No, it's shut the fuck up.Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuraiMoogle
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No, it's shut the fuck up.Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuraiMoogle
Damn, calm down fanboy.
Wait, those other Genesis games were supposed to come out today, too.
I call tomfoolery of blasphemous proportions.
^_^// Finchikinsu ai desu, Samumu!Quote:
Damn, calm down fanboy.
Woo! Point for hostility! I should really have about five hundred of those by now. I'm hostile all the time.
Wasn't all stuff on the Genesis Collection anyway? I hope there'll be more games that i can't already get for cheaps in prog scan.Quote:
Wait, those other Genesis games were supposed to come out today, too.
I call tomfoolery of blasphemous proportions.
I said that before. I bought that collection because of you... :(
I love all the pissing and moaning in this thread. *-neo
Fixed.Quote:
Originally Posted by neoalphazero
I... bought it because of you! (okay, Phantasy Star IV) You don't like it? PSIV and Dynamite Headdy were the only Genesis games i ever liked, though i appreciate Sonic 2 and Ecco more now that i'm not being forced to play them.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaoofNee
Forced? At gunpoint?Quote:
Originally Posted by Finch
No, by a kid who lived across the street who would never leave me alone. We were friends, but man, i just don't want to come over and play every day. He had a Genesis.
You sure he only wanted to play with your Ecco?Quote:
Originally Posted by Finch
... yeah.
So Zelda. It's weird coming back to this game 14 years later and finding a bunch of the songs they use now are from this one. It's also more generic 16-bit a-rpg'ish than i remember.
Zelda was a fun game. When I played it on GBA, I got bored of it halfway through. I mean, yeah it was great, but I just can't see myself playing it a THIRD time (of course, there are people who play it many more times than that).
I can't ever bring myself to finish a Zelda game more than once. Link's Awakening was the only one, and as many times as i've tried to play it again, i just get so sick of it.
It's been so long since i've played Link to the Past, though, and i only played through it one time. It's practically a new game for me.
I remember getting stuck in LTTP back on SNES.... never played it again. I will try again someday on GBA, that's about it.
Still waiting for a reason to open my Classic Controller.
Pssst! Pretty much every Genesis game ever made is already in progressive scan. For cheaps, no less. Y'know...on the original Genesis....Quote:
Originally Posted by Finch
Fuck the Genesis.
The Genesis outputs in component at 480p? Since when?Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
The Genesis outputs in 240p.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shin Johnpv
So does my asshole.
I don't see component or VGA outputs on any of my Genesis. Which means the signal thats coming along the RF or Composite lines is not p but i. Genesis games downloaded on VC go to your TV through a component signal that is indeed p and 480.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
RF and composite can do 240p no problem. Just look at the screen. No interlace flicker at all. Dot-crawl and color bleed, yes. Interlace flicker, no. NES, SNES, NeoGeo, SMS, Genesis, TG-16 etc... all progressive scan.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shin Johnpv
link please.
Damn it, I ain't gonna' be bothered to look up a link, but use simple logic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh
SD TVs scan at one single speed. The gun draws 240 lines with each pass. That's it. The console/dvd player/whatever doesn't change that. "High res" stuff like DVDs and PS2 need 480 lines so the gun interlaces by drawing half of the lines on each pass.
Take a look at any 8 or 16 bit game. Do you see anything even close to 480 horizontal lines? No. The gun draws every single line used by the game in a single pass. Hence, progressive scan.
Look up each system's horizontal resolution. They're not all 240 lines, but they're in the ball park. Systems that use less than 240 horizontal lines just draw blank lines at the top and bottom, but you never see them since all SD TVs overscan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
it's almost 3 am here and I've been up since 7 am so my brain isn't working fully right but it's screaming to me that that isn't right. I can't figure out the details of it right now but it's not right. A standard def tv regardless of the resolution it's getting is still doing 2 passes one for the even fields and one for the odd fields, I highly doubt that old systems are putting all of their lines of image on one field because then you would end up with this image black image black image black, and that would be bad.
