreciation, which is great for someone buying certified preowned.

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

If you want an MR2, go for the generation body style before. They are great cars, and look like little Ferrari's.http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/5790/mr20jf.jpg
Much sleeker, much better lines, and a hard/T tops. Way, way cooler.

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That's a bad ass looking car right there.

I really liked the Saab...9 AX I think it is (or was)? A WRX in Saab clothing. It's basically a luxury edition WRX which is a fucking great idea but last I heard no one was buying them.

My mom drives a RSX Type S. Bad ass car for the price.

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Originally Posted by Rumpy

That's a bad ass looking car right there.

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I like that too. I wonder how hard it would be to find one that isnt riced out...

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Originally Posted by Wildkat

Me, I am on a 80's car kick of late, I am buying one of these beauties as a project car pretty soon..

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I'm with you here. For the price of a new car, you can buy a whole fleet of 80's sports cars and fix them up. I loved the look a co-worker gave me when she was talking about struggling to make the car payment and pay insurance on her new Kia (bleh) and I told her that the cost of my new-looking (and running) RX-7 cost about the same as her down payment. Not to mention I have a spare one that cost me almost nothing.

If it makes you feel better about your car:

I drive a 97 Buick Skylark Custom with 107,000 miles on it with a check engine light. It costed me $1200 to get it to pass inspection and it broke down awhile ago (I left the oil cap off...stupid things happen) and had to pay $400 to get it fixed then. The car only costed me $400 to buy, though my mom decided to sell it to me while I was at boot-camp and already spent the money that I "bought" it with by the time I got back.

I just got a 2005 Honda Civic Hybrid on Tuesday... replaced my 1995 Honda Civic DX. I was gonna take some pics of it tomorrow to show my family that lives out of state. Will post them here when I get a chance.

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Originally Posted by Rumpy

I really liked the Saab...9 AX I think it is (or was)? A WRX in Saab clothing. It's basically a luxury edition WRX which is a fucking great idea but last I heard no one was buying them.

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The 92-X is a deal and a freaking half right now due to the firesale over at GM.

Someone on the SA Auto forums picked on up for under $20k, for what is essentually a WRX that even has some suspension parts from the more expensive WRX STI, and a body style every different from the tons of other WRXs out there..

Also on the new small car front, I am in love with the new Saturn Sky..

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/J...turn%20Sky.jpg

should be out in a couple more months..

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Originally Posted by Wildkat

The 92-X is a deal and a freaking half right now due to the firesale over at GM.

Someone on the SA Auto forums picked on up for under $20k, for what is essentually a WRX that even has some suspension parts from the more expensive WRX STI, and a body style every different from the tons of other WRXs out there..

Also on the new small car front, I am in love with the new Saturn Sky..

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/J...turn%20Sky.jpg

should be out in a couple more months..

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hahahah its still a saturn

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Originally Posted by anish

hahahah its still a saturn

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Saturns aren't typically my bag, but most everyone I've known with one has been happy with it. Saturns have always been kind of "bland" (up until now, apparently), but they were originaly created to compete with bland imports. They used to have super-high resale value too, apparently until people found out they were American. A kid I went to high-school with had a first year Saturn that he maintained like crap, but still had it a few years ago and has put over 200,000 miles on it with no problems. I myself was eyeing the Saturn Vue V6, until I found out the engine is made by Honda. I've owned plenty of good GM V6's in my lifetime, if GM is now telling me they can no longer build a V6 for their own vehicles than I'll buy something else. A bit upscale for me, but a used Lincoln LS (yea, my first Ford product ever) may be in my future.

http://www.sphere79.com/2005 Lincoln LS.jpg

It's small for a V8 RWD car, and apparently handles like a dream - I know it's platform is shared with a Jaguar too. Other than a few quirks in the early years it is supposed to be reliable as well. I would hope so, because I've seen them priced at well over $40,000 new, but I'd be looking at $15-17,000 on a nice used one.

i have an '03 grand am gt atm. the solstices have really caught my eye and im suprised too that only the civic si's are the ones with the new body style for '06.

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Originally Posted by sphere79

I myself was eyeing the Saturn Vue V6, until I found out the engine is made by Honda. I've owned plenty of good GM V6's in my lifetime, if GM is now telling me they can no longer build a V6 for their own vehicles than I'll buy something else.

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If you read reviews you'd learn that that engine is better than any v6 GM would put in there themselves, like the poo in the Equinox. In fact, it's about the only reason to buy a Vue considering it has a Honda engine and costs less than a Honda Pilot. The fact is that Honda makes some of the best engines on the planet.

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Originally Posted by stormy

If you read reviews you'd learn that that engine is better than any v6 GM would put in there themselves, like the poo in the Equinox. In fact, it's about the only reason to buy a Vue considering it has a Honda engine and costs less than a Honda Pilot. The fact is that Honda makes some of the best engines on the planet.

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That doesn't mean GM can't get their shit together and build one of the best engines on the planet either. Hell, they made the 350 V8 which is about as close to perfection a Push-rod v8 has even come, cheap, easy to work on and very adaptable, the 3.8L V6 is another example..

