Crimson Dragon (Xbox One)

Kind of surprised to see no thread on this given the Panzer fans here but I'm hoping people pick this up if they liked the Panzer Dragoon series.

It's a digital only Xbox One exclusive shooter so it looks to be similar to Resogun in that regard, it'll be priced at $19.99. Here's a recent twitch stream video of gameplay with lots of good information from one of guys developing the title: http://www.twitch.tv/microsoftstudios/b/470743169

And some screens below:

http://imageshack.us/a/img843/3729/5j7x.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img802/7725/qg89.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img855/2638/ar0b.jpg

If you're picking up an Xbox One I think this should definitely be one of your purchases.

Oh shit $20. Ill Day One that.

This used to be the kinect only 360 game right? It actually looks like it has a lot going on.

I'd definitely pick that up if I was getting an Xbox One.

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Originally Posted by EvilMog

Oh shit $20. Ill Day One that.

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Definitely a good price.

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Originally Posted by sedition

This used to be the kinect only 360 game right? It actually looks like it has a lot going on.

I'd definitely pick that up if I was getting an Xbox One.

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Yep it was the one they were developing for the 360's Kinect, thankfully they saved it for the One since it has much better technology.

They've been in development for 5 years, for $20 it MUST be a good game.

Jokes, it's a shit game.

I have played it, I can say this.

I will enjoy my shit game on my Shitbox One.

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Originally Posted by Chux

Jokes, it's a shit game.

I have played it, I can say this.

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What was wrong with it?

and was it the 360 version that you played or the XB1 version? I'm guessing the game has changed a bit since that accidental release and port.

I feel that for $20 I'm showing someone I want more Panzer Dragoon style games. Even if this isn't great.

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Originally Posted by Tain

and was it the 360 version that you played or the XB1 version? I'm guessing the game has changed a bit since that accidental release and port.

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It was what they had at PAX E 2012. A few if those pics are from the level I played but w/e.

Anyone who's married has to deal with the episodic version of this every ~28 days.

Bad game for years is equal to a bad game even on a new system. Chux is right, this game was a piece of shit at PAX and I expect nothing less when it comes out for X1.

Kotaku review.

I'm still going to have to try it myself some day.

Let's be real, there is not a single person on earth who was going to buy a Xbox One for this game. It really doesn't matter how good or not good it is.

Edge: 5/10

Polygon: 4/10

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

Let's be real, there is not a single person on earth who was going to buy a Xbox One for this game. It really doesn't matter how good or not good it is.

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If I got a system for free, this and Dead Rising would have been the only two launch games I would have considered.

If I had an Xbox One I'd be trying Killer Instinct, DR3, LocoCycle, and Crimson Dragon. And for non-exclusives I'd want Need For Speed. The only exclusive that's out right now on PS4 that I want to play is Resogun. But Knack and Killzone both look aiight. And I'd like to try the PS4 version of Injustice if it's not coming to the One.

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Originally Posted by Brand X

Bad game for years is equal to a bad game even on a new system. Chux is right, this game was a piece of shit at PAX

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I don't want any game to be particularly bad, but I'm glad to see that just as much work was put into it as I thought.

Also, I guess it's got some pretty nasty pay-to-play stuff in there.

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Originally Posted by Korly

Also, I guess it's got some pretty nasty pay-to-play stuff in there.

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I hadn't heard anything about that and then read the Polygon review.

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If you do decide to grind, you have to pay credits every time you take on a mission, so the returns will be muted. A couple of times I accidentally cleaned myself out buying upgrades and had to grind an earlier free mission until I had enough to pay to play the level I actually needed to finish. Infuriating.

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Wooooow.

Color me shocked by all of the reviews for this. I would have loved a fun Panzer Dragoon esque game with good looking visuals, but this was never going to be that, or anything even remotely of the same quality.

I'm not surprised this is a disappointment. Years of development hell and a platform change don't really instill a lot of confidence. It's a shame though, it's gorgeous to look at and the nostalgia vibes are strong.

