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and the christians got pissed.
catholics pissed, confirmed.
cause on page 516 chapter seven, section three, sub paragraph ninteen, it clearly states: (ahem)
THAR SHAL BE NOE SPACE MONSTERS ON NO OTHER PLANEST CASUE THERE BE HEATHENS. SPAYCE PEOPESL DONT NEVER EXISTS. AND YOU ARE A HEATHEN.
You forgot the end. YOU R NOT WORTHIEY OF JESUS, CLENZE URSELF WITH HOLY WATER AND SAY 4 HELL MARYIS!Quote:
Originally Posted by Gymkata
No thats page 517. Imean the bible doesn't say that iswhatimtryintosay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Biff_Pocoroba
OR does it!?
Biblical views on aliens are important! I looked that up mostly out of curiousity, as I remembered a guy who would always say that aliens were actually spiritual demons; I'm sure someone else has a site that says the bible is ok with aliens and has a few stories about how Jesus would occasionally drink wine with some of them who hid out on earth while they were running from the space-police.
I wanna go.
It's "M-class planet," noob. ;)Quote:
Earthlike planet
Ok Star Trek.
You know, until Stibbons pointed it out, I didn't mind that smiley, in fact, I liked it. But at the end of that post I wanted to punch you.
Seriously, who's naming these planets and when can they be fired?
This is the coolest news ever.
I saw this earlier, my dreams of galactic warfare have reached a new level.
Need additional pylons imo
First off: Very awesome discovery.
But more to the point: I love how all of these articles say shit like "Too hot to sustain life" or too cold or no water or blah blah blah. Why the hell are we assuming that all life has to be anything even remotely like us? I would no more surprised if life was found on a waterless 2000 degree inferno of a planet than I would if life was found on "Earth 2".
For reals.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas
Planet Zodmord >>>> Gliese 581c
Reminds me of Strain 121. They love boiling water.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
Agreed. The new Planet Earth episode about caves had fish that thrived in pools of sulphuric acid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
Yeah, and that's on this planet no less.Quote:
Originally Posted by Super-Eggroll
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
It probably has to do with the conditions necessary for basic monocellular lifeforms to come into being in the place, which are pretty specific IIRC.
Right. The basic molecular life forms that formed Earth's life building blocks probably needs some pretty specific conditions.Quote:
Originally Posted by LordPerrin
Seems silly to assume that is the only way to get life started is all I'm saying.
http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/...spacealien.jpg
This will be on Fox news tonight....
Cheebs, I totally agree. Silicon-based lifeforms, oh my God!Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
I would have named it PHOBOS 47. :chunobi:
LV-428 imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Giga Power
LV-428 is the name that came with one of the computers in the office I Work at.
:lol: This news is really cool. :)
Good point. But usually when "life" is used in this context, it means "life as we know it." Earth-like life is the only reference point we have, so because we're not capable of analyzing every planet we find for life that may be so unlike what we believe life to be that we may not recognize it. So at this point it certainly makes sense to focus the search for "life" on environments that most closely resemble the only place we know for sure life exists.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
There are bacteria and other single celled organisms that survive in some of the harshest conditions on Earth...inside volcanos, beneath ice sheets, deep underground or underwater. But these organisms aren't able to become more complex, because it's their simplicity that enables them to survive these conditions. Same would hold true for these harsh planets...sure, maybe there's some bacteria or something, and while finding them would be a watershed moment, what we're really looking for is sentient life. And without anything else to do go on...it's just more likely to be found on a planet like ours.
Andromeda strain imo.
At least now we may have somewhere to go when we finally turn our planet into a complete wasteland.
Shit, if we leave now in the current space shuttle we should arrive in roughly 750,000 earth years.
I wouldn't get my space dick ready just yet. Cool news though.Quote:
The Earth-like planet that could be covered in oceans and may support life is 20.5 light years away, and has the right temperature to allow liquid water on its surface.
It probably has a substantial atmosphere and may be covered with large amounts of water - necessary for life to evolve - and, most importantly, temperatures are very similar to those on our world.
I was talking to my friend about this, he loves all sort of space stuff. He was talking about sending a radio signal, it'd take about 35 years there and if they respond 35 years to get back, so if there was scientific life there, it'd be possible in 70 years if we sent something now to verify.