Honda makes good reliable, quiet, low power engines, but generally you have to rev the shit out of them to get any torque. Not to mention when stuff does break, its at a cost of 4-5 time greater most other engine makers.

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Originally Posted by TobalRox

I just got a 2005 Honda Civic Hybrid on Tuesday... replaced my 1995 Honda Civic DX. I was gonna take some pics of it tomorrow to show my family that lives out of state. Will post them here when I get a chance.

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Nice. You know if they made hybrid cars look like this from the start (ie a normal car and not some retarded futuristic design) they would be so much more popular right now.

Never been happier with my WRX!

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Originally Posted by stormy

If you read reviews you'd learn that that engine is better than any v6 GM would put in there themselves, like the poo in the Equinox. In fact, it's about the only reason to buy a Vue considering it has a Honda engine and costs less than a Honda Pilot. The fact is that Honda makes some of the best engines on the planet.

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In the review I read awhile ago the reviewer stated he could "tell" it was a Honda V6 (i.e. he felt it lacked some low-end torque). I'm not saying Honda doesn't make good engine's, but I'm an American - I'd prefer to buy American while I still can, not to mention I've owned excellent GM engine's. It's kind of like with lawnmowers, yea I could buy a Honda-powered one or one with a Briggs and Stratton like I grew up with, and they weren't a problem then so I'd give them another shot. I know most people could care less what they buy nowadays, which is evidenced by the signifigant number of Japanese, South Korean and German makes driving around America with "Support Our Troops", or "God Bless America" ribbons or an American flag on them. How about supporting the economy of the country you live in?! Plus I think the Vue looks nicer than the Pilot, I don't normally like "SUV's" but the Vue is so small I don't think of it as one. I've got an American (Chrysler Corp) 220 HP 3.2 liter V6 now that's a good engine, and the 3.5 liter version is around 250 horses. If Chrysler (rip) can do it, GM can. In fact, there's a new 3.6 GM V6 that produces 250 HP stock and 400 HP turbo, though there isn't much info available about it. Knowing GM nowadays it's probably made in Brazil and a Saab design. That's what's pushing me towards the Lincoln, it's made here and close to 90% US/Canadian sourced.

As for suckers buying those Hybrid fad cars, have fun replacing batteries years from now, and if it's out of warranty you'll be shelling out the $2000-$3000 yourself...........

I get better mileage from my motorcycle and look better doing it too.

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I know most people could care less what they buy nowadays, which is evidenced by the signifigant number of Japanese, South Korean and German makes driving around America with "Support Our Troops", or "God Bless America" ribbons or an American flag on them. How about supporting the economy of the country you live in?!

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How about, dont buy an inferior product for more money when you can get a better (and often more green friendly) foriegn car. Besides, where do you think that Honda or Toyota is made? Chances are in an American factory employing US workers.

As for hybrid battery replacements, if you drive a decent amount there is a huge gas savings which offsets the parts cost. Also I hear many states are giving rebates for hybrid cars? I know Illinois gives money back for biodiesel users.

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Originally Posted by JefmcC

Never been happier with my WRX!

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sex.......pure and simple.

Why does anyone buy a new ford truck? Honestly?

I got a 05 Scion xB a few weeks ago:

http://www.intermediadesign.com/junk/xb/xb1.jpg

Great gas mileage, tons of room and funky design. I love it. So far have only added my MP3 player in it, but I plan on tweaking it out a bit more. Eventually I want to get the center front arm rest, a bug shield (this thing's a serious bug collector), cruise control and a cold air intake. I like that they've made it so easy to customize and modify.

That's my wife's 05 Civic behind it. She had an 03 until recently when she was involved in an accident that totaled it. Fortunately she's OK and it wasn't her fault, so we got the old car completely paid off through insurance.

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Originally Posted by anish

As for hybrid battery replacements, if you drive a decent amount there is a huge gas savings which offsets the parts cost. Also I hear many states are giving rebates for hybrid cars? I know Illinois gives money back for biodiesel users.

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I'm not sure about the new models, but previously a hybrid listed for about $3,000 more than it's normal gasoline counterpart. So the monetary savings on gas didn't actually start until you've been driving it for about 5 years.

I work about 60 miles outside of philly, which makes it tough to have a single good car. I use an alero to get to work, and although it feels like a piece of junk, it has been reliable. it has the 3800 ii v6 in it, which is a solid engine. I am thinking about trying to get a boxster early next year.

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Originally Posted by K3V

Eventually I want to get the center front arm rest, a bug shield (this thing's a serious bug collector), cruise control and a cold air intake. I like that they've made it so easy to customize and modify.

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so you dont get an armrest and that makes it CUSTOMIZABLE? whats next, "optional" wheels and seats?

and yeah its a bug collector....its a moving brick. everything'll splat on it.

im partial to the scion tc's as well.

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Originally Posted by Dragonmaster Dyne

so you dont get an armrest and that makes it CUSTOMIZABLE? whats next, "optional" wheels and seats?

and yeah its a bug collector....its a moving brick. everything'll splat on it.

im partial to the scion tc's as well.