I'm with Yoshi, had I went with Xbox One I would have bought this and DR3.

I haven't read any of those reviews yet, and I won't even bother reading the Kotaku review, but the only thing I really care about when I finally get around to playing this game is if it feels like a pretty Panzer Dragoon 1, 2, or Orta. If it has at least that going for it I'll enjoy it, because that' all I'm really looking for out of it.

IGN's review didn't even have the words "Panzer Dragoon" in it, and Kotaku's admitted to having never played any of the PD games. That strikes me as somewhat irresponsible delegation on the part of the editors of those publications.

Does it even matter? A guy born the year PD1 came out can go buy a pack of cigarettes today. Hell we haven't gotten a new entry in the series for a decade. I think it's fair to evaluate this game on its own terms.

Exactly. They're reviewing the game in front of them.

Frogacuda is 100% right. You can't responsibly review a game without any context.

What is the context, "oh this is a quasi-sequel to some old crap only a bunch of nerds on TNL care about, none of whom actually read this website regularly"?

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

Does it even matter? A guy born the year PD1 came out can go buy a pack of cigarettes today. Hell we haven't gotten a new entry in the series for a decade. I think it's fair to evaluate this game on its own terms.

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You should be doing both. I think it's fair to say that a sizable chunk of this game's audience is PD fans. To some extent it's not even really trying to stand on its own merits.

Are there still PD fans? I think they're dying off like WWII vets.

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

What is the context, "oh this is a quasi-sequel to some old crap only a bunch of nerds on TNL care about, none of whom actually read this website regularly"?

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You have a valid point about catering to one's audience. I literally never go to Kotaku and only browse the headlines for news at IGN. But when a game is a spiritual successor, I don't know how you can review it without understanding what it's succeeding. Would you read a review for Mario 3D World from someone who has never played a Mario game before?

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

Would you read a review for Mario 3D World from someone who has never played a Mario game before?

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No, because Mario games come out constantly.

The last Panzer Dragoon we got was in 2002, and wasn't even popular IIRC.

I love the Panzer Dragoon series, I bought an original Xbox for Orta. I'm agreeing with Dff and others here, there's no need for them to have played the other games to know if this one is shit or not.

I would argue that the last Panzer Dragoon game was Child of Eden.

So then it would have been ok for someone who had never seen the original trilogy to review The Phantom Menace, since it was 15 years between films? There is expiration date on having a clue.

Has anyone here played this:

http://www.sega-mag.com/jeux/cover/P...ation2-JAP.jpg

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

So then it would have been ok for someone who had never seen the original trilogy to review The Phantom Menace, since it was 15 years between films?

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Yes, I think so. I'd be interesting in hearing that POV, actually.

But games and film are different.

I feel the same way about KI. I don't need to hear from some KI nerd about this new one, just tell me if this one is a good fighter relative to its peers (MVC3, SF4, TTT2, etc.).

It's a port of the PC version.

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

Yes, I think so. I'd be interesting in hearing that POV, actually.

But games and film are different.

I feel the same way about KI. I don't need to hear from some KI nerd about this new one, just tell me if this one is a good fighter relative to its peers (MVC3, SF4, TTT2, etc.).

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I almost buy that with KI, but what exactly are CD's peers? In order to have any context for comparison at all, you have to play something at least a few years old.

That stupid Dragon Commander game that just came out.

You want to compare a spiritual successor to Panzer Dragoon to a Divinity offshoot? Now I fully understand why you don't think context matters.

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Originally Posted by Korly

I would argue that the last Panzer Dragoon game was Child of Eden.

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This is not wrong. When I played Crimson Dragon it was just a reskinned Child of Eden.

It's worth comparing KI to other fighters because fighting game fans care about fighting games, and they want to play the good ones. Unless there are 3 or 4 flying dragon games coming out a year I don't know about, it's not the same thing. This game is being released into a vacuum, if the only point of comparison are some ancient games few people have played and even less remember, then it's not critical to discuss in a current review.