But since we know the location you can also use infrared which would take 20 years there, and 20 years back if they have some ability to recieve it.
Well unless they find out a way to actually get there, not in like 600 years of travelling through space, then I guess we are stuck here anyways
Well most of you have to understand here, its not so much whether or not it has life or water or not. It is the first evidence of planet around a different type of sun than ours that managed to find its way into the sweet spot.
The big news here is the unspoken news, that if there's another planet very much like earth, then there are probably millions of planets very much like earth, which pretty much ends that as an argument skeptics have used about our conditions for life being entirely unique in the known universe.
Well to those concerned with ow they act like we can't have life on different sets of planets, this isn't a scientific article. This is just some group making the article so they are filled with what is science news but besides the news and word for word itself, they don't know shit.
To search for life and extraterrestrial intelligence I think we must more clearly define what constitutes life and intelligence.
Life- It breathes, moves and communicates to others.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracer
Intelligence- It thinks farts are funny.
I think those are the basic qualifiers.
Word. It's kind of sad when you think about it. We can't even get past our own moon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Valgar
I'd grant that those are sure signs, but I suppose there's room for speculation on some kind of life form that neither respire or communicate (more so the latter). Also, movement is weird, I suppose growing is like moving but somethings grow that aren't alive (mountains rise and fall in time), otherwise trees don't really move, most plants don't either and we can qualify them as living. Looking for life totally independently evolved away from life as we know it might be more tricksome. Even more for Intelligence possibly, largely because there's even fewer standards on which we can qualify intelligence. Cephelopods could be intelligent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumpy
Why?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubbitron
Because the bible is further made ridiculous in its utterly simplistic understanding of cosmology. It's zero-and-three now; the Earth isn't the center of the solar system, the moon doesn't radiate its own light, and now Earth is not unique in the universe.
Sure we can. We aren't that far from going to Mars. Mission plans have been written and re-written as time has gone on. Had we continued to fund NASA after the Apollo missions we would have gone long ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Melf
And to everyone saying it's too far away and stuff, thats only true because up until now we haven't had a reason to go intergalactic, aside from it being a really cool idea. Now some group of rich bastards can say you know what, fuck it, we're going to Asgard/Terra Beta/Bill Gatesia/whatever, lets start paying people to invent ways for us to get there. After a while someone goes fuck me, was that all we had to do, and bang, we're there in 4 months instead of however many years it will take.
I'm not one to defend the Bible, but...Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
http://home.teleport.com/~salad/4god/geo.htm
I couldn't stop laughing at that last sentence. The second half of it has absolutely no context for being in that article at all.Quote:
God made it all, Jesus died for our sins.
jumping the gun much? it MAY be earth like, until we actually do some research on it,we really dont know anything definitive about it, just that it may be like out planet. and even if it were like our planet, we have no evidence that there is any life there. So while this may be the extent of your scientific inquiry, being a sociology student, those who are actually serious about scientific knowlege , and not using it to shoehorn in some personal vendetta will wait for some actual facts.Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
The statement was made very tongue-in-cheek, though as one of the self-deluded I can understand why you're so quick to jump on it as a potential gotcha. Also, grad student, please. I've moved up in the world.
Heh, well, its kind of hard to tell when you are being comical and when you are being serious, they both bring about the same level of understanding to the table. and as a grad student, you are still a student, so your "gotcha" is, as is common in your posts, unfounded.
oh and congrats on the grad thing, i think you mentioned that a while ago, so i was under the assumption you had been one for a while but good job anyhow.
interesting news, i hope they learn more quickly. Also, steven hawking is going into space or some shit - thats rad.
It's only true because of physics. Other than a wormhole, even if we reach speeds close to light (and the fastest spacecraft now only travels 0.0235% the speed of light), it will still take 20 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Error
Once you reach close to the speed of light, relativety laws begin to have a serious impact on time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Valgar
I'll ride in this thanks.
I think it's been pretty well-defined.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracer
I don't remember all of the definition, but the more important parts include:
*Has a definate physical boundary. As in point X is my body and point Y is outside of my body.
*Takes something in from the environment.
*Gives something off to the environment.
