Stealth Battle 1998

Seeing the Tenchu Z thread made me think about what happened to the series since 1998, which in turn made me wonder what people thought of the big three 1998 stealth games.

All being released within months of each other, each game had totally different ideas as to how to have the player sneak around and put the player through very different settings.

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http://users.zoominternet.net/~tain /poll_thief_box.jpg

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I think my vote goes to Thief. They're all fantastic games, but Thief's moody environments and difficult combat (forcing stealth) put it over the top. Metal Gear Solid is a better game than Tenchu, but only barely.

Kinda like NZE's Shinobi III vs. Dracula X thread, only vote if you've played all three, please. The turnout probably won't be nearly as high, but I'd imagine most here have at least played Tenchu and MGS.

1. Thief
2. Tenchu
3. MGS

I always wanted to enjoy Thief more than I actually did, but it's just not my kind of game. Metal Gear Solid was ok, but the one I actually had fun playing was Tenchu.

James

I want to say Tenchu just for the amazingly bad voice acting.

But I'll go with MGS.

I've... *cough*neverplayedThiefpleasedon'tkillmeTNL.

played all three so i will chime in.

MGS (at least the first) did it all at the time. the thing is, once you're spotted it's very easy to get the AI off your case.

Tenchu 1 and 2 have horrible draw distance on the ps1. i could have enjoyed them more if i could see more than 5" in front of me. i did enjoy one of them on the ps2 (perhaps the 1st one they made on the system?)

Theif makes you become stealth. while the other two have an emphasis on it, it's not really NECESSARY to proceed, whereas with Theif, once you're spotted you don't have a good percentage of getting out alive.

so for which one uses it the best i had to vote for Theif.

1. MGS
2. Tenchu
3. Thief

I could never get into Thief. It's a good game, just not for me.

I have never played Thief, and from what I gather, it is heads and shoulders above either choice. For the 2 games I had played, I prefer MGS over Tenchu.

In terms of a stealth game? Thief, no question. Actual light/dark detection, guards that would really investigate, combat that could quickly escalate to unsurmountable odds, dragging bodies... there's just so much that Thief did that was so right the other two can't compare.

Now, in terms of an overall package it becomes much harder. Tenchu's stealth kills were exaggerated goodness and the grapple was just cool. Flitting from rooftop to rooftop, occasionally dropping down to slit a throat and then disappearing back into the dark was perfect. MGS was great for its ability to let you play in different styles, where stealth was preferred but balls-out action wasn't frowned on. It also had absolute shittons of style, a fun story, memorable music, and so many quotable remarks made possible by a perfectly fitting team of voice actors.

MGS had the biggest impact on me and was far and away the one I played the most, Tenchu was great so long as I limited myself (only riceballs and grapple allowed for items, being seen is not an option), but Thief had me acting the most like it was intended. I would study enemies and flit from shadow to shadow, usually more scared about being discovered than anything else while trying to steal everything I could.

I remember a guard catching a glimpse of me while I was dashing across a lit hallway and came yelling after me. To my dismay the open door on the other side that I popped into was just a closet and I sat back as far as I could in the pitch dark room only a few feet deep, sword in hand as he ran at me. He shoved his head in the door and yelled for me to come out but I waited for him to make the first move. We must've sat there for thirty seconds like that, him staring into the dark and me crouched and tensed up. Finally he told himself he must've just seen something and began to wander off, which lasted all of no time as I quickly snuck up and blackjacked the asshole. I was later seen out in the open and the dick called for backup which quickly overwhelmed and killed me.

MGS is probably my favorite, but shit like that makes me vote Thief.

Tenchu with Thief being a close second. Its still fun to go back and play through Tenchu 1 even now.

I'm not a Metal Gear person at all, even though I did somewhat enjoy MGS 3. I think it was more the setting and cast than anything else.

Where are you?

I liked all of them.

Metal Gear was my fave. I finished it a few times.

I finished Tenchu and enjoyed it.

I started Thief a couple of times and could never get into it. I've always been meaning to go back and try it again though.

Tenchu looks the same now as it did then.

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Originally Posted by K3V

Tenchu looks the same now as it did then.

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Come on, you know that's not true.



There's a light bloom filter now. :chick:

I'd love to see a remake of Thief. They should do more of those.

I'm trying to get into Deadly Shadows again. The PC version is pulling me into things much better than the Xbox version ever did, but I still don't know if I'll stick with it.

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Tenchu was great so long as I limited myself (only riceballs and grapple allowed for items, being seen is not an option)

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Yeah, I beat Tenchu just by running straight through the levels. There's no real need for stealth, but it's really hard to enjoy unless you limit yourself like that and play for perfect clears or whatever they were called in that game.

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Originally Posted by James

I always wanted to enjoy Thief more than I actually did, but it's just not my kind of game.

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Same. I always wanted to like it more than I did.

Tenchu or MGS was a tough call for me, lots of fun playing both, but overall I do think MGS was a better game.