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Originally Posted by Diff-chan

Are there still PD fans? I think they're dying off like WWII vets.

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Probably more of them than people who are going to buy this game.

I don't care about the opinion of anyone who hasn't played or doesn't remember them. And now we've come full circle in terms of audience.

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Originally Posted by Korly

I would argue that the last Panzer Dragoon game was Child of Eden.

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So the latest Mario game was Sonic Lost World?

I see what you mean.

The only person in the gaming industry who's opinion of Crimson Dragon I'm actually interested in hearing is Nick Rox. I respect the man's passion for the series and I've always agreed wholeheartedly with his views on what makes the games enjoyable.

...Hopefully him, shidoshi and Casey will do a new, long overdue WAHP soon.

those fucks hinted that one would be coming almost 2 months ago!

Yeah I saw that on Twitter, too. C'mon already!

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Originally Posted by Buster Wolf

The only person in the gaming industry who's opinion of Crimson Dragon I'm actually interested in hearing is Nick Rox. I respect the man's passion for the series and I've always agreed wholeheartedly with his views on what makes the games enjoyable.

...Hopefully him, shidoshi and Casey will do a new, long overdue WAHP soon.

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Who cares what Boshi does except UPDATE THE GOD DAMN HEARTS FOR THE CUTE TAGS

BOSHI, ~ IT'S JUST SAD NOW ~

Speaking of doshi, anyone see where Jim Sterling called him out for being slightly unprofessional in his latest jimquisition?

I saw it and I was like, "Dat's doshiiiiii" all 80s sitcom like.

Sterling calling others unprofessional? That's pretty rich.

Who is Jim Sterling?

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Originally Posted by bVork

Sterling calling others unprofessional? That's pretty rich.

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Eh, he does a mea culpa about priorly doing the same thing he's calling doshi out on, 'till he thought better of it.

Yoshi: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/vide...w/jimquisition I don't do the podcast or talking head video thing too much, but I do watch Jimquisition and Kyle Bosman.

Looks like someone at Destructoid, who is actually Panzer Dragoon fan, gave it a good score:
http://www.destructoid.com/review-cr...n-265767.phtml

"Actually"? Unlike the review linked earlier with a low score by someone who claimed to be a fan?

This game might potentially have some interesting depth that's being overlooked by people plowing through for reviews and such, and the complaints of sluggish controls might be due to something like the game being designed for memorization instead of reflex where you're already dodging before the shots are even fired. But trying to cherry-pick reviews makes it seem more like you're trying to find something to legitimize your outlook about a game you haven't played yet.

Just wait and play it instead of hunting for rationalizations. Seems pretty clear you're going to get it regardless of what anyone says, so why are you bothering looking through reviews?

Now now, he said he wouldn't read that one. Because it wasn't what he wanted to hear.

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Originally Posted by MechDeus

"Actually"? Unlike the review linked earlier with a low score by someone who claimed to be a fan?

This game might potentially have some interesting depth that's being overlooked by people plowing through for reviews and such, and the complaints of sluggish controls might be due to something like the game being designed for memorization instead of reflex where you're already dodging before the shots are even fired. But trying to cherry-pick reviews makes it seem more like you're trying to find something to legitimize your outlook about a game you haven't played yet.

Just wait and play it instead of hunting for rationalizations.

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I said before that I haven't read the reviews that were linked earlier in the this thread, and I still haven't. Curious if the metacritic score had changed, though, I checked the site and the Destructoid review stood out so I read it. That's all there is to that story, no hidden agenda there. You're hunting for a lot more than I am. When I feel like it I'll read the bad ones, too. Had someone noted that the ones linked previously in the thread were by Panzer fans I may have been more inclined to read them already. Is it really necessary for me to do all this explaining simply for posting a review with a good score that was by a fan? Some of you guys take this shit way too seriously.

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Seems pretty clear you're going to get it regardless of what anyone says, so why are you bothering looking through reviews?