That's exactly what you get. Hence the infamous black scan lines. You don't notice it on a small screen or from a distance, but get up close to a 30 inch SD screen and that's what you'll see. Image black image black image black.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shin Johnpv
Recap would love it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shin Johnpv
i got LttP just for the hell of it, i was suprised how much i remembered from the game. I also didnt notice till midway that i was playing the game with the joystick, not d-pad.
I still want OoT, but i also just remembered i want mario party 1 and 2, cause those were the only good ones.
Then i want Genesis games to look good on my television.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
Playing Link to the Past is opening up all these forgotten memories for me. I remember being so surprised at the quest just starting where it originally appeared to end. I remember how great it was to be able to swim and dive, and find all sorts of hidden crannies. Everything Zelda did, Zelda 3 did so much better. The sense of exploration was phenomenal and everything you found was actually useful.
Me too. The analog stick just feels right.Quote:
Originally Posted by RDM Brian
That's the most offensive thing you've ever said.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh
240poop?Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh
To me the classic controller seems unnecessary if you have a Wavebird. Am I wrong?Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Yes. The GameCube's button layout is god awful.Quote:
Originally Posted by K3V
True enough, but I'd rather use my Wavebird than spend $20 on yet another controller that I will use only rarely for VC games.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
If you're going to play VC games the Classic Controller is the most fun way to do so, but the only VC games I play are TG-16 (which work just fine with the Wii Remote held NES-style). For Wii/Cube games the CC is useless so far; if only I could use the CC on XBLA.....Quote:
Originally Posted by K3V
Can you use CC to play GC games?
Yeah, I've only bought Alien Crush so far and the Wii remote sideways is perfect for it.
The Classic Controller sucks for TG16 and N64 games. No customizable layout = using B and A. For christ's sake, they're not even in the right place for the layout to even come close to making sense for N64 games. It's really uncomfortable, and I will use the GC pad forever over doing that. I want to use Y and B. There's no reason that I shouldn't be able to do that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
It's great for SNES, Genesis, and shooters where only one button is really important. It should be great for everything. Jerks.
Edit: I don't have any NES VC games. Does Y = B there? On TG16, Y and X are the II and I buttons with turbo on.
Nope, just VC games and the crappy Dragonball Z Wii game. It's torture having a perfect controller and no games to use it with. If it wasn't for Super Smash Bros. Brawl I'd just sell it.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingoffighters
Thanks for saving me $20. Last thing I need is another controller.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Why would anyone want to play an N64 game anyway. They should have just called the VC 16-bit deja vu instead. That's where 90% of the retro goodness lies. Hell, if they got Neo Geo rights, that would move to 95% or more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grave
Only 2 games I want to play for N64: Beetle Adventure Racing and Tetrisphere. BAR is still great but I can live without, but Tetrisphere, it is different enough as a puzzle game that there isn't anything quite like it so I would like to have it as my first VC game (then I can get rid of my N64 altogether).
BAR will never come out, because the license has likely expired, so you're down to one.
Yah I figure as much. Tetrisphere would be awesome though. It will never happen, Nintendo hates me.
Why would anyone buy the Classic Controller when the GC controller works just as well?
Seriously, please explain why so many of you are dumb like this.
In a purely fictional world where I'm cool with being raped by Virtual Console, I would use the Wiimote to play NES, TG16 and some Genesis games and my Hori GBASP pad for SNES and other Genesis games. Everything sucks for N64 games, but there's none worth playing around anyway.
Personal attack!! I am giving you a warning, otherwise I will report you to yourself so you can give yourself a warning! :D :sweat:Quote:
Originally Posted by burgundy
I would but it was an impersonal attack, actually.
