Racism against whites

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Originally Posted by IronPlant

I'm not going to bother reading sphere79 post. Its long and I imagine dumb. Also I doubt any of the points he is trying to make matter.

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How is it "dumb", exactly - other than I am likely wasting my time attempting to articulate what (to me) is blatantly obvious to people who have made their minds up and won't even read it.

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Originally Posted by IronPlant

But I guess the trick is if white people as a group can be intelligent and debate rationally with out being emotional and hateful.

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Yes, cause it's only white groups that are "hateful". I think the trick is really whether the national media would even ackowledge a group of white people as anything other than a kkk rally.

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Originally Posted by IronPlant

Having said that, the genetics argument doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if so and so DNA is different or not. For the best society, everyone needs an equal chance to do what they want in life regardless if people are or are not the same, worse, better, whatever. Maybe women are in fact weaker and stupider. But if the one exception can cure cancer, the system should be set up so that she has very little resistance in doing so. The same goes for minorities. Maybe they are better, maybe they are worse, whatever, it doesn't matter, they should be able to at least try to achieve what they want in life. Their successes are good for the country as a whole.

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I never said people shouldn't be afforded equal opportunities, I believe they should. However, Federally mandating private businesses (actually make that "white" businesses) racial makeup is wrong. Also wrong is the welfare state, and the encouraged "support me mommy government" attitude held by some poor folks that only creates a cycle of dependance and poverty.

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Originally Posted by IronPlant

And that is why we need groups looking out for minorities. White people are currently the majority so they don't really need organized groups to make sure they get a part of the pie. Minorities can't always say that.

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Why, because evil whitey is "holding him down"? I am sick of this attitude, I work with many minorities and we all get paid to do the same work, we all pay the same taxes. So maybe, yes they'll get some looks or comments in the "uppity" part of town (so will I), there are areas I know I can't go into without getting shit/being threatened/or getting attacked. Just because my skin is a certain color doesn't mean I get to skate through life, I work for what I have and have earned every bit of it. White people are a shrinking majority, are you claiming at some point in the future when thresholds cross then whites should be allowed to have a group interest?

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Originally Posted by IronPlant

Oh and sphere, quit talking to gozen. He is a hateful little bastard that lives to bate you and anyone else that will react to his hateful horseshit.

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Wait, I thought I was the hateful one posting the "dumb" stuff you don't bother to read?

Yes I get worked up about this stuff, I get worked up about alot of things (including small electronics) and rant about them. I don't believe that I have been hateful or said anything wrong perse. I am attempting to have a discussion about an admittedly taboo subject in an intelligent manner. I have continually asked questions to which I've had no direct reply, and been labeled many things for simply daring to speak honestly on this subject.

Anyway, I am officially done with this subject at TNL.

Whether or not race exists is a depends on how you define it.

There is no biological basis for race, as there are no clearly defined boundaries between them.
Distinct groups only exist in regions where cultural, political, geographical, or migratory factors create segregation.

The majority of Americans descend from only a handful of far-flung nations, so we don't see the full gamut of skin colors and features that exists in our ancestral regions.

It you were to look at native people in the Americas, you could see them as several distinct races, but in order to do that, you'd have to ignore the gradual change in human features which occurs over a great span of distance.
Where you draw the line between Inuit and 'Indian', for example, is arbitrary and therefore has no biological significance.

The same could be said in Asia, where there is no clear boundary between 'brown' people and 'orientals,' or anywhere alse on earth for that matter.
Just because many of these 'in-between' or 'fringe' races (and I cringe to think that there are people that actually see these people as such) are not represented as much in ouur population, that doesn't mean that they don't exist.

Of course there are areas where neigboring peoples have become distinct from one another, but they share a common lineage, and aren't descended from seperate 'races.'

It should be clear to any reasonable person that segregation, whether institutional or cultural, is not only a result of racism, but also its primary cause.
It is, afterall, what creates the illusion of race to begin with.

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Originally Posted by sphere79

Why, because evil whitey is "holding him down"?

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No, not because he is being held down, but because his grandparents were. Like it or not but a lot of black people's ancestors were put quite a few steps behind in life when compared to everyone else. It is our duty as human beings to want to even that out a little bit. No, I don't necessarily agree with how we currently do it, and I doubt anyone on this board will argue with you that the welfare system is bullshit, but things need to be in place to give people whom have been slighted a little extra help.

Otherwise the types of racism that is brought on by culturism and classism are only going to continue and perhaps get worse. It is easy to accuse one group of being naturally stupid and worthless if they have shitty schools and their community is broken. People under those circumstances are going to naturally do the things that racist like the KKK accuse them of being because of their skin color.

A better discussion would be at what point do we stop helping. What things are our responsibility to fix and what are not and at what point do we stop all help. Personally I think everything should be done that can be done to improve education and improve the home life of people whom have families that have been hurt in the past. That way those who want to be helped are helped, and people who are lazy get what they deserve.

I imagine you probably don’t think that’s fair. But you don’t seem to be taking into account that a lot of people are born into a shitty life with very few opportunities because of things our society made and let happen.