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Just because reviews for this particular game have no influence upon my purchasing of it doesn't mean I'm not allowed to look at them. C'mon, you're trying too hard.

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Originally Posted by Chux

Now now, he said he wouldn't read that one. Because it wasn't what he wanted to hear.

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Incorrect. I said the only person in the industry who's opinion I was interested in hearing was that of Nick Rox. I read stuff on the internet every day that I find no interest in. After all, I just replied to one of your posts, didn't I?

OH SHIT!

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Originally Posted by Buster Wolf

Had someone noted that the ones linked previously in the thread were by Panzer fans I may have been more inclined to read them already.

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Originally Posted by Chux

Crimson Dragon Review, from a self proclaimed lover of the Panzer Dragoon series.
http://www.gameinformer.com/games/cr...s-own-fun.aspx

6/10

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It was in the xbox one thread, so you're forgiven. Also, remember that TNL-chan is, like, totally tsundere. I..it's not like we like you or anything, i-idiot!

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Originally Posted by Buster Wolf

Just because reviews for this particular game have no influence upon my purchasing of it doesn't mean I'm not allowed to look at them. C'mon, you're trying too hard.

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Yep. You got me. I'm trying too hard. The guy who uses the phrase "stood out" to mean "was the only one with a high score" while going out of his way to dodge reviews already easily linked for his access and two people with hands-on experience in order to search for something to back up his wishes is the one with no agenda.

I didn't say you weren't allowed, but your position on this has been pretty laughable so far. Personally I wouldn't pay attention to reviews of a rail shooter anyway because they tend to get ripped on for silly reasons like length (same applies to shooters, fighting games, lightgun games, etc.), but I await your further responses about how you're just so laid back about all this compared to me.

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Originally Posted by Yoshi

So then it would have been ok for someone who had never seen the original trilogy to review The Phantom Menace, since it was 15 years between films?

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Probably, because they would be less inclined to apologize for it.

This thread sucks.

A fitting thread then.

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Originally Posted by MechDeus

Yep. You got me. I'm trying too hard. The guy who uses the phrase "stood out" to mean "was the only one with a high score" while going out of his way to dodge reviews already easily linked for his access and two people with hands-on experience in order to search for something to back up his wishes is the one with no agenda.

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What stood out the most is the fact that it's at the very top of the list on metacritic there, Dick Tracy. Second was (ding ding) score, obviously. But it's hilarious that you went out of your way to point that out, as if you caught me or something. As if the review score isn't what stands out the most to everyone when scrolling through them. Aside from possibly who wrote the review, if you're familiar with the author. But there's a reason why review scores are big huge numbers, typically in a color that makes them... wait for it... stand out.

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I didn't say you weren't allowed, but your position on this has been pretty laughable so far.

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You asked me why I was looking at them. What else would you be implying?

First of all, point out what was so laughable. If somehow you manage to make worthwhile points, I'll be more than happy to defend myself. But I don't think you can. Your problem is that you're assuming far too much. You're assuming that I was purposely avoiding the links to reviews with low scores that were posted here when in actuality I just didn't feel like reading any reviews at the moment. I didn't read the bad ones at that time nor did I go scouring the net for good ones. I just didn't feel like it doing either. I was busy with other unimportant things on the internet. You also assumed that I just somehow magically knew that those reviews posted here were by fans of the Panzer Dragoon series when, in fact, that had not been stated with the links themselves or in this thread whatsoever. What's more, if you're gonna say I should know it because it was stated on another thread at this forum then you'd once again be doing too much assuming (I doubt you'd reach that far but I'm honestly not positive at this point). And when I posted the link and stated that it's by someone who is actually a fan, it wasn't to say that no other reviews whatsoever haven't been. It was simply because I had heard from various people how the majority of bad reviews had been written by critics who never played any of the other games in the series.

Secondly, I want you to tell me what you think my so-called wishes are and what you think my agenda is. Then I want you to prove it by based on my previous posts in this thread.