Exactly what the hell is it that you think I'm having such a hard time understanding?Quote:
Originally Posted by frostwolf ex
You are correct, but everyone on earth will see it as 20 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Destin
I hate when people talk about space travel with our laws of gravity and physics... seriously, why do people think we know it all?
The way we will have space travel, with extreme speeds is when scientists listen to the guy who 'makes no sense' because he is trying something new.
I almost replied with a serious answer, until I remembered it was fucking jonas.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas
And who the fuck are you? At least you know who I am.Quote:
Originally Posted by Valgar
I'm saying that when people say 'You can't do that'. They are wrong. Just because we haven't figured out how and our textbooks say it's impossible doesn't mean they are right. I'm sure in the 1200's people thought flying pieces of metal where impossible yet here we are with airplanes. I'm sure they thought a piece of porcelain that magically rids you of your shit was malarky as well, but we have those too.
No, we don't have those. What's this magic you speak of?
Probably because the laws of physics apply to the entire universe.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas
Actually so did the theory of relativity, which is now pretty up in the air as well. Scientists have already stated that if String Theory is the all encompassing theory they believe it is, there is a lot of things about dark matter, and physics in general that will have to be redefined.Quote:
Originally Posted by torgo
I get what Jonas is saying, and its not anywhere near as retarded as your all trying to make it out to be. Things change. Theories are always proven wrong, and barriers are always broken. If you had to judge by our history, and come to the conclusion of whether or not we would ever break the light barrier, you'd be hard pressed to find a case where we didn't accomplish whatever wildly ambitious thing we set out to do.
Anyway keep an open mind, scientific arrogance can make you as useless to your field as off the wall thinking can. The difference is arrogance has never gotten us anywhere, whereas off the wall thinking has brought us all kinds of revolutions.
String Theory has had about two decades to become something, and just hasn't gotten anywhere. It's stuck in the same limbo as Quantum Mechanics, as something with a lot of potential being thrust upon it but very little establishing it. Also, even if it does turn out to be a unified theory, it still won't somehow magically make FTL travel even remotely possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by youandwhosearmy
Umm, what? Theories are not always proven wrong. Show me where the Heliocentric model was proven wrong, or the germ theory of disease. Jonas is being ridiculously idealistic and seemingly has no understanding of even basic relativity physics.Quote:
Originally Posted by youandwhosearmy
There's a vast difference between keeping an open mind and gullibility. Your idea that only major foundation shaking developments have led to any kind of breakthroughs in science is wrong as wrong gets. Sure, there have been some theories that came and changed everything, but those are rare exceptions and far from the rule. Science should not entertain pseudoscientific garbage on the far off chance that it'll lead to the 'next big breakthrough'. We've already wasted enough time and money this way on crap like ESP and Alternative Medicines.Quote:
Originally Posted by youandwhosearmy
You and I really come from different places here Gozen. I wasn't aware humanity had learned so much about the universe and put it to practical testing that they can rule out anything and everything when it comes to FTL travel.Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
K maybe I sounded a little too optimistic there. I just look at it this way.Quote:
Umm, what? Theories are not always proven wrong. Show me where the Heliocentric model was proven wrong, or the germ theory of disease. Jonas is being ridiculously idealistic and seemingly has no understanding of even basic relativity physics.
This is a subject that we have convinced ourselves we know so much about based on what? Based on our limited understanding of the the 3-4 dimensions of the universe that we can see and limitedly understand. I'm not quite ready to close the book on something like this when the scientific community still can't make up their mind on whether milk is good or bad for you.
Your right there is a vast difference. So tell me where in there did I say "build a rocket powered by good feelings and fly to the moon?"Quote:
There's a vast difference between keeping an open mind and gullibility. Your idea that only major foundation shaking developments have led to any kind of breakthroughs in science is wrong as wrong gets. Sure, there have been some theories that came and changed everything, but those are rare exceptions and far from the rule. Science should not entertain pseudoscientific garbage on the far off chance that it'll lead to the 'next big breakthrough'. We've already wasted enough time and money this way on crap like ESP and Alternative Medicines.
But neither should science shut its doors to the next big breakthrough coming from those far out places of thought. Established ideas and rules that may at some point down the road be proven to be garbage and never taking the time to look outside those views to see if the pieces fit in a different way than is believed will lead to the same thing, wasted time and money.
Lets all just agree that Jonas sucks and move on.