That doesn't seem right, I would need to ask the guys over at the gamesx.com forums about the engineering behind that. They would have to program the output chips to send the an image sequence only at a specific time to make that happen. I don't know something just seems incredibly wrong with this and your supposed 240p (which isn't even a supported resolution format for televisions) still is not the same as 480p.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
That's with out going into all the color bleeding and dot crawl that you get on a genesis or any older piece of hardware, where they top out at composite output.
Couldn't you try to be a little bit more personal, people might like you more then, not that they don't now but it's good to be personal.Quote:
Originally Posted by burgundy
Then I'd be breaking the rules.
Exactly, what good does impersonal attacks do? I don't feel a thing.
It makes me seem harsh and thus cool without actually hurting anyone's feelings. Win-win.
Not true. The Genesis outputs a beautiful RGB signal, if you have the right (hacked) cables.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shin Johnpv
Mario Kart 64 next week. Two high profile releases in a row, I could get used to this.
From Kotaku:
Quote:
With yesterday's Virtual Console release of The Legend of Zelda: A
Link to the Past from the NES(R), the library of downloadable Wii titles grows
to 42. Also, next week will see the addition of an all-time favorite, Mario
Kart 64.
The standard GC pad is great for Super Mario 64, but that's about it. The button layout is miserable for SNES on the GC pad, and the d-pad is shit and I wouldn't want to use the analog stick. Plus not everybody was dumb enough to have bought that Hori pad.Quote:
Originally Posted by burgundy
The Classic Controller is excellent in design. Good d-pad, great button layout... bad button mapping in-game. That's the only problem.
Not online, don't care.Quote:
Originally Posted by TrialSword
This is the first time I've seen anyone that wasn't me talk about BAR, I think I'll bust out my N64 and play that later.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingoffighters
Other N64 games that should be on the VC:
Ogre Battle 64
Blast Corps
Jet Force Gemini
Doom 64
Castlevania: LoD
Rush 2049
Banjo 1 & 2
Body Harvest
Pokemon Puzzle League
Yoshi's Story
Goemon's Great Adventure
Bangaioh
Sin & Punishment
Mischief Makers
Rogue Squadron
No Mercy
Starfox 64
PilotWings 64
Mortal Kombat Trilogy
Excitebike 64
F-Zero X
Kirby Crystal Shards
Paper Mario
NeverQuote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Gonna
Happen
Bangaio won't but I think there's a slight chance we'll get Sin & Punishment if VC sales ever slow down.
There is quite a bit of padding that list, really now castlevania and rogue squadron in 2007? Can't argue with doom 64 or kirby though.
More analyses from Glamour magazine?Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Seriously.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nash
Get it in your heads already.
Nintendo doesn't give a fuck about you, and there's no chance in hell of S&P ever making it out here.
Castlevania LoD is still the only worthwhile 3D Castlevania and Rogue Squadron was the best N64 Star Wars game. Both would sell well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sega saturn x
Bbobb: why do you and Dog$ have this notion that Nintendo would only release S&P in America if they "cared" about us? It's a top notch game that 99.9% of American gamers never played, they might release it someday because they love money. The TG-16 sales have proven that people want games they haven't already played to death.
Come on now, I'm a huge fan of both franchises and both of those games have aged like boxed wine. Well castlevania 64 was never good, but rogue squadron just isn't worth how ugly it is. The draw distance just isn't tolerable, especially with two far better games out for years now.Quote:
Castlevania LoD is still the only worthwhile 3D Castlevania and Rogue Squadron was the best N64 Star Wars game. Both would sell well
Because S&P never came out in the US. There's no US game they can quickly throw into ROM form and send out. S&P would actually take a little bit of effort, and considering that Nintendo isn't even willing to put the effort into adding online play, what makes you think they'd release S&P?Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Becuase it will make a lot of money. Isn't that what the company tries to do?Quote:
Originally Posted by bbobb
Your logic goes against the actions of a comapmny that prides itself on making immediate cash. They will release Sin and Punksihment in the U.S. It's only a matter of time. I'm sorry if that offends you.