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No, shit like the armrest should have been on the thing to begin with. But having factory options like cold air intakes, strut bars, etc aren't your usual options. Most of it is overpriced from the factory (cup holder illumination for $300? No thanks), but DIY is pretty cheap and easy for most things.

yeah i was going to ask what the price on some of the stuff was.

Some guy on the scionlife forums figured out how to do the cup holder thing for like $10. I had to laugh.

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Originally Posted by anish

How about, dont buy an inferior product for more money when you can get a better (and often more green friendly) foriegn car.

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Let's try - I buy it used and get much more car for the dollar, thanks in part to perceptions like yours. We've been through this before here. You take the same car, throw an "American" badge on it, and a "Japanese" one on another and the car percieved as American will get harsher reviews and have a lower resale value. On the SAME FUCKING CAR. Consumer Reports has been caught a few times doing this. Now, some might be quick to point out that there's a reason for this perception, I believe in many cases (such as above) the perception creates the reality. We know they are the exact same car, but the reviewer judges them not on what actually is in front of him but on what his preconceived idea of that is.

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Originally Posted by anish

Besides, where do you think that Honda or Toyota is made? Chances are in an American factory employing US workers.

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Yes, US workers employed by a foreign corporation - that pays taxes to and holds ultimate allegiance to another country. Think about it - all those taxes on the thousands of new Toyota's, Honda's, Hyundai's, etc sold every year don't go to the US. Not to mention the thousands of dollars in profits from long-term financing. Bottom line - whether it employs US workers or not, increased foreign ownership of US manufacturing is not a good thing for the US. I'm not saying it shouldn't be allowed, or that it's "wrong" to drive a foreign car. It just gets me when Americans want to plaster how patriotic they all over a car made in Mexico by a German corporation.

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Originally Posted by anish

As for hybrid battery replacements, if you drive a decent amount there is a huge gas savings which offsets the parts cost.

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Well, unless they set up an account for you at the dealership where you can pay off the batteries slowly over years, it's still gonna hit the wallet when it's time to replace them.

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Originally Posted by IronPlant

Why does anyone buy a new ford truck? Honestly?

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I don't know, but they are the best selling vehicle 21 years straight in the US, and the best selling truck on the planet, so they must be doing something right I guess.

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Originally Posted by piku

Nice. You know if they made hybrid cars look like this from the start (ie a normal car and not some retarded futuristic design) they would be so much more popular right now.

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Yup, that's why I waited for the Civics to come out... Incite was shit. of course, it's better on mileage, but the power is crap too. Accords are pointless.

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Originally Posted by TobalRox

Yup, that's why I waited for the Civics to come out... Incite was shit. of course, it's better on mileage, but the power is crap too. Accords are pointless.

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the Hybid Accord is acctually faster than the normal v6 version. It's pretty sweet.

Seriously. Its got like what, 235hp? And its a fucking hybrid?

I would look into getting one if I was in the market for a new car. But alas, I am not.

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Originally Posted by sphere79

I don't know, but they are the best selling vehicle 21 years straight in the US, and the best selling truck on the planet, so they must be doing somthing right I guess.

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I have an 86 military blazer that is rated at 23 mpg (that is 3 miles above 99% of every new ford pick up I've ever seen) and it could easily nock the shit out of any new similar sized truck.

Why are people buying these things when the gas mileage has not improved in over a decade?

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Originally Posted by stormy

the Hybid Accord is acctually faster than the normal v6 version. It's pretty sweet.

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Yeah, but I meant gas mileage-wise. It's about the same as my old Civic. So yeah, it's fast, but it's sure as hell not gonna save me any money.

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Originally Posted by TobalRox

Yeah, but I meant gas mileage-wise. It's about the same as my old Civic. So yeah, it's fast, but it's sure as hell not gonna save me any money.

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It's been said here before, but if you actually want to save money buy a diesel. I think that accord hybrid still gets like 30 mpg, whereas the v6 was closer to 20.

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Originally Posted by stormy

It's been said here before, but if you actually want to save money buy a diesel. I think that accord hybrid still gets like 30 mpg, whereas the v6 was closer to 20.

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Well, as I mentioned, I already have the car. I have a real-time mileage meter, and I drive around with AC on all the time and I've been getting about 39-42 mpg on average, depending on where I'm driving to. I love it so far.

Looking into getting a 2002 Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V, which got some of it's styling from the beloved Skyline R34 Spec V.
http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/2816/serspecv8kw.jpg
http://img74.imageshack.us/img74/3508/specvint4bz.jpg
I wouldn't get it in yellow of course, the one I'll be getting is white. Look at those sexy 17 inch wheels and hot and sexy interior. The interior accents on the white ones is in red. The owner before me was even nice enough to put on a GReddy cat-back exhaust and AEM cold air intake. For 9500 bucks, I'm pretty stoked. It's also fully loaded, with the tilt sunroof option, premium Rockford Fosgate audio system, and ABS. I also love that it's a six speed. Here's some specs.

