Nintendo Fall Conference 2007: Teh Megaton!? -- F. Emblem DS, Wii Kart motorcycles!

Make it three.

make it four.

Bioshock was amazing, but it wasnt its entire gameplay that did it.

The last two should surprise nobody.

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Originally Posted by Chux

The last two should surprise nobody.

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this entrance surprised nobody.

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Originally Posted by B-Ri

make it four.

Bioshock was amazing, but it wasnt its entire gameplay that did it.

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Do you understand what you're making it four of? That would be people who think MP3 is better then Bioshock, which considering this:

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Originally Posted by B-Ri

eh, MP3 left a bad taste in my mouth with how Halo-ed out it was. I want to play it, but id rather play everything else thats coming out righ tnow.

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Reading comprehension is a good thing.

To clarify, I don't give a crap about MP3. I was commenting on BioShock being great as an interactive novel, but not really as a game.

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Originally Posted by bbobb

Do you understand what you're making it four of? That would be people who think MP3 is better then Bioshock, which considering this:





Reading comprehension is a good thing.

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oh was that it? i thought we were just saying bioshock wasnt amazing because of its gameplay.

NEVERMINDDDDDDD

although i do need to find time to beat mp3 and be done with it

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Originally Posted by NeoZeedeater

Besides the vita chamber flaw, I'm curious what all these other problems are.

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The vita-chambers are pretty dumb, but they weren't really one of my main issues because I restarted from saves every time I died.

Some of my biggest complaints include:

• Enemy leveling as you progress through the game. It just negates your character building.
• Nothing changes. It's the same game throughout. Wouldn't be a huge problem, 'cause I've enjoyed games that don't evolve, but I don't think the core gameplay in BioShock is particularly engaging.
• Some broke-ass security devices, like hacked security cameras that only rarely actually work to detect enemies (even when I've got a big daddy frozen right in front of the camera) and hacking mini-games that are actually impossible to complete. I also refilled my EVE about a thousand times instead of opening the hack menu as I approached a turret. Nothing more miserable. Even after hacking everything and setting up traps for big daddy, all the creativity was foiled and a shotgun full of electric buck was pretty much the only thing needed.
• Oh wait, yes there is something more miserable. The escort mission at the end blows real hard. It was especially satisfying to find out, after trying real hard to do it flawlessly, that it doesn't matter if you keep the little sister alive or let her die endlessly and just summon new ones. This was a great way to end the game.
• Almost as great as the dopey boss fight at the end.

BioShock's atmosphere is outstanding (though a bit dull after the Sander Cohen stage) and I was hooked early on. But the game doesn't evolve at all, and its core elements are either buggy or just basic. Some of my frustration with the stale gameplay is due to how I played the game--I rarely spent any ADAM, just bought new tonic and plasmid slots. The bare minimum approach is how I try to play games when doing guides, but even my experiments with other plasmids didn't show any compelling changes to the gameplay.

The atmosphere was enough for me for a while, but my frustrations with the gameplay had me hating the game near the end. It's overall a better game than average and I'm glad I played it, but compared to something as nearly flawlessly executed as Prime 3 and Portal, BioShock, for me, doesn't stand up.

Just to note, this:

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Originally Posted by MarkRyan

[list][*]Enemy leveling as you progress through the game. It just negates your character building.

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is completely destroyed by this:

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Some of my frustration with the stale gameplay is due to how I played the game--I rarely spent any ADAM, just bought new tonic and plasmid slots. The bare minimum approach is how I try to play games when doing guides, but even my experiments with other plasmids didn't show any compelling changes to the gameplay.

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Originally Posted by bbobb

Just to note, this:



is completely destroyed by this:

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There's more character building than buying new plasmids. The camera research bonuses that increase damage to enemies are 100% pointless. You buy a new, longer-lasting Electro Shock and it doesn't matter because enemies start shaking off the effects faster. 100% pointless.

The research damage bonus wasn't huge, but most of the other research bonuses made quite a difference. I don't know what game you were playing, but I was overpowered as fuck all when I got to the end of the game.

Hell I was killing Big Daddies with the Wrench for fun.

lawl Prime and Breakdown.
No one knows what games Markryan ever plays. Halo 1 to him was incredibly balanced.

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Originally Posted by MarkRyan

Some broke-ass security devices, like hacked security cameras that only rarely actually work to detect enemies (even when I've got a big daddy frozen right in front of the camera)

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Um, Big Daddies are ignored by security cameras except if they have security beacon on them - and that doesn't last for long as they're smart enough to destroy any cameras in the vicinity.

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Originally Posted by bVork

Um, Big Daddies are ignored by security cameras except if they have security beacon on them - and that doesn't last for long as they're smart enough to destroy any cameras in the vicinity.