Just because the 15 or so hardcore gamers who own a Wii want the game does not mean it will make a lot of money.Quote:
Originally Posted by avatar
Castlevania 64 sucked ass, I'm talking about LoD.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sega saturn x
Because mainsteam gamers were clamoring to play TG-16 games before the Wii came out, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by bbobb
....Quote:
Originally Posted by bbobb
Okay so you really don't have an argument, and you have no idea if Sin&Punishment is off-limits to NOA.
Both were bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Wasn't Sin and Punishment like 99% translated before they decided to not release it in the US, I could have sworn I read that.
Shins right, they both sucked equally hard.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
It is.
The original game has English voice acting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shin Johnpv
...and you know for a fact that it isn't?Quote:
Originally Posted by avatar
Take a look at what's been released on the VC and what's coming down the pike. How many import titles do you see? Has Nintendo ever even mentioned the possibility? I know it would be great if they did release S&P here, but it seems more like a pipe dream at the moment.
Nintendo might change its policy though. Remember when it said no one wanted to play online? Now it....ah wait, never mind.
NOA and treasure have both mentioned Sin and Punishment being on the VC for all the regions. I don't have the link, but I do remember that.
No they didn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by avatar
The game would suck without the N64 controller too.
No they have not. There has been mention of it probably being on VC in Japan, but that's it. The game has English voice yes. But there's still a lot of text that needs to be translated before it would be released. Nintendo is not making the effort to translate shit. The only things they're putting up on VC is shit that they can quickly make a rom of and put up. Once again, they won't even put in the effort to add online play, why would they go through the effort of translating something?Quote:
Originally Posted by avatar
Also it's worth mentioning that NOE has stated that Super Mario RPG will not be released on Euro VC BECAUSE it was never released in Europe. And that games already translated and good to go. Nintendo is only releasing games which have been previously released in each region.
Nintendo hates you all so much.
As an aside, does anyone know how well the more obscure VC games are selling? All I hear is anecdotal evidence along the lines of "Lots of grandmas are lining up to buy the Wii for themselves".
Implementing and supporting online play for a game = translating a few lines of text from one language to another, awesome point.Quote:
Originally Posted by bbobb
If they won't do the one thing that lots and lots of people really want, then why would they go through the effort of translating a game that only a few people really want?Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
My point is Nintendo doesn't really give a fuck about you or what you want. They're just throwing whatever shit they can quickly and easily put up (albeit only giving you little niblets at a time) on VC to make a cheap buck. If it would require any level of effort to put it up then they won't be doing it.
You have a source or a link that proves that a very small minority want S&P on the VC?
I still don't see any reason why someone would 100% believe S&P will never hit the VC, unless they purposely don't want it there so they can bitch.
No one knows what S&P is. I don't need a link to know this.
Do you have a source or link that proves more than a handful of people in the U.S. care about S&P, or even know what the hell it is?Quote:
Originally Posted by avatar
Virtual Console is Nintendo's way of making easy money, man. They're not going to add extra options to games, nor are they going to bring over imports. This isn't pessimism, it's being realistic.
I would kill for either to hit the VC, just to have another excuse to play them AGAIN.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sega saturn x
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1up.com interview with Treasure
Spo list padding +10Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoDaddy
Kaneda, that link mentions nothing of a multi-regional release.
Yea they don't mention if that means outside of Japan, but people were saying they heard Treasure saying this and that about SnP so I thought I'd post what they actually said about it. I don't own a Wii and already have SnP so I couldn't give a shit.
The guy conducting the interview works for an American gaming website. Either way it doesn't mean shit but it's still a better argument than "Nintendo hates us and money." If an English ROM isn't already available, it would take two guys a day to translate the menus into English because the rest of the game is in English.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
Here's what I think: Out of territory games probably aren't being released here because many of them were never rated and Nintendo doesn't want to bother or risk crossing the ESRB.
