I've been taught if you stick your nose where it doesn't belong you won't breathe through it anymore.
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I've been taught if you stick your nose where it doesn't belong you won't breathe through it anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Opaque
That's cute, keep pretending it's about interfering with a man beating up on his girlfriend, when it's obviously about being a coward and stabbing someone instead of being man enough to throw down.Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstBlood
I'll never sit idly by and let a man beat up on a woman. He deserves to have the everloving shit beat out of him and all of his teeth scattered across the pavement and maybe even be raped in prison, but not stabbed. Stabbing him is no less cowardly than hitting a woman.
Even if the guy is the worst scum on the earth, if you stabbed an unarmed person you absolutely deserve whatever happens to you in return.
Maybe he threw down and it escalated to the point where he felt a stabbing was appropriate.
Or maybe Icarus is just fucking crazy and stabbed the guy because he felt the situation warranted it.
Either way, he probably didn't sneak up behind the guy, stab him and retreat or whatever cowardly made-up situation you have in your head regarding this story that hasn't even been expounded upon.
You think someone that reacts to violence with a knife deserves "whatever happens to them" but an outsider beating on a girl that's part of your group of friends doesn't? Get the fuck outta here.Quote:
If you stabbed an unarmed person you absolutely deserve whatever happens to you in return.
Protoman's "bro code" in regards to fighting is hilarious. Why wait for the other dude to pull out a knife, or a gun when you can end things right off the bat? I support random stabbings.
This.Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstBlood
I only take this so far as it's not physically causing harm to another person. After that all bets are off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor Ramon
Icarus presented this situation as if he went up and stabbed the guy as retribution for hitting his girlfriend. If it's more complicated than that, he should say so, otherwise I think that makes him a coward. That's pretty much it.
I said that "he deserves whatever happens to him" because he attacked the guy with a deadly weapon. The guy who was stabbed could pull out a gun and blow icarus' head off and would be completely justified in doing so, wouldn't he? On the other hand, few things are more infuriating to me than a man hitting a woman, but that doesn't justify a stabbing. Abusing women is wrong because they usually can't adequately defend themselves against a man. How is it fundamentally different to pull out a knife in a fistfight? Your moral code is a fucking joke if you're against one but fine with the other.
You can disagree with me (or keep up the straw mans so that you have something easier to argue against), but don't act like I'm expressing a minority opinion.
If someone is fighting with fists and you escalate to a knife you deserve to have a gun pulled on you and get shot in the face.
No, I explained nothing of the situation other than the catalyst and the end - you brought that baggage on your own. There's a middle where a fistfight took place. You don't tend to open with a knife unless it's already in that territory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Proto Man
Fuck that. I don't believe in "fair fights".Quote:
Originally Posted by dave is ok
Stop playing dumb. You said you stabbed a guy for punching his girlfriend. You know the picture you were painting by not elaborating further.Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
Neither did the dude beating up a woman. You should have been BFF with himQuote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
Truly I couldn't imagine that someone would assume he punched her and my immediate response was to grab the Gerber and stick it in his thigh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Proto Man
I was hoping you did.
Sorry to disappoint you. :(
So you are stupid? What picture do you think "I stabbed a guy because he hit is girlfriend" paints? That's what a normal person would say only if that's what they did. The problem here is your ability to communicate, plus you still haven't offered any additional details despite arguing with me about what happened. Is that because I'm right or because you're making this whole thing up as you go along?Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
Dude said something, you filled in the blanks with your own shit. Dude told you were wrong, you accuse dude of lying when its way more likely that dude didn't feel like typing out a big long story on his iPod.
*looks at the Game of Thrones thread*
*looks back at this one*
Yup.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstBlood
No, the problem is your unreasonably shitty attitude. I don't even know who you are. I guess you used to post here because you have some prior posts, but I can't remember you for the life of me. But suddenly "You're Back" and swinging your dick around. Several other people were able to fill in the gaps in the story. Opaque asked what he did - I told him. He didn't ask for a blow by blow and neither did you.