Engine : 4 cylinder, DOHC, front engine FWD
Displacement : 2,498 cc
Valve : 16 valves, 4 valves per cylinder
Transmission : 6-spd manual
Fuel economy : city - 22 mpg
highway - 28 mpg
Horsepower : 175 hp @ 6000 rpm
Torque : 180 lb-ft @ 4000 rpm
Redline : 6200 rpm
Top speed : 135 mph
0-60 mph : 7.2 sec.
0-¼ mile : 15.6 sec @ 90.3 mph
60-0 braking distance : 120 ft
200 ft skidpad : 0.86 g

If all goes well I should have it by Monday. Yippee, I'll have my OWN car again!

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

I wouldn't get it in yellow of course, the one I'll be getting is white. Look at those sexy 17 inch wheels and hot and sexy interior.

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I dunno, looks pretty generic to me. The exterior has some nice subtleties to it, but overall it looks like just about every other Japanese car made in the past 5 years.

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Originally Posted by hugmuffin

I dunno, looks pretty generic to me. The exterior has some nice subtleties to it, but overall it looks like just about every other Japanese car made in the past 5 years.

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I agree that it's not the sportiest looking car out there, and I had seen pictures of it before, but when I saw it on the lot it struck me as being a little sleeker than I remembered. The big points for me are the 2.5 liter 4 cylinder (much stouter than your usual 1.8 or 2.0 liter motors like you see in Civics, Integra's, etc...) and the six speed tranny. I had a 92 Integra before that I had dropped an LS/VTEC into (essentially the same motor as the Type R) and it had about 190 hp, but this car pulled harder when I test drove it, due to the much stouter torque curve because of the larger displacement. I believe my old 'teggy hit its horses at about 7200rpm, versus the 6000 on the spec V.

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

I believe my old 'teggy hit its horses at about 7200rpm, versus the 6000 on the spec V.

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EXACTLY way I hate japanese cars in general. Gutless engines that need to be revved to redline before the ponies show up.

Power should kick in around 3 grand at the latest.. :D

I don't think there are any Nissans I really like. They all just kinda seem....boring.

While its not a new car, I get my Scion xA back in 19 days and I'm fucking excited. It turns out all the damage is fixable. I love insurance companies. I'm making mine pay out the ass at least once every year and a half.

Right now I drive a mid 90's beige automatic Honda Accord. You might as well just shoot me.

I traded in my Scion xB for, of all things, a Hyundai Elantra. Who knew I'd like the Elantra a lot better? After the initial funkyness factor of the xB wears off, you're left with a very underpowered car that is very boring to drive. My new car has 30 more horses, is a lot lower to the ground, has a nice short throw shifter (manual tranny) and feels like a Dodge Viper compared to the xB. Pretty sad when in the end it's just a Hyundai Elantra.

Oh, and since xBs are in huge demand (the dealer here has not had a new one on the lot in months), I got the Elantra for basically nothing. In fact I was essentially paid a couple thousand dollars to drive an xB for 6 months.

I never even considered the xB.

If I was loaded, I'd buy one and use it to go to the grocery store.

I like my xA. Its like a fake sports car, and its small, and it gets sexy gas mileage. Its kind of ugly too. And I get to drive it again soon. Big ups nigga!

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Originally Posted by Wildkat

EXACTLY way I hate japanese cars in general. Gutless engines that need to be revved to redline before the ponies show up.

Power should kick in around 3 grand at the latest.. :D

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The Nissan's QR25DE motor has variable valve timing which, unlike VTEC which kicks in around 4500-5000 rpm, keeps it pulling all the through the powerband. And with the larger displacement over the dinky, high revving 1.7-2.0 liter Honda/Acura VTECs (except for the H22A Prelude motor, at 2.2 liters), the QR25DE is a 2.5 liter, which bumps up the torque 180 ft/lbs, a full 17 lbs more than the even the H22A, which is rated at 220hp @ (eek!) 7200rpm. The Sentra SE-R spec V's QR25DE makes 180 ft/lbs at 4000rpm while the Prelude type S makes 163 ft/lbs @ 6500rpm. Honda's can certainly wind up, but can't pull for shit. I was expecting the spec V's motor to feel much like my old VTEC's, but was pleasantly surprised to feel it pulling from 2k up. When it comes to torque, nothing beats displacement, so I can understand why people like big old V8's. The Viper I think makes around 500hp, but at a whopping 8 liters of displacement! Better get a second job to pay for the insurance, and a third to pay for the gas.

Someday I will learn how to read paragraphs like that.

Probably after my warrenty runs out and I can do stupid rice shit to my car.

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Originally Posted by Josh

I never even considered the xB.

If I was loaded, I'd buy one and use it to go to the grocery store.

I like my xA. Its like a fake sports car, and its small, and it gets sexy gas mileage. Its kind of ugly too. And I get to drive it again soon. Big ups nigga!

---

Yeah, xB's kind of look like yo-boy cars to me. I expect to see everyone driving one to be some yo'd out white boy slumped down in the seat, one hand on the top of the wheel (you know, the "cool guy driver"), hat turned sideways throwing wannabe gang signs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

throwing wannabe gang signs.

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In front of mom's $500,000 house... welcome to Crofton.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

I like my xA. Its like a fake sports car, and its small, and it gets sexy gas mileage.

---

The xA looks awesome when modded properly, such as this

http://members.dslextreme.com/users/...kenstyle01.jpg

Even the best modded xB I've ever seen still basically just looks like stock.

