North Korean Rocket Launch (& New Nuke Test)

Castro wanted help building Cuba. The U.S. didn't even want him in power so they tried (and failed) to remove him and then ignored him. Castro and Guevara then went to other Communist countries for help. The Russians agreed only if they were able to place some missles on Cuba for strategic purposes. The States freaked the fuck out and threatened the Russians with nukes of our own. No side ever pressed the button.

Thus, the Cold War more or less.

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Originally Posted by Othello Harrington

Hey assfuck, go look up world war II losses, then come back here and say

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they're irrelevant, because the soviets were able to absorb these losses and then some. wars aren't decided by score.

In Biffland everything is decided by score.

It's his entire problem in a nutshell.

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Originally Posted by icarusfall

This threads been hilarious.

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The irony of this

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Originally Posted by Othello Harrington

Do you people read history at all?

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followed by this

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Also, had we not used the nuke, Japan would have fought until every last man was dead, they were that committed. At that point we would have had limited impact on our own soldier's death, as we would have carpet bombed them into nothingness. The alternative saved millions of Japanese lives as fucked up as that is.

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is hysterical.

The atom bombings were purely a message to the Soviets written in the blood of civilians, as any historian not employed by the US public school system will tell you. The fact (as recorded in memos by top advisors on both sides) is, Japan was ready to surrender, with certain reasonable conditions that they were ultimately granted anyway, but that wasn't enough for Uncle Sam. Without an unconditional surrender, we felt we could justify showing off our new toy.

Sorry for the tangent, but seeing people still believe that propaganda to this day and age always makes my blood boil.

Is that before or after the empire was still telling them they were winning the war? Also, you shouold have read farther were I STATED THE VERY SAME "SOVIET MESSAGE" you did, moron.

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Originally Posted by Biff

Gohron, seriously it's like your playing baseball with a wet sock.

The USA was not developing a nuke for Germany or Japan, they were developing it with Russia clearly in mind.

Jesus man, did you quit school in the 9th or 10th grade?

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You said they were developed for eventual use against the Soviets. Not quite the same as admitting (in direct contradiction to your post I quoted) that they were deployed unnecessarily, purely to show the Soviets what we could do.

And if you still don't believe me on that front...

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Originally Posted by The 1946 United States Strategic Bombing Survey

Based on a detailed investigation of all the facts, and supported by the testimony of the surviving Japanese leaders involved, it is the Survey's opinion that certainly prior to 31 December 1945, and in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered even if the atomic bombs had not been dropped, even if Russia had not entered the war, and even if no invasion had been planned or contemplated.

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Originally Posted by Fleet Admiral Chester W. Nimitz, Commander in Chief of the Pacific Fleet

The Japanese had, in fact, already sued for peace. The atomic bomb played no decisive part, from a purely military point of view, in the defeat of Japan

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Originally Posted by Fleet Admiral William D. Leahy, Chief of Staff to President Truman

The use of [the atomic bombs] at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender because of the effective sea blockade and the successful bombing with conventional weapons... The lethal possibilities of atomic warfare in the future are frightening. My own feeling was that in being the first to use it, we had adopted an ethical standard common to the barbarians of the Dark Ages. I was not taught to make war in that fashion , and wars cannot be won by destroying women and children.

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Hmmm, so you're saying we dropped it for no reason other than to send a message to Moscow (which I agree with, sort of)...could we not have just dropped on in the arctic ocean if that were the case?

Watching some water blowup is less horrific than watching us melt civis.

You'd think, but that would only show that we had them, not that we were willing to really use them. It's the difference between a regular cop just pointing his gun and a Jack Bauer type capping a bitch in the leg so there's no question he is fucking crazy and means business.