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I completely understand the desire for background checks—to make sure someone who has a past on record isn't given a tool to enable violence. I think it ends there, though. At least without crushing the rights of citizens. I don't think it'll make a lick of difference to school shootings like this though (it really wouldn't, as previously noted).
There is a price to pay for being truly free. That to me is the honest difference between stances.
As I said and you never addressed, drawing a line in the "freedom" stand here is completely arbitrary. Every amendment has exceptions and carve outs, the idea that the 2nd is the only one where that cannot be is just nonsense.
Seriously. I love small breasts and I would never go after a chick younger than 14.Quote:
Originally Posted by bbobb
It is extended and carved out, isn't it? At least in the case of individuals/particulars, which is the same way the first amendment is qualified. Neither amendment guarantees any absolute right in every case. It only feels like the NRA always gets its way.
Right, and that's a matter of politics not constitutionality. Even in the Heller decision the SCOTUS acknowledged Congress has the power to regulate gun ownership.
I don't think it is arbitrary in that some are fighting for maximum freedom. Some people will always fight against more restrictions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Diff-chan
Maybe it isn't an issue of 'cannot' but 'shouldn't'?
I don't like most of the supposed gun restrictions for the same reason I don't like CISPA, the Patriot Act, anti Gay marriage, Don't Ask Don't tell, dry counties, the war on drugs, etc.
Hell, I don't even completely like that medical files are going digital because I know that the CIA and FBI will have a backdoor to these records and will no longer need a warrant to look at anyone's medical history.
I like for people to be free. I like for them to have privacy.
If it was up to me, you could buy an AK 47, a dime bag, then go to a big gay wedding and you and your buds could smoke one, shoot one up in the air, and play grab ass.
I'm fine with the NRA getting their way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick
Question for the opposition. What is your end goal? Say we get all the gun legislation you want? Then what?
What will you do with the new mass killings? Will you seek out new legislation to mitigate those events too? Maybe ban the sale of fireworks? Pressure cookers? Small titties? Is this just going to be what we do? Ban or regulate things to prevent a handful of deaths/rapes each year? How many things will you ban or regulate?
What will you do about the 9000+ other gun deaths each year? The ones with a minority and poverty focus? The ones that are related to the war on drugs or disparaged youths?
Will you get off your butt and try to fix that? Or will you ignore it now that you and your family is safe?
Its tragic but one and maybe the only good thing about the violence is that it makes the problem visible. I worry that if we were to some how keep people from harming each other we'd just forget them. We'd fix everything just so much as it impacts the middle and upper class white neighborhoods, then pull a Yoshi and leave everyone else to die. We would become silent participants in all their future problems, because we'd consciously created a system that was easy to ignore.
Your whole argument is silly. You are saying you don't want there to be any laws, nothing at all. Just freedom and anarchy for everyone.
Laws restrict freedom. That's how laws work. But good laws restrict freedom for the greater good
Then who is saying the second amendment shouldn't be up for qualification? Certainly no one here? I thought we were all for some background checks, and most of us for some restrictions on concealed carry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Diff-chan
Honestly, gun control and abortion are the two issues I have had the most trouble with. In both cases, I wish we had great freedom in theory but few people would exercise the rights in practice. And in both cases, I distrust those who say the answers are clear (more so when it comes to guns).
I have always split with the bulk of the Democratic party when it comes to gun control, but I don't see it as a cut-and-dry issue.
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Originally Posted by Nick
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Originally Posted by Fe 26
Nevermind.