Let's see. I have played through Thief and MGS twice but I have replayed Tenchu's levels a lot more. Tenchu's the one I played and liked the most overall so it gets my vote.

Thief greatly impressed me, too so it's kind of painful not to vote for it. It's probably the least flawed game of the bunch. What Tain mentioned about it forcing stealth due to Garrett being weak at combat is a plus for the genre, IMO.

I enjoyed MGS as well. It has the fanciest presentation of the three but suffers from some annoying aspects, e.g. interrupting the gameplay to message you how to climb a friggin' ladder and other cheesy story parts. It's good but in retrospect I think MG2 on MSX2 is the better game. MGS gets third place in this poll for me.

I should note that I didn't vote for the best game so much as the one I had the most fun with. I'd say on technical merits it goes from Thief to MGS to Tenchu. I just had the most fun screwing around in Tenchu, so that's why it got my vote.

James

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Originally Posted by James

I just had the most fun screwing around in Tenchu, so that's why it got my vote.

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Tenchu does have a lot of hilarity potential, but I had more fun torturing guards with C4 at the urinals in MGS. In fact, most of the replay value for me in MGS came with doing stupid shit with stealth, and it only got better in the sequels.

Thief. Absolutely no contest. Perfectly designed missions, great AI, and tons of ways to complete objectives. Thief 2 is even better, as it has even less forced combat.

I like most of the gameplay in MGS but the plot just annoys me, and I really despise "cute" gimmicks like the controller switching in the Psycho Mantis battle. I never really found the combat to be all that fun - the controls were too imprecise for me to enjoy it.

And I have never enjoyed Tenchu.

As a stealth game, Thief is head and shoulders better.

Pah! someone gave 'deadly shadows' a texture overhaul: http://www.john-p.com/textures/Thief-DS/index.shtml
Has anyone seen anything similar for the first Thief?

I picked Tenchu. I'm still not sure if I wanted to put that above MGS because MGS is one of the all time greats in my mind but I was a big time ninja freak when I was a child so I have to go with Tenchu. I was finally able to do all the things(in virtual form of course) I watched as a child. I'm not sure what Thief games I played, but I didn't care for them at all.

Thief 1 and Thief 2 share a lot of textures and models, but the ones in Thief 2 are more detailed and complex. Naturally, somebody has found a way to use those in Thief 1. Check out the patches here (near the bottom).

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

1. Thief
2. Tenchu
3. MGS

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Originally Posted by bVork

Thief 1 and Thief 2 share a lot of textures and models, but the ones in Thief 2 are more detailed and complex. Naturally, somebody has found a way to use those in Thief 1. Check out the patches here (near the bottom).

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thnx canuck. :)

If anyone hasn't played Dark Messiah: Might & Magic yet, you should. You can play it very much like Thief if you choose the right skills. NeoZeedeater told me once that it was a contender for 2006 GotY. I didn't believe him until I got it for $10 out of Target's clearance pile.

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

If anyone hasn't played Dark Messiah: Might & Magic yet, you should. You can play it very much like Thief if you choose the right skills. NeoZeedeater told me once that it was a contender for 2006 GotY. I didn't believe him until I got it for $10 out of Target's clearance pile.

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This looks fun, I will definitely keep an eye out for it. About how long is it btw?

I remember thinking back then that Tenchu and MGS complimented each other nicely. What one lacked the other had. You could go to one game for the action and plot, and to the other for more the more methodical stuff.

One cool thing about Tenchu is that it had a debug mode that let you place enemies in a customized layout around the map, as well as other features.

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Originally Posted by kingoffighters

This looks fun, I will definitely keep an eye out for it. About how long is it btw?

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No idea. I'm only ~2 hours in.

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Originally Posted by kingoffighters

This looks fun, I will definitely keep an eye out for it. About how long is it btw?

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I don't really keep track of hours in games but it's a bit shorter than the average action game, maybe around the same length as Condemned or Gears of War if you have played through those.

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Originally Posted by NeoZeedeater

I don't really keep track of hours in games but it's a bit shorter than the average action game, maybe around the same length as Condemned or Gears of War if you have played through those.

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That's something I want. I hate overlong action games (like Okami).

Calling Okami an action game is like taking a piss on Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden, and God of War.

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

Calling Okami an action game is like taking a piss on Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden, and God of War.

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It is what it is.

It's an Action/Adventure game or maybe even an Action/RPG. It's definitely not pure action.

It's a furry game.

I liked them all back in the day, but I probably put more time into MGS than the other two, despite it not being the best of the stealth games when it came to actual game mechanics (Thief wins).

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

It's an Action/Adventure game or maybe even an Action/RPG. It's definitely not pure action.

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I didn't mean pure action, but I do realize that's all I wrote. You are super anal or something.

There's a news flash.

No yoshi, you will not have the LAST word on this.

Do not underestimate the power of the dark side.

I will underestimate whatever I want.

stealthy

!

Tenchu easily schools the bitches.

you got the first letter right but maybe you sneezed while typing or something

lol

Tourette's imo