The Obama Presidency

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Originally Posted by Fe 26

small government is code for "get rid of crap I don't like"

repubs want to make social services smaller (get rid of them)

libs often want to decrease military spending, or at least they did. Maybe not currently.

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Liberals don't use the phrase "Small government" because liberals think there is a place for good governance. Plus, the phrase as I said before is purely a focus group driven piece of right wing political propaganda. It means nothing.

Liberals do want to decrease military spending because the current military budget and procurement process is a grotesque, out of control monster that is designed to entrench incumbents (there's no efficient reason why planes and boats need to be assembled in 45 different states and hundreds of districts), reward cronies, and exacerbate tensions across the world.

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Originally Posted by Razor Ramon

You understand that oil wasn't going anywhere until BP created a well there, right? It wasn't just waiting for the moment to strike. That shit would probably have never come up to the surface if someone did not drill for it.

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I know that. But if someone lit your house on fire, would you expect them to stop it and then wait for them to stop it?

Yes, the problem was set off by people. But it is nature that is making oil come out f the hole.

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Originally Posted by Razor Ramon

And a fire is different. A fire department is paid for by taxpayers to specifically combat fires. We have no such thing for oil.

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Are you saying that if we did have oilfighters it would change your opinion? You know why we have Firefighters? Because people are really stupid and we have a lot of them.

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Originally Posted by Razor Ramon

Companies are supposed to follow safeguards to ensure events just like the deep water horizon spill does not happen. They cut corners and didn't.

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And? I don't think anyone in the US right now doesn't think BP is a bunch of corner cutting dicks.

How does "they were lazy and fucked up" translate into "and that means we should let the fuck up keep going and wait for them to fix it"


I mean shit, if a factory was pumping toxic waste into your drinking water, would you keep drinking it and washing in it while you wait for the factory to clean it up? And would you be cool with them continuing to pump toxic waste into your water while they discuss how to fix it?

A house fire destroys your house, kills your family, if not put out will jump to nearby houses - destroying them and killing the families inside.

An oil spill.... ummmm... fucks up an ecosystem? Will completely fuck your job if you are a fisherman, but on the bright side you get money from BP. Will not affect your drinking water whatsoever.

Come on Ironplant. Stop being retarded.

Boastin in a toasted bread.

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

Liberals don't use the phrase "Small government" because liberals think there is a place for good governance. Plus, the phrase as I said before is purely a focus group driven piece of right wing political propaganda. It means nothing.

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Eh, both sides have focus group driven political propaganda.

There are a lot of Americans who want less government in their lives. The repubs lie and say they will do that to get votes.

Even if voters wised up and realized that they were being lied to (how they haven't after the patriot act, is beyond me), those feelings won't go away. The fact that libs think governance is good in negligible. Many people, for good or bad, don't want to be bothered by it.

That desire isn't just going to go away. Libs say the cake is great, repubs say the cake is bad. The people who vote just don't want cake, because they really want pie.

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

Liberals do want to decrease military spending because the current military budget and procurement process is a grotesque, out of control monster that is designed to entrench incumbents (there's no efficient reason why planes and boats need to be assembled in 45 different states and hundreds of districts), reward cronies, and exacerbate tensions across the world.

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grotesque? I can't say one way or the other. I can not say factually that we should not spend a little over 1/4 of our money on having a system to defend ourselves.

http://media.photobucket.com/image/f...ng2008JPEG.jpg

Good luck on the last point though. You aren't going to get anyone in the military to agree with you that it is a good idea to have all of your defense manufacturing all in one area. And you won't get any politicians to agree with you because it makes them look awesome when they send all those jobs to their home state.

Good governance is a fucking myth. The government does absolutely nothing well, so minimizing what they do at all is by definition a good thing.

The amount we spend on the military is, frankly, unreasonable.

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Originally Posted by dave is ok

A house fire destroys your house, kills your family, if not put out will jump to nearby houses - destroying them and killing the families inside.

An oil spill.... ummmm... fucks up an ecosystem? Will completely fuck your job if you are a fisherman, but on the bright side you get money from BP. Will not affect your drinking water whatsoever.

Come on Ironplant. Stop being retarded.

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Have you been to the coast?

This spill, if not stopped, has the potential to destroy a lot of the coastal economy. And it will hurt people inland that used them for suppliers (demands for alternatives will go up, causing prices to go up). Oh and thousands of sea creatures that are going to die.

You ask me to stop being retarded, but you're the one writing off the death of a lot of animals. Do you also shrug your shoulders at the idea of wilderness in Cali lighting on fire every other year? "whatever, fuck those bears and birds, and shit."

So we're saying this isn't a man-made disaster now? Ah ha.

Note: those Cali fires? Also man-made disasters. Mostly because we keep putting them out.

Not really. I'm saying that the problem isn't as simple as the Chinese putting led into cabbage patch dolls.

There is a natural element that will continue to destroy regardless of who started it and who decides to fix it.