"I stabbed a guy for punching his girlfriend"
"You just stabbed him for punching his girlfriend?"
"No"
"Then what happened?"
*silence*
Yeah, I'm retarded. I'm the one taking what he said at face value. You guys are the ones filling in the blanks with your own shit by assuming things he DIDN'T say.
Also does the course of this conversation cause you to think I give the slightest fuck if you know me, Icarus?
Listen, most of us have been posting on this site for nearly 10 years. We know how to interact with each other. You're the only one having problems with this.
Proto Man's just mad 'cause this one time, he was ready to THROW DOWN and this guy pulled the COWARD'S KNIFE and slashed a hole in his favorite polo.
NOT COOL BRO.
And Icarus conveniently ignores the other voices of dissent in this thread so that he can pretend the newer guy is the only one who disagrees. Pathetic.
You're precious.
^ And you have no response.Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
Here's one!
I stand by my stance on the subject, but upon reflection I apologize for some of the tone I used. It can be really frustrating to argue with someone who isn't addressing any of your points. It wouldn't even have affected me if I wasn't also having a shitty day at work.
All y'all bitches put your naps together.
Bitch, you walk around with your bra too tight.
I thought you did.Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
Well I saw something closer to that than a fight and then later a stabbing. I assumed he punched her, you had words and then you stabbed him. I also assumed you stabbed him in the gut; I had no real reason to think that but it sounds more brutal.
No, it was the side of the upper thigh. It's harder to get a knife in a body than you would think. And I wasn't trying to kill him.
I guess from tv your mind would immediately go to the gut though.
To clarify. He straight shot her - myself and a friend got up and shoved him back from the table. Friend hit him once or twice, then took a shot to the balls. He got a hit in on my face, I hit him once or twice and we fell to the floor. Got up and circled for a second. I took out the knife - a thumb flick Gerber model I keep in my pocket for general use. He swung with a right that I blocked with my left and came down with the knife on his left upper thigh - I was holding it with the blade pointed down in my hand. He fell on his knee and I kneed him in the face. KO. Retrieved the knife, friend, and girl and got out of dodge.
From a bystander's next day account: the cops showed up a bit later, took the story and nothing ever came of it.
There you go.
You should have killed him with kindness.
EDIT: Seriously though, you weren't trying to kill him, but you easily could have with a knife to the thigh. If you need to fight dirty (and it sounds like you needed to fight dirty), then just knee him in the groin next time. As you saw it works fairly well and would have had a poetic quality to it.
EDIT: Well, a nut shot isn't an instant down on everybody, like TV would have us believe, but every man EVENTUALLY goes down from it when rage/adrenaline runs out.
EDIT: Don't stab me.
Hitting somebody in a particular place can be very difficult. Fighting fair is also a stupid concept when it comes to real world conflicts. If I ever got into a "fight" with a friend of mine because we were really angry over something trivial, I would fight fair because I wouldn't want to do serious damage. On the other hand, if in a violent situation like the one Icarus was in or in a situation where I was attacked by somebody that intended to harm me, I wouldn't hesitate to use excessive force. I may not stab somebody in the Icarus situation (but I don't really blame him), but given my latter situation I would do my best to fuck the other person up and escape without being injured.
A friend of mine got jumped by four college age kids last year walking to the store late at night. They were basically out looking for trouble and beat him so bad, he lay on the side of the rode knocked out for almost 30 minutes. If I was in his shoes and had the time to react, I'd probably even shoot somebody if I was armed. There's nothing honorable in that type of violence (nor is there in the type where you deck your girlfriend in front of your friends) and it makes no sense to follow any rules.
I agree with pretty much all of that, I just think there are some key differences in the situations you're describing. This was an attempt at a 2 on 1 ass kicking (which I fully support and would join in given what the guy did) that resulted in a stabbing because the 2 didn't end up outmatching the 1. Though of course once he's gotten himself into that situation, it matters little how he got there.
Yeah, I suppose. It's tough to understand exactly what occurs in the situation of somebody else though.