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Personally I wouldn't pay attention to reviews of a rail shooter anyway because they tend to get ripped on for silly reasons like length (same applies to shooters, fighting games, lightgun games, etc.)

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Good for you. But what point are you trying to make with that statement? How does it pertain to me and what is it that you're trying so hard to get through to me... go ahead, explain it. I'd find it highly entertaining. Honestly.

Again, you're taking this too seriously. It's plain as day based solely off the fact that you're reading too much into my posts and creating intentions for me that I simply don't have and never did.

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Originally Posted by alan_fatima

It was in the xbox one thread, so you're forgiven. Also, remember that TNL-chan is, like, totally tsundere. I..it's not like we like you or anything, i-idiot!

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I know full well how TNL is. I posted here way back in the day and I lurked here forever when I wasn't posting. I recently became active again because SRK's new forum software is garbage, because HerV is always dead and because I miss reading cka's posts.

Tell me again how I'm trying too hard. I liked that part.

Someone's gonna have to let the other guy have the last word, fellas. Fight Club or STFU, IMO.

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Originally Posted by MechDeus

Tell me again how I'm trying too hard. I liked that part.

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You're trying too hard. Because now you're trying to soften the fact that you were making something out of nothing by making a short, nonchalant style post.

You're right, I'll make this last comment and then leave him to say whatever he wants about me.

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Originally Posted by Buster Wolf

But what point are you trying to make with that statement? How does it pertain to me and what is it that you're trying so hard to get through to me... go ahead, explain it. I'd find it highly entertaining. Honestly.

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The same thing I said in the first post: Just wait and play it instead of hunting for rationalizations. Maybe my first post came off as meaner than that, but when you started getting defensive it was fun to poke. Carry on.

[edit] I guess now it looks silly that he made a post before me. Oh well.

You're still putting reason into my actions that I just don't have. What you're failing to realize is that I'm not looking for rationalizations. That's just you assuming again. I'm perfectly capable of reading reviews for games solely for the hell of it and it having nothing to do with why I do or do not play the game.

Christ you assholes, we're TNL 4 Life! WE ARE FRIENDS whether you like it or not! Act like it! Nothing is gained with this foolishness. We're part of a really small community and we should really stop shitting on each other! It's OK to disagree but all that rubbish was unnecessary.

I love both of you guys, and I hope Crimson Dragon is cool and I can't wait to hear what you guys think about it once you play it, if you play it.

Korly just wants love in the world.

And Tekken.

Same thing.

I like you guys. I wouldn't be hanging around here if I didn't. And I'd rather make friends than enemies any day. I can also enjoy a heated debate or flame war occasionally, but I don't hold grudges either.

MechDeus,
http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/...ps57839507.jpg

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Originally Posted by Korly

This thread sucks.

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Originally Posted by Chux

A fitting thread then.

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I'm sorry, it was supposed to be used for good not evil.

But to be serious for a sec, I'm pretty disheartened to hear about the game not being good. I was looking forward to playing it some day and as a fan of Panzer Dragoon Orta I really wanted a good spiritual successor.

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Originally Posted by MechDeus

Korly just wants love in the world.

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I just assumed that he wanted you to have makeup sex, since it might resemble his wrasslin' fetish.

http://www.thecareermuse.co.in/wp-co...8a-d2p6t3i.jpg

I get it.

It was a real mindbender...

It's true though. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

If this game is that bad, can't we all just be sad together?

The Panzer Dragoon games were some of the best..

Ben Kuchera really hated Crimson Dragon.

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Originally Posted by Korly

Ben Kuchera really hated Crimson Dragon.

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I can't wait for the promo ad that quotes this one, Penny Arcade raves "A real panzer dragoon revival. Fuck this game so Hard!"

hmmm
http://news.xbox.com/2013/11/games-c...dragon-updates

I'm sure that will make the game insanely awesome.

The changes don't seem that significant but every little bit helps in the case of this game I guess.

I will still try it.

The power of the cloud lets you patch a game! Innovative!

At least they're listening.