I don't remember how violent S&P was, or if it had any questionable content (which I doubt), but Burg brings up an excellent point. Nintendo might not want to go through the ratings game for its back catalogue, and this simple and stupid detail could keep a lot of good games from coming to the VC.
Remember, Sega left Streets of Rage off the Sega Genesis Collection in order to maintain a teen rating. How Golden Axe could be considered less violent is beyond me, but the ESRB fear was enough to keep three of the most popular Genesis titles of all time from being re-released (they were also left off the domestic Sonic collection, but were added in Japan). I can imagine what it would mean for a domestic S&P one.
It's probably a good assumption of that VC list that the guy from Treasure mentions Nintendo having it on was probably a list sent out by NoJ, listing the games it plans to release on VC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaneda
NoA never said they planned to release it here, ever.
The ESRB didn't exist during the NES or early 16-bit days, so that argument doesn't hold water.Quote:
Originally Posted by Melf
That doesn't matter. If it's released now, it has to be rated. Why do you think all the 20 year-old retro collections you see have ratings?
The ESRB (or even the VRC) didn't exist in 1991, yet ratings were enough to keep Streets of Rage from being re-released twice in the U.S last year. How this applies to the VC remains to be seen, as I don't know if any of the games you download have a visible rating of some kind; however, anything sold today at retail does, regardless of when it was originally released.
EDIT- Apparantly, not only do the VC games have ratings, but they have to be submitted to the ESRB before they can go up for download.
From IGN:
Here's the official ESRB list of all the Wii games rated, including TG-16 and NES games.Quote:
November 7, 2006 - The Entertainment Software Ratings Board's official website has approved, rated and consequently listed eight more titles that will be showing up on a Wii Virtual Console near you in the not-too-distant future. The games are naturally all classics and from very recognizable franchises. In the interest in saving you time, we've listed the titles and their ratings below:Nintendo itself has not officially announced these games for the Wii's Virtual Console, but the ESRB is a reliable source because the Big N has to submit its games to the Board for approval in advance. In other words, the ESRB got this list from Nintendo of America.
- Duck Hunt (E for Everyone)
- Hogan's Alley (E for Everyone)
- Kid Icarus (E for Everyone)
- Kirby's Adventure (E for Everyone)
- Pilot Wings (E for Everyone)
- Pro Wrestling (E for Everyone)
- Punch-Out (E for Everyone)
- Wild Gunman (E for Everyone)
NOA executives continue to state that approximately 30 Virtual Console games will be available between the Wii's launch in November and the end of December. Another 10 titles will be released every month beginning in January.
It's quite possible that games previously released here can be tagged NR but stuff that is coming out here for the first time (or altered) can't be. Or that for whatever reason Nintendo doesn't want to do that. I think it's a silly justification but it's possible nonetheless.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
How does Live Arcade handle ratings?
Edit - Melf just undermined my argument. Doesn't look like ratings are the reason overseas stuff isn't making it so I'll go back to "Nintendo hates us and money."
Also, how do third parties and Nintendo interact when it comes to VC content? If Treasure translates and cleans up S&P and hands it to NoA, it's gonna go "Didn't come out here nope nope nope?" Can anyone explain why?
I don't think they would do that. I'm sure if treasure handed them S&P in VC rom form and said we did everything that was needed to translate this completely into english (IE change the few menus in the game, which I could have sworn was already done before they changed their mind at the last second to not release it here) and it's ready to be put on VC. Nintendo would say thank you for giving us another easy way to make money. I highly doubt they're going to turn away something like that. Simply because it's less work that they have to do and more money to be made.Quote:
Originally Posted by burgundy
here's a dumb question.
Has Nintendo mentioned anything about how Expansion pak support will be handled?
Like for the games that had the option of using it, you usually got better graphics, but fewer frames per second. Are you going to be able to chose which version you want to play or can their emulator give the best of both worlds?