I have yet to hear any rational, logical defense of retributive justice. It's a purely emotional thing, it's the same as chimps ripping each other's balls off because they feel threatened. It's of evolutionary merit, but not just in any ethical sense.
Justice should be practical and effective as a deterrent and, when possible, as rehabilitative. Anything else doesn't interest me.
There is none, but humans write the laws and many of them are just as irrational as Yoshi.Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogacuda
No fucking way am I discussing this with Frog.
You don't have to. I was a philosophy major with a focus on ethics, it's not like I haven't heard it. It's going to come down to some variant of "Wouldn't you feel like blah blah if it happened to you" or "Eye for an eye" or any other fallacy like that. I get it, you want to, it's emotionally satisfying in a way practical concerns are not. I don't really care.
We'll just agree that it's emotionally satisfying and leave it at that.
I completely get that, but I just don't believe emotionally satisfying and moral are the same thing.
SHUT UP
I want to hear frogs take on it. It can't be any worse than the other 4 pages of ball jingling.
He can't make the thread any worse than it is.
So following that logic to its conclusion, what do you propose we do with someone who cannot be deterred or rehabilitated? That's a pretty huge number.Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogacuda
I'll take that action.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fe 26
You already did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fe 26
The problem there is how do you determine who these are? I think the law being fairly applied to all is a pretty important value.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
That's really a whole other discussion though that has nothing to do with my point about retribution.
When did you become such a queen? I made a couple short posts and made my point. If anyone else posted the same thing you wouldn't give two fucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh
lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Josh
Running Man.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
Sounds good to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
Are you a psychologist now?
Your black and white view of the world is quite...lacking of thought. If somebody that thought the same was as you and looked at your life from the outside, they'd probably feel the same way you do about other people.
Better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gohron
How the fuck did you post this two hours after the Bin Laden press conference, which is a perfect example of what you do with someone you can't deter or rehabilitate? You fucking kill them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gohron
Obama killed Bin Laden with his bare hands.
Your implications of what makes somebody "hopeless" are far less than what Bin Laden has done to the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi
That's not silly shit. That's people's lives. I am deep in the professional music business. I had to give up any studio dreams to do live almost exclusively, and even then only on a part-time level. I'm fine. Many others are not. It's carnage out there. All anybody sees are the singers and front men. It's so much more. Studio owners, techs, engineers, assistants, session players, managers...ruined.Quote:
Originally Posted by Opaque
And that's music alone. Keep this up and movies, games, and software will follow. We're fucked once software is fucked, because what else do we do in this country aside from Wall Street voodoo?
Good. Fuck them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
The only example I've used is violent sociopaths. And Bin Laden is one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gohron
Why? What could you possibly have against anonymous engineers working 16 hour days for middle-class wages? Why don't they deserve their career?Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
Making more overproduced garbage 16 hours a day for middle class wages?
They are the extraneous portion of art. Cut the fat.
What about the ones making great art? What about the ones making glorious overproduced cheese fests that put a smile on everybody's face? What about the ones just doing what comes across their "desk"? Hell, what about the ones making garbage? Why should somebody have their career taken away because you don't like what they make?
And they are about as extraneous to music as the person manufacturing paint is to painted art. Cut them out and the artist is bogged down in learning how to make paint before art production can even begin.
It's a job that anyone with a free weekend and a handful of mics can accomplish.
Let's not overstate it.
Bullshit. It takes more than 4 years of constant work to get in the neighborhood of "beginner". It's an unimaginably complex mix of science you can study and gut feeling that can't be propperly articulated. You've obviously never tried.Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
I have a degree in broadcasting.
I can edit analog tape.
Don't tell me how hard it is.
I did front of house sound for two grammy winners in sold out shows in the past few months. Damn right I'll tell you how hard it is.
Get back to me when you are actually using your degree at a high level.
No, making paint would be comparable to building the instruments. Flawed analogy is flawed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
Whatever. Then making a movie with just the writers and actors. Good luck lighting and framing that one. Or making games with just the artists and scenario writers. Bet the engine would rock, eh?