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If you have them hacked and a big daddy attacks you, security cameras are supposed to spot them. Here's proof. It's just horribly inconsistent with how it works.

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Originally Posted by MarkRyan

hacking mini-games that are actually impossible to complete.

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Really? I never encountered any that were unbeatable, at least with how I upgraded, and I tried to hack most of them.

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Originally Posted by NeoZeedeater

Really? I never encountered any that were unbeatable, at least with how I upgraded, and I tried to hack most of them.

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the vault ones were 90% of the time uncrackable for me D=

I only ran into it once or twice and I hacked every single hackable item I came across. It did happen, but if you're complaining about that in the game you are seriously stretching to nitpick.

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Originally Posted by B-Ri

the vault ones were 90% of the time uncrackable for me D=

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You need to upgrade/equip your hacking skills/aids to do those.

I didn't ever have one puzzle I couldn't crack aside from me just being too slow.

Yeah, late in the game, if you don't have your engineering tonics up to snuff, there's a chance - due to tile placement being purely random - that the exit will be totally blocked off by the overloads/alarms.

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Originally Posted by kingoffighters

You need to upgrade/equip your hacking skills/aids to do those.

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I always had every hacking-related tonic that you can find equipped. And they were totally randomized--I'd sit there on the same hack and sometimes it'd be impossible, sometimes it wouldn't.

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Originally Posted by NeoZeedeater

Really? I never encountered any that were unbeatable, at least with how I upgraded, and I tried to hack most of them.

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I've got screenshots to prove it.

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Originally Posted by Brand X

I only ran into it once or twice and I hacked every single hackable item I came across. It did happen, but if you're complaining about that in the game you are seriously stretching to nitpick.

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I hacked everything, as well, and had equipped all of the hacking-related tonics found in the game. It happens a lot, but not as much near the end of the game. I'd say it was a bigger problem in the second quarter of the game than any other part.

Also, that hacking mini-game is one of the more obnoxious parts of the game. Like a mini-game from some cheesy platformer in the '90s, not a potential game of the year in 2007.

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Originally Posted by MarkRyan

The vita-chambers are pretty dumb, but they weren't really one of my main issues because I restarted from saves every time I died.

Some of my biggest complaints include:

• Enemy leveling as you progress through the game. It just negates your character building.
• Nothing changes. It's the same game throughout. Wouldn't be a huge problem, 'cause I've enjoyed games that don't evolve, but I don't think the core gameplay in BioShock is particularly engaging.
• Some broke-ass security devices, like hacked security cameras that only rarely actually work to detect enemies (even when I've got a big daddy frozen right in front of the camera) and hacking mini-games that are actually impossible to complete. I also refilled my EVE about a thousand times instead of opening the hack menu as I approached a turret. Nothing more miserable. Even after hacking everything and setting up traps for big daddy, all the creativity was foiled and a shotgun full of electric buck was pretty much the only thing needed.
• Oh wait, yes there is something more miserable. The escort mission at the end blows real hard. It was especially satisfying to find out, after trying real hard to do it flawlessly, that it doesn't matter if you keep the little sister alive or let her die endlessly and just summon new ones. This was a great way to end the game.
• Almost as great as the dopey boss fight at the end.

BioShock's atmosphere is outstanding (though a bit dull after the Sander Cohen stage) and I was hooked early on. But the game doesn't evolve at all, and its core elements are either buggy or just basic. Some of my frustration with the stale gameplay is due to how I played the game--I rarely spent any ADAM, just bought new tonic and plasmid slots. The bare minimum approach is how I try to play games when doing guides, but even my experiments with other plasmids didn't show any compelling changes to the gameplay.

The atmosphere was enough for me for a while, but my frustrations with the gameplay had me hating the game near the end. It's overall a better game than average and I'm glad I played it, but compared to something as nearly flawlessly executed as Prime 3 and Portal, BioShock, for me, doesn't stand up.

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This post could have been shortened to one sentence: "I didn't really know how to play the game."

Unless you have reading comprehension.

I blew the escort mission several times, going for keeping the one little sister alive, until it occurred to me to stick with the wrench. The sister got through with well over half her health once I did that.

I've seen a few impossible hacks on the highest difficulty level, but health was so easy to get that I just didn't care. Plus a bit of invisibility went a long way towards making the flying robots no threat. A few hacker mods near the end of the game and I never had a problem again, in fact I'd say the biggest problem with hacking became how easy it was. Every once in a while I'd get a puzzle that made me sweat, swapping pieces in at the last second before the fluid hit the end of the pipe, but for the most part I had a clear path built well in advance.

James

I had very few (if any) unhackable turrets/whatever once I equipped the remove X number of deadend flows (forgot what they were called). Actually it was too easy since I probably hacked way too many times going thru the game 1.5 times.