Oh god.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas
http://www.jamesshuggins.com/i/hum1/burnout.jpg
I always wondered how scientists could say with absolute clarity that light is the fastest moving thing in our galaxy. If something ever moved faster than the speed of light how could we even contemplate witnessing and documenting it?
I think the best kind of thing to experience in the universe would be the strange application of known theories found in practical situations. For example, having two planets close enough but far enough away so that their gravity fields almost touch, but never quite cross. Obviously this is really quite dangerous, but it might be a really cool way to separate and split material in a natural, energy efficient way.
The first thing they tell you in astronomy is that the numbers are up in the air. Because there is so much we haven't yet discovered due to our inability to actually experience it first hand no conclusive decisions can really ever be made. Everything we know about our universe is derived from conclusions based on our existence.
In that way there still lies a lot to be experience that we haven't yet found.
Stupid people should not make intellectual observations.
Just an observation.
If you can't grasp how my posts just mean, 'have an open mind you close minded caveman' then I dunno what to say.Quote:
Stupid people should not make intellectual observations.
Just an observation.
If you think in 100 years we won't be doing things in science that you close minded folk are saying 'impossible' to, then you are a dumbass hick from alabama or equivalent. Maybe daddy needs to use the computer now.
Because it at that point there wouldn't be any matter to witness, it'd just be pure energy. You really didn't have any idea about this before you started to spew this crap, did you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbacca
What the fuck are you even talking about here? This is gibberish.Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbacca
Based on our existence? Where do you get this shit?Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbacca
Oh, I get it, this is a joke post right? You almost got me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbacca
You're an idiot. Seriously. Stop navel gazing and read a science book.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas
Back in the day mother fuckers wrote books about the earth being flat. "Facts" change as peoples understanding of the world/universe around them changes.
Jonas is correct.
SETI has been seaching for radio waves coming from other planets, for years. They've yet to discover any. Maybe they should point their receptors, towards this planet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thief Silver
http://www.pulseplanet.com/archive/Dec98/1772.html
Quote:
We're listening to a small portion of the radio wave signals which surround our planet, originating from broadcast stations, aircraft, satellites and other sources -- it's all part of the collective noise of modern technology. But are we the only ones sending these signals out into the universe?
I'm Jim Metzner, and this is the Pulse of the Planet, presented by the American Museum of Natural History.
"Earth has been signaling its presence to other civilizations which might exist, for the last 50 years or so. And that means that out to about 50 light years or so, our radio programs, television programs, cold war search radars, and other high power transmitting devices can already be detected over inter-stellar distances."
Paul Shuch is the Director of the SETI League. SETI stands for the Search for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence, and its members keep their radio receivers tuned to the skies, listening for non-earthly communications.
"SETI uses radio telescopes-- sensitive radio receivers and large antennas-- to listen for radio evidence of other civilizations in space. Our planet, after all, is surrounded by a sphere of radiation, caused by our use of radio technology. We hypothesized that other civilizations may also go through a radio using phase in their technological evolution. And if they do, we have a fighting chance of hearing their signals just as other civilizations have a chance to hear ours. If I detected a signal from another intelligent civilization, it would answer the fundamental question"are we alone" very eloquently, even if no further information were exchanged. What SETI seeks at this point is sure and certain knowledge of the existence of other civilizations. Dialogue, which is ever so much more complex-- that comes later."
Pulse of the Planet is presented by the American Museum of Natural History. Additional funding for this series has been provided by the National Science Foundation. I'm Jim Metzner.
Jonas, I don't believe I ever said I didn't agree with you; I understand that human knowledge is a work in progress. One of the main tenets in science is that all theories are falsifiable.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas
But, the bongload philosophy you and your brother are spouting in this thread is fucking painful.
"Woah man, imagine if you could have like two planets near each other dude, you could like split your ham sandwich in two without using your hands, woah dude, woah"
Also, Aurora is my hero.
You can't know anymore than I can on this matter. That's kind of the point, since its all observational. String theory and even Einstein's theory of relativity are all still heavily debated. I guess you've managed to decipher the secrets of the universe though.Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
I have. All scientists agree that the one constant in the universe is your limitless ability to act pig headed in even the smallest of insignificant scenarios.