Eventually the robots will put us all out of work and we can just do that shit for fun or in exchange for sexual favors. Unless the robots have that covered too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
You're terrible at this. Since you don't seem to realize this: the only thing people need to make music are the instruments. That's it. People made music for hundreds of years before managers and studio owners even existed, those are not positions required to make music happen. What you're listing are the people who make it easier and faster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
It would be equivalent to the special effects team for a movie. The movie can still be made without them, it just won't look as pretty.
[edit] Well, "real" instruments aren't even required for music, just for specific sounds.
Fuck off you morons. Back on topic.
So, now that you know I do, in fact, know what your job entails you want to discount my knowledge of it by measuring dicks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheebs
Great.
I want to discount your knowledge because study isn't the same as professional practice and you are obviously clueless if you think even the act of recording alone is a point n' shoot endeavor.
Three hours with a drum key and tap tap tap before a mic even goes up. And that's just the start.
Oh, so the work I've done setting up systems and running sound doesn't count.
Get over yourself.
If you're spending 3 hours with a drum key tapping a drum you're recording garbage.
3 hours to tune a single drum? I second bullshit.
This conversation is really happening?
u trollin?
Non-essential positions in non-essential industries don't offer absolute job security. Better call the cops.
Not really.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubbitron
Yall are being a bunch of little IPs. A bunch of grown men generalizing their own work experience and trying to apply it to all other related careers and positions.
You're all smarter than this.
watQuote:
Originally Posted by Fe 26
I went to school for this. I worked in the field for years.
You can make perfectly acceptable rock and roll recordings with a bag of mics and an ear. You can't make radio friendly recordings this way, but who wants to? I mean... Unless you're getting paid.
Basically, you're all jerks. Shut your holes.
Music is the last art form that will ever really be hurt artistically by lack of commercial viability.
But movies, games, shit that really does require the cooperation of large numbers of people to do, that's another matter. Luckily that shit still makes money.
YOU ARE KILLING MEQuote:
Originally Posted by Frogacuda
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogacuda
Sorry, editing is poor when posting from my phone.Quote:
Originally Posted by icarusfall
I've made my own ink before. It was pretty easy.Quote:
Originally Posted by MechDeus
Useless knowledge!
I'll bet you could easily build a wooden crate banjo too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbacca
I do own a banjo and play it! I didn't, however, make it.
I made a cigar box guitar!Quote:
Originally Posted by MechDeus
My dad is a luthier (his dad was, too). He made my banjo. I don't think instrument makers are terribly hurt by people stealing MP3s. Actually, it might be worth noting that the commercialization of recorded music led to a major decline in the instrument making field.
yeah, it would make sense that records put a lot of players put of business. You could just stay at home with a bottle of scotch and a record of your favorite instrumentals. You no longer had to go down tot he local whatever to hear the songs you liked.
But recorded music sparked an interest in playing music and then kids bought guitars and shit.
The exact opposite, actually. Before records, if you wanted to hear music you had to play it your damn self, so everybody had instruments around the house and a band ready to go at any moment. 'Round the turn of the century through the 20s, a lot more people knew how to play because they couldn't just throw on a record whenever they wanted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh
If I had to guess, I'd say it hurt the market of pro level gear and helped the lower levels a lot. Less need for masters, but more desire for beginners.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh
And it probably flooded the secondary market. More of those kids gave up, so there was more used gear for pros to buy from pawn shops and the newspaper.
but whatever, I'm just guessing.
Well, there also wasn't any other damn thing to do. Guitars, fiddles, mandolins, etc, were the xboxs of there day. You went to bed or you picked on the guitar. Maybe read one of the 5 books in the house.Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogacuda
My perception is skewed, perhaps, since I don't know a single person without a musical instrument of some sort in their living room.Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogacuda
I can relate to that, but it's definitely not typical.
I know one person like that in real life.
It's like Frog says.
I can see four bass guitars, and three guitars from where I'm sitting!
2 Banjos, 2 acoustics, and a portable pump organ.
I'm getting pretty fucking awesome at ukulele.