I have no regrets on my purchases of the xB as like I said I actually made a profit on it, but I'll never buy one again or recommend one.

As for waiting your warranty out before modding, you don't have to. The dealer will still honor warranty work as long as its clear the mod isn't the cause of the damage.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hugmuffin

I traded in my Scion xB for, of all things, a Hyundai Elantra. Who knew I'd like the Elantra a lot better? After the initial funkyness factor of the xB wears off, you're left with a very underpowered car that is very boring to drive. My new car has 30 more horses, is a lot lower to the ground, has a nice short throw shifter (manual tranny) and feels like a Dodge Viper compared to the xB. Pretty sad when in the end it's just a Hyundai Elantra.

Oh, and since xBs are in huge demand (the dealer here has not had a new one on the lot in months), I got the Elantra for basically nothing. In fact I was essentially paid a couple thousand dollars to drive an xB for 6 months.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

I like my xA. Its like a fake sports car, and its small, and it gets sexy gas mileage.

---

I've never driven the xB, but due to it's height, and the fact that all that paneling has to weigh it down, I'm willing to bet it's sluggish. I've driven the xA a bunch, and where it lacks in power, it makes up for it by handling pretty damn well. It's like driving a 108hp go-kart, which is pretty fun. Gas mileage is always a plus as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hugmuffin

As for waiting your warranty out before modding, you don't have to. The dealer will still honor warranty work as long as its clear the mod isn't the cause of the damage.

---

I want to swap out my engine. I would like all wheel drive as well as a six speed transmission.

I'm not talking about wheels and rice boy body kits.

Josh you must mod your Scion to look like the one above, that is such a sexy ricer. The xA looks like a tennis shoe, and that one up there looks like a new Nike basketball shoe. Rock.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

I want to swap out my engine. I would like all wheel drive as well as a six speed transmission.

---

And after you've done all that you mine as well have gotten an Impreza WRX or Saab 92-X and had a real car from the getgo :)

You're missing the point.

i read a really great article once that went into depth on how engine torque is meaningless. There are a couple reasons, one of them being that by the time the torque reaches the wheels it can be geared to pretty much apply at any strength you want because it has no time component. It's horsepower that defines how fast a car accelerates because it's the amount of work over time. A car that can do more work over time with everything else equal will always be faster than one that does less, regardless of torgue. It doesn't matter if the HP is generated by torque or RPM (HP = Torque x RPM / 5252). Smaller higher revving engines have the added benefits of being lighter which improves acceleration and handling.

This wasnt the old one i read, but it does address the relationship of torque and hp:
http://www.fjr1300.info/misc/torque-power.html

I don't know about the rest of you, but this is what I want.

http://www.autobytel.com/images/carP...RX8_023_01.jpg

Not to be confused with this, however.

http://www.robot-japan.com/Images2/A...Alternator.jpg

Which is awesome, in it's own right.

The RX-8 is a great car, but after driving and admiring the hell out of 3rd gen RX-7's, I am dissapointed in this car. Why did they have to take an actual sports car and turn it into some quasi-sports car? Functional rear seats? Who needs em.
http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/8...x708med5ug.jpg
Dear Mazda,
What the hell have you done with my beloved RX series? Your rotary motors are beatiful, and the design of your 3rd generation RX-7 was exquisite. Please stop trying to appeal to all the mid-life crisis men out there who still need to be able to carry their kids and groceries around, and bring back the RX series to what it used to be, badass.

Sincerely,
Mykozo.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hugmuffin

And after you've done all that you mine as well have gotten an Impreza WRX or Saab 92-X and had a real car from the getgo :)

---

This approach is not nearly as fun. Vehicle enthusiasts do what they do cause they like to stretch the limits of a vehicle beyond what the manufacturer intended. Although the WRX does rule.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

Dear Mazda,
What the hell have you done with my beloved RX series? Your rotary motors are beatiful, and the design of your 3rd generation RX-7 was exquisite. Please stop trying to appeal to all the mid-life crisis men out there who still need to be able to carry their kids and groceries around, and bring back the RX series to what it used to be, badass.

---

I agree with this. The short period of time that I had a 2nd gen RX7 was fantastic. I'd love to get another one.

In related news:
http://the-nextlevel.com/board/attac...id=16503&stc=1

The crash was so fierce that it actually blurred out the numbers on my licence plate. AMAZING!

You can't see that my drivers side door is bent shut. I had to beat the shit out of it to get out of my car.

What hit your car Josh?

Jesus struck my shit down.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

http://the-nextlevel.com/board/attac...id=16503&stc=1

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Heh, that looks almost exactly like my Toyota Echo after my ex-girlfriend did a great job smashing it up. Her destroying that car is what led me to buying the xB.


And I also agree on RXs, 7s are better than 8s.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mykozo

Yeah, xB's kind of look like yo-boy cars to me. I expect to see everyone driving one to be some yo'd out white boy slumped down in the seat, one hand on the top of the wheel (you know, the "cool guy driver"), hat turned sideways throwing wannabe gang signs.

---

I usually drive around listening to punk rock with my doberman in the back. I sit up pretty straight too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

In front of mom's $500,000 house... welcome to Crofton.