Whether the scenario I was talking about is plausible or not is irrelevent. The fact that natural phenomina in the universe could someday potentially be used in creative and productive ways is neat.Quote:
What the fuck are you even talking about here? This is gibberish.
On the simple and complex methods we, as a scientific race, derive our facts and observations.Quote:
Based on our existence? Where do you get this shit?
Jonas is right. While I don't personally believe the laws of physics will change dramatically, I do think there's still a lot to be explored and experience that we have no idea could exist.
WordQuote:
Originally Posted by Josh
http://webblog.nyit.edu/marion/picture$176
I have to agree on Jonas with this one, just because we don't know of a way and say it's impossible doesn't make it so.
But since you've already taken a stance g0zen will never ever back down from his stance so don't even bother arguing with him.
He's right you're wrong, that's how it always is with him. (usually he's right).
I'm not saying you're all completely wrong, but you're being extremely optimistic and making comparisons that just aren't valid. This isn't the Renaissance, when science was in its infancy and began making all these huge discoveries in rapid succession. Since Einstein there really haven't been any paradigm shifting theories which have passed the test. String theory, Quantum Mechanics, etc. Those are still waiting to develop into something concrete.
Now, the point of all this was FTL travel. Well, I'm sorry, but there's just real no mechanism for how that could even work. We really would need to have to rewrite the physics books from page 1, and that's just not likely in the least to happen. Sure, you can all say "Well you never know, man" but that's pothead navel-gazing and not science. You have to take into account prior plausibility.
Also, science never made the claim that the Earth was flat. In fact, the Greeks used math to figure out it was round in their time. You want to know the reason we had to essentially 'rediscover' that fact? Religion.
Point one: I agree with every word you just said here, pretty good stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
Point two: People said the same about controlling fire, automobiles, space travel, refridgeration, etc.
Fair enough, it just really sounded like you were saying there was no possible way for space travel beyond our own solar system.Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
A sense the rhythmic prose and sensible reasoning of a true gentleman in this sentence. I continue to humble myself in your presence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thief Silver
I think I'm too much of a pothead navel gazer to make this point, but whatever. People have always believed that their science is infallible. Doctors used to drill holes in peoples heads to let the evil spirits out. this was the height of science. Many things considered to be the height of science, understanding, and reason at their time are looked back on as being barbaric, or at least containing lulz. As we continue to advance, and learn more the same thing will happen. Unless you think our civilization is at its peak and there is nothing else for us to learn.
Is FTL travel possible? Not with our current understanding of things. Yeah, we might have to re-write the "laws" of physics, but maybe they're wrong anyway.
I'm just saying its incredibly arrogant to assume that we know everything there is to know, and that we are correct about the things we do know.
Infinite possibilities yo...
I'd just like to state for the record that I fucking love reading rainbow.
Take a look. Its in a book imo...
I can be anything.
Those are some fine DSLs.
O'Brien was way better than Geordi and Scott.
Ya he really kept those warp engines going on the station.
It was foreign technology too.
STFU. you'll always be Babar with mascara.Quote:
Originally Posted by bbobb
The only hope for humanity is that we're constantly wrong about things. Science, Religion, and each other. The only thing that allows us to advance is to discard old ideas when they stop being useful and figure out a better model.
We'll probably figure out faster than light travel someday be it teleporting, folding space or just going really really fast. I see no problem with rewriting the physics books again, it'd make someone's career fer sure
I remeber somewhere there was thought that certain matter can effect other matter far away, sometimes at faster than the speed of light. FTL FTW.
From here on I have an issue with.Quote:
Originally Posted by g0zen
And you can keep trying to take an insanely pessimistic view of these thoughts, but history is actually "not" on your side in this case. Sure you can keep saying, "Well none of these things are likely to happen, so never comment or mention them..." but thats the "being disproven" is more important than "being right" trap of science that far too many modern day scientists currently seem to be stuck in. It seems to happen to a scientist when they start to forget the "very real" possibility that they may actually know nothing at all.
So I'll say this too you.
Let the dreamer's dream and let the scientists disprove, fight over, and eventually steal their dreams and make em reality. Just like its always been.
But please try not to forget that without the dream, there isn't a reality.
Falsifiability is a part of Science; if something can not be disproved, then it cannot be a scientific theory.
LOL.Quote:
Originally Posted by YAWA