I didn't like the escort mission at the end either, that's really the only blemish (aside from the boss, but I didn't find him to be bad).

After you upgrade your hacking skills, you shouldn't have problems hacking machines (safes are a little tough because of the limited space). In fact, MarkRyan, I'm surprised that you said that the hacking mini-games are impossible to beat. You either didn't upgrade your hacking skills enough, or you really suck in Pipe Dream.

i think hes trying to say that even after upgrading his hacking skills he still encountered a large amount of impossible to beats.

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Originally Posted by B-Ri

i think hes trying to say that even after upgrading his hacking skills he still encountered a large amount of impossible to beats.

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I didn't have this problem. Maybe 1 out of every 30+ hacks, but not large amount.

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Originally Posted by Cowdisease

You either didn't upgrade your hacking skills enough, or you really suck in Pipe Dream.

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I always equipped the hacking skill tonics as I found them, and there's not much to suck at. The mini-game is pretty lame really, which wouldn't be a huge loss except that I ended up hacking everything.

As far as it not being common to run into impossible hacks, I'd mostly agree. It's not real common, but during the middle stages of the game I'd run into it about twice per stage. When it did occur that once or twice, it would often be impossible to complete on repeated attempts until the game randomly decided to throw me a bone.

Stop derailing this very important thread.

Try using autohacks more frequently. The items required for inventing them are pretty common, so you should have a decent supply in most cases. I usually just tossed an autohack at anything in the red area of the gauge.

Nintendo says we were bored with games before the Wii arrived to save us, even though we didn't even know it.

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Originally Posted by NextGen

Outgoing Nintendo of America marketing executive Perrin Kaplan says consumers were getting tired of gaming before Nintendo reinvigorated the market with its Wii console.Kaplan, Nintendo of America VP of marketing and corporate affairs, was speaking after Nintendo received yet another marketing honor for the delivery of its mass-market friendly message that has helped its Wii console prosper in the next-gen console battle.

"A major insight that Nintendo had early on was that they saw that gamers were getting bored, even though they didn't know it yet," Kaplan told Advertising Age, which named Nintendo Marketer of the Year for its success in attracting a wider consumer demographic to gaming.

Kaplan’s opinion is backed up by Robert Matthews, NOA’s senior director of consumer marketing, who suggested that people were growing tired of having to play games for long stretches rather than being able to dip in and out of the fun.

"Just look at the way people consume entertainment today. The idea that you would spend hours playing videogames is just not real anymore," said Matthews.

While acknowledging the success of the Wii marketing campaign, fellow exec George Harrison said that Nintendo didn’t spend more on getting its message across than it had in the past.

"It was one of our biggest [campaigns] in terms of impact, although the actual [media] spending was about the same as the year before," Harrison said. "We didn't just double our budget to blanket both audiences [gamers and non-gamers].

"In our PR, we've always done outreach, but in this case, when we noticed something interesting happening online -like the weight loss using Wii Sports - we would draw it to the media's attention," he added. "The little things that kept showing up were picked up and blown out in marketing. ... When we saw what people were doing or how they were getting creative, we would move on it."

The commercial success of the Wii, in conjunction with the continued popularity of Nintendo’s DS handheld console, has seen Nintendo’s stock rise to new heights in recent times. The Wii is currently the fastest selling next-gen system, and despite announcing its intentions to supply “unprecedented” stock to market Nintendo says it won’t meet consumer demand this holiday season.

With Harrison and Kaplan having announced their plans to leave the company in the near future in the wake of the marketing division’s planned relocation from Redmond, Washington, to San Francisco and New York, Matthews says the company’s marketing message must be clear and consistent if its success is to be maintained.

"It really comes down to a very essential strategy if Nintendo is truly going to expand the marketplace with products," said Matthews. "It can't be an 'or' strategy; it has to be an 'and' strategy, and it also needs to be built on a strategy of advocacy."

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Source.

Marketing monkeys are always good for a laugh. And this whole referring to the current gen as "next gen" needs to stop. This generation has been underway for quite a while now.

It'll stop when Nintendo actually enters it.

I wasn't aware our boredom stems from a lack of titles that instruct us on dieting tips and applying makeup. If only we had listened when Barbie visited our SNES', Nintendo was just trying to help us in the long run back then.

There are a few screens of Star Soldier R up at magicbox. Looks Star Soldiery.

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Originally Posted by A Robot Bit Me

There are a few screens of Star Soldier R up at magicbox. Looks Star Soldiery.

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Looks decent, though it's still unclear if this is a full game or just caravan modes. *-neo

3d is so ugly. I'd rather play the old games just looking at those screens, just like Shattered Soldier.

At least Gradius V was awesome.