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Then I take it home and park it at the house I own. No gang signs usually.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Josh

In related news:
http://the-nextlevel.com/board/attac...id=16503&stc=1

---

Aww, that sucks. :( My mom has one just like yours. Its a neat little car. What kind of gas milage did you get on yours? My moms gets about 27...which is strange considering my Corolla gets better...and that Scion is so much smaller. Prolly something wrong with hers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stormy

i read a really great article once that went into depth on how engine torque is meaningless.

---

Tell that to someone who wants to tow heavy stuff.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stormy

There are a couple reasons, one of them being that by the time the torque reaches the wheels it can be geared to pretty much apply at any strength you want because it has no time component.

---

In my experience, "modern" engines (i.e. OHC, 4-valve, etc. ) seem designed primarily for economy in mind. Even when horsepower and torque ratings improve with design, I see the peak power rpm's getting higher and higher. This was quite noticable in the 3.7 V6 Jeep Liberty I rented recently, I had to really wind the engine to get any nut out of it. If it had an older 3.9 V6 (based off the 360 V8) it would have had 35 less horsepower and 10 pounds less torque, but peak power at 3200 rpm instead of 5400. I.E. no matter how it's geared - it's got that "throw you in the back of your seat" feeling when you step on it and the newer engine doesn't. You get a few more miles per gallon but for some applications I'd prefer the low-end torque.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stormy

It's horsepower that defines how fast a car accelerates because it's the amount of work over time.

---

Alot of things determine how fast a vehicle accelerates, such as overall power to weight ratio, transmission gearing and efficiency, how it hooks up with the road (suspension setup), etc.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stormy

Smaller higher revving engines have the added benefits of being lighter which improves acceleration and handling.

---

But it's all relative - it's only going to be advantageous if the vehicle is in turn smaller and lighter. Higher revving engines can also have an increased potential for wear, and/or damage done if not kept properly lubricated and maintained. Particularly with bikes (Ducati, etc.) higher rpm engines often mean the manufacturer will recommend an increase in scheduled engine services such as valve adjustments, etc. I'd argue that if anything the old school, push-rod low-end torque way of thinking is going to be quicker off the line, though obviously top-end may be a problem. A bike with low-end torque not only sounds mean but allows for (in my experience) increased control in the turns - it's also easier on the wrist than a high-revving I-4. Sure you're not going to be going 180mph but there aren't many places on my usual route where I could even get up to that speed without risking certain death. I am particularly excited by rumors that Victory motorcycles (owned by Polaris) is looking into to a sport-bike with one of their torque-monster V-twins in it. The combination is unique and very functional.

The bottom line is you really can't adequately illustrate these things with words. It can't be done. And that right there is what gives so many cars, trucks and motorcycles their personality. No review, no spec, nothing on paper can substitute getting in/on and feeling it for yourself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by K3V

I usually drive around listening to punk rock with my doberman in the back. I sit up pretty straight too.

Then I take it home and park it at the house I own. No gang signs usually.

---

Don't get sassy. You have a white boy hip hop car.

I on the other hand drive the same car as a teenage girl.

Accept this, and then you can move on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by perkyskirt

about 27...

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Consistantly over 30. On long stretches of highway it can get close to 40 mpg. Its nice.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

Don't get sassy. You have a white boy hip hop car.

---

That may be the market Toyota intends the brand for, but I see a whole lot of middle-class older types with the occasional hispanic sprinkled in around these parts (15 minutes north from Hartford, CT) driving Scions. The just-a-passing-phase homeboys I do notice are in Honda's, Jetta's, and a bunch of other rides including the ever funny riced-out American FWD compact. "But don't all the stickers on that Cavalier weigh it down"?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sphere79

That may be the market Toyota intends the brand for, but I see a whole lot of middle-class older types with the occasional hispanic sprinkled in around these parts (15 minutes north from Hartford, CT) driving Scions. The just-a-passing-phase homeboys I do notice are in Honda's, Jetta's, and a bunch of other rides including the ever funny riced-out American FWD compact. "But don't all the stickers on that Cavalier weigh it down"?

---

Of course the stickers don't weigh it down, "fake-sponsorhips/letting every nigga in the house know what you'd like to be getting someday" look, along with yellow paint job or accents = MAD TYTE HP YO! Furthermore, I'd never get it, but the Dodge Neon SRT-4 (yes you heard me right, DODGE compact coupe) has been conservitively rated at 215hp, an some mags have actually put the bHP at closer to 260. Why, you ask would a car manufacturer dumb down the HP spec? Easy answer. The car is marketed towards, and attracts lots of younger buyers, and disclosing the HP would drive insurance rates for these drivers though the roof, discouraging sales. Pretty keen if you ask me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

Of course the stickers don't weigh it down, "fake-sponsorhips/letting every nigga in the house know what you'd like to be getting someday" look, along with yellow paint job or accents = MAD TYTE HP YO! .

---

Oh yea, they love the yellow. But remember, yellow is the color of speed. Especially when mixed with a color that really clashes, such as a bright blue or red diagonal stripe across the hood.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mykozo

Furthermore, I'd never get it, but the Dodge Neon SRT-4 (yes you heard me right, DODGE compact coupe) has been conservitively rated at 215hp, an some mags have actually put the bHP at closer to 260.

---

The SRT-4 is actually a bad-ass car, especially considering the price for performance ratio. They've managed to pretty-up the styling a little too, it's a fitting end to the platform imo. The year it came out it was actually (super import-friendly) Sport Compact Car magazine's car of the year, so that's saying something.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Josh

Don't get sassy. You have a white boy hip hop car.

I on the other hand drive the same car as a teenage girl.

Accept this, and then you can move on.

---

I guess I just need to start thumpin' the beats and get it over with then. I have seen quite a wide age-range driving xB's though - I saw one parked in a handicapped spot at Wal-Mart the other day and the back was filled up with bottled water and potted plants. Probably not a white boy hip hopper.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sphere79

"But don't all the stickers on that Cavalier weigh it down"?

---

Stickers are good for at least 10hp.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkyskirt

Aww, that sucks. :( My mom has one just like yours. Its a neat little car. What kind of gas milage did you get on yours? My moms gets about 27...which is strange considering my Corolla gets better...and that Scion is so much smaller. Prolly something wrong with hers.

---

My xB weighed about 300 lbs less than my Elantra, and has 27 less hp, but still got worse gas mileage (also about 27mpg, Elantra's doing about 32mpg). I guess with the xB its not so aerodynamic design really does hurt it.

And it's false that the xB is heavy, it's actually a rather light car, 2395 lbs (my Elantra is 2635 lbs)

Quote:

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Consistantly over 30. On long stretches of highway it can get close to 40 mpg. Its nice.

---

My Echo got 42-45mpg on long freeway trips. West Virginia to New York City on one (tiny) tank of gas. I fucking loved that car.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mykozo

HP YO! Furthermore, I'd never get it, but the Dodge Neon SRT-4 (yes you heard me right, DODGE compact coupe)

---

Its a pretty good car overall, esp, when you factor in the price. Even the Base Neon is a pretty good deal. The SRT-4 has a 2.4 L that has been found to be a pretty stout engine, and the headgaskets in both the 2.4 and 2.0 have been upgraded since '98ish so that issue is no longer common. The 4-speed auto is a true slushbox and the ride is a bit noisy, but otherwise its a pretty decent little beater.

This is the car's last year however, the Caliber drops next year with typical love it or hate it DCX Styling in a psedo-suv station wagonesque package..

http://www.the-nextlevel.com/board/a...id=16508&stc=1


/mopar whore out

Quote:

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Originally Posted by K3V

I guess I just need to start thumpin' the beats and get it over with then. I have seen quite a wide age-range driving xB's though - I saw one parked in a handicapped spot at Wal-Mart the other day and the back was filled up with bottled water and potted plants. Probably not a white boy hip hopper.

---

Pointing these things out doesn't help your cause.

I can point out that I am not a teenage girl, but I still drive an xA.

All the potted plants in the world can't change that.

I know you all laugh at me (and that's okay :D But I am going to slap some Zaino on my recently acquired Honda Odyssey. yah, it is a mini-van but it is NICE! :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kingoffighters

I know you all laugh at me (and that's okay :D But I am going to slap some Zaino on my recently acquired Honda Odyssey. yah, it is a mini-van but it is NICE! :D

---

No shame in driving a mini van. Have anyone who laughs at you drive themself next time you pick up 6-7 people to go somewhere.

Mini vans are quite usefull. Thanks god my mom has a big car affection, its been really helpfull on my occasions, as carrying furniture, tvs, people and all other kinds of stuff, you can do with regular cars, and have to go with paid delivery route.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kingoffighters

I know you all laugh at me (and that's okay :D But I am going to slap some Zaino on my recently acquired Honda Odyssey. yah, it is a mini-van but it is NICE! :D

---

Mini-Van > SUV.

All the space without the ass-raping gas milage. I still can't figure why all these soccer moms go for these super heavy and gas guzzling SUVs when a Mini can do the job better.


Plus: http://www.turbominivan.com/videos/ps_v_z28.rm

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Josh

Pointing these things out doesn't help your cause.

I can point out that I am not a teenage girl, but I still drive an xA.

All the potted plants in the world can't change that.

---

There's no denying that the xB is targeted at a young demographic and they're the ones buying it for the most part, but they're not the ONLY ones driving it.

Kind of like what Toyota tried to do with the Echo but failed miserably at.

I used to carry my lunch to school in a GI JOE xB.

I think I had a Transformers lunchbox.

Mission accomplished. Got the dealer down to 9500, and got financing through USAA @ 4.99% fixed so I shall be picking up my new Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V tommorow morning @ 9 am. Woohoo. I also got a great insurance rate, 90 bucks a month, which I thought would be alot more for that car. USAA rocks!

I drive a 95 civic ex. Its like a metallic blue, its actually I think proven to be the most boring car, ever.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by K3V

Kind of like what Toyota tried to do with the Echo but failed miserably at.

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What was Toyota trying to do with the Echo? I think they were shooting for "new car around $10k that isn't as miserable as the Hyundai Accent" and considering the price point they were working with that's about all they were shooting for.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hugmuffin

What was Toyota trying to do with the Echo? I think they were shooting for "new car around $10k that isn't as miserable as the Hyundai Accent" and considering the price point they were working with that's about all they were shooting for.

---

They were aiming it at a youth market but kids all thought it was fugly so none of them bought it and they couldn't figure out how to market it. The Scion brand was take 2, and they're doing a lot better with it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by K3V

They were aiming it at a youth market but kids all thought it was fugly so none of them bought it and they couldn't figure out how to market it. The Scion brand was take 2, and they're doing a lot better with it.

---

Yeah, the Echo did about as well as the Pontiac Vibe. Is Pontiac still making cars?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mykozo

Yeah, the Echo did about as well as the Pontiac Vibe.

---

Funny, as the Vibe might as well be a Toyota too. Both the Pontiac Vibe and Toyota Matrix are assembled in a jointly owned Toyota/GM plant and are heavily sourced from Toyota's parts bins, with minor styling cues differentiating the two.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mykozo

Is Pontiac still making cars?

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Yes, for now. But the new "G6", despite some good reviews and not butt-ugly styling isn't selling for crap. Plus I hear in Canada a few Pontiac models are now badge-engineered Daewoo's, so the nameplate may end up retired sooner than later.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sphere79

Yes, for now. But the new "G6", despite some good reviews and not butt-ugly styling isn't selling for crap. Plus I hear in Canada a few Pontiac models are now badge-engineered Daewoo's, so the nameplate may end up retired sooner than later.

---

Lol, I knew Pontiac was still making cars, I just haven't seen a new one on the road in a long time. I was just commenting on the fact that when someone goes out looking for new cars, the name Pontiac probably never crosses their mind. :) Smart move by Pontiac to rebadge under a different manufacturer. At least Daewoo is selling to the extra-low price point market, whereas who knows what the fuck Pontiac is doing. I can't tell you what there doing, but I do know one thing they aren't doing, and that's selling cars.

Got my car today, and I love it. Will post pics.

It's a shame. I think Pontiac has made huge strides in the past few years. Pontiacs used to be plasticy, cheesy and downright ugly. Recent Grand Am, Grand Prix and the G6 models are significantly sleaker and sophisticated looking. The Vibe also looks better than the Matrix.

I'm considering a GTO for my next car, but i wish it were still badged a Holden or anything other than Pontiac. I think i'm going to end up dropping it off the list because of the dumbasses that drive it. I tried to read a GTO forum one day and i couldn't take it for more than 10 minutes. If that's the kind of red neck assholery that car attracts i want no part of it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mykozo

Got my car today, and I love it. Will post pics.

---

Viva NAFTA!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hugmuffin

I think Pontiac has made huge strides in the past few years. Pontiacs used to be plasticy, cheesy and downright ugly.

---

It was one of the first things Bob Lutz did over at GM - listen to the consumers and GET RID OF THE PLASTIC CLADDING.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stormy

If that's the kind of red neck assholery that car attracts i want no part of it.

---

The past few years Pontiac (in the states anyway) has been heavily marketed to black folks, i.e. black family in the commercial, black narrators in commercials, etc. Maybe not all their commercials but a bunch none the less. Kind of like when Subaru was openly marketing to gay women a few years back - that definately worked judging by the sheer amount of them I see around here with rainbow stickers and other assorted "pride" paraphernalia. Funny how cars get targeted to one group and then sometimes bought by another.

But if you have a thing for the GTO, test it and like it I say f**k who else drives one, you know?

Just don't be gay and get an Outback.

I kid, I kid.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stormy

I'm considering a GTO for my next car, but i wish it were still badged a Holden or anything other than Pontiac. I think i'm going to end up dropping it off the list because of the dumbasses that drive it. I tried to read a GTO forum one day and i couldn't take it for more than 10 minutes. If that's the kind of red neck assholery that car attracts i want no part of it.

---

You can get the Monaro front end shipped over, and greatly improve the looks, its expensive, but if I had the car and the cash, Id do it in a second.

http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring...n-monaro-1.JPG

vs

http://www.newsargus.com/jims-cars/p...tiacGTO-04.jpg

i still want to get an actual ram air hood for my 2004 grand am gt. the scoops look mighty nice.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wildkat

You can get the Monaro front end shipped over, and greatly improve the looks, its expensive, but if I had the car and the cash, Id do it in a second.

---

I was told becacuse of the changes made to meet american safety standards that a Monaro bumper would n longer fit. I'm not sure if my friend knew this for a fact though or was just assuming. I know that's the case with many Japanese cars. The new Subaru Legacy is another casualty of ugly american bumbers. I'm considering that car too.

I think judging any car by its respective "official" forum is a pretty far fetched reason not to get it. I don't know if I've ever been to an official car forum where 90% of the people there weren't complete douches. The GTO is one of the biggest bangs for your buck in that pricepoint, period. RWD... subtle lines (if you like that)... LS2... nice interior... 6-speed... did I mention LS2? The new price point is a bit higher than last year's I think, but I guess the extra horsies make up for it.

My first search on autotrader found quite a few '04's for less than $23k with less than 10k miles. That's insane.