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And what if you're born in a society that has developed the ability to clone? Don't you deserves the consequences of scientific development?Quote:
Originally posted by EThugg
No, it wouldn't. YYou get what the fuck your born with. You born defective? TOUGH SHIT. You injured yourself? TOUGH SHIT. You deserve to have whatever the consiquence is, including death.
Also, if we reject our society's ability to clone, then we become culpable in the deaths of everyone who could have been saved by cloning. A bit of fear about the mystical problems of cloning isn't enough to justify letting people die for lack of organs.Quote:
Originally posted by burgundy
And what if you're born in a society that has developed the ability to clone? Don't you deserves the consequences of scientific development?
Plus, I dunno about you, but even if I was religious, I\'d risk hubris and my eternal soul (by supporting cloning) if the reward was the ability to save lots of lives.
In the offchance that God exists and is pissed about cloning, how angry could he get? It\'d be for a good cause, right?
Apparently they didn't try adoption.Quote:
Originally posted by innova
i say go for it, if they tried everything else might as well.
I don't understand people who object to human cloning because "it's against nature/god!" (so's a car; you own one of those?). But I also don't like the idea of cloning as a means of reproduction. The world's already overpopulated enough.
Reminds me of Brave New World...
*dun dun dun*
Stone: There are potential dilemmas raised by cloning, but I don't think they're any different than those raised by birth control, fertility therapy, abortion or gene therapy. And I don't think they're raised by this occasion.
SoK: Cloning isn't and isn't going to become a factor in overpopulation. Overpopulation is caused by that most natural of natural acts: copulation.
I am against all medical testing, research and procedures. I won't even take aspirin.Quote:
Originally posted by Rhydant
personally, i dont think theyre anything wrong with cloning. i just think its a little strange that a couple would want to clone THEMSELFS.
thugg, please add me to your 'list'. id just love to be on it.
and i guess this means your against stem cell research too? dont give me that "its immorale, youre killing babies" bullshit. this stuff is going to help MILLIONS AND MILLIONS of people. but this is a different matter....
Human lives don\'t need saving, and I don\'t believe in any god, or religion, so take your assumptions and shove them up your ass. It\'s wrong because it\'s wrong. There is no deeper issue or reason.Quote:
Originally posted by Stone
Ahahah, spoken like a true moralist. You\'re a jackass, you know.
Cloning will save lives. The only, the only issue available for discussion is whether we\'d be violating God\'s law, some sort of eternal law, by using science to create life.
It\'s very simple. You are defying your fate and nature and extending your life. It\'s bad for society, bad for the planet, bad for the natural balance of the planet, and is more ripe for misuse than any single scientific advancment outside of maybe atomic energy.Quote:
Originally posted by burgundy
*crosses Thugg off of \"People I Need to Clone\" list*
I don\\\'t understand the religious/moral argument against cloning. Like in almost any other matter, highly religious/moral types need to STFU, IMO. I could understand if someone/some country was attempting to genetically engineer super-soldiers (and clone them) or use clones for slave labor, but they\\\'re not. Your genetic makeup is yours alone, and I don\\\'t see where anyone comes off telling you what you can and can\\\'t do with it.
And that\\\'s ignoring the medical benefits.
The worst scenario would be perpetuated by the very nations that stay on the moral high horse and oppose cloning - where only the very rich could afford cloning or gene therapies in far-off nations, creating yet another class-based inequality.
You're not even funny anymore.Quote:
It's 100% wrong, and if this 'anonymous' couples' identities were revealed, I'd be on the 1st plane to where they live to shoot them in the face.
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How so? Nature has given us intelligence, and so we use it.Quote:
I am opposed to cloning because it goes against nature.
The world can support many more people, the problem lies in how those people use it's resources. I don't see how this is a case against cloning. Should we not allow people to make kids the regular way, because there are plenty to adopt?Quote:
As far as helping needy people - there are already far too many people for the planet to support. Using technology in this fashion is only going to create more people to consume precious natural resources.
The technology is not just going to be used to create babies, it'll be used in many other areas to improve human life. And what does the third world have to do with anything? We all know the poor suffer, how's a ban on cloning going to help?Quote:
I'd call forwarding cloning immoral in the face of these other, far more serious problems. Educate & supply the third world about birth control, for starters.
The resources put into cloning aren't going to hurt advances in new energy sources. Some genetic engineer isn't going to pack up and move onto windmills, if he gets the boot.Quote:
I think technological advances should be used to create new and efficient forms of fuel, and to try and fix the damaged environment. Humanity needs to put things right before trying to impose itself further.
Why will you be opposed to it? I mean your argument to date has been that earth doesn't need more people. However once we shape up, and meet your criteria, it should be okay then, correct? There must be some reason behind your decision, I mean you aren't just afraid of the unknown are you?Quote:
Cloning can wait until the planet is better able to support the people it's going to create/save. But even then, I'll still be opposed to it.
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You guys watch too many horror movies. Armies of zombie-clones aren't going to walk the earth, they'll be perfectly normal human beings. Actually they are perfectly normal human beings, since twins are technically clones. New advances in technology will simply produce twins that are months to years apart in age. Ontop of that, with new advances in stem cell research, we'll be able to grow compatible organs in a dish and fight off diseases. Then we'll move onto designing new species. It's the next evolutionary step people, it's either super-humans or robots, take your pick. :)
Oh no, my totally serious post wasn't funny! :eek:Quote:
Originally posted by Johnny
You're not even funny anymore.
Not knowing how to live within our natural state makes us intelligent how? I think it proves how stupid we really are, that we can't get by without trying to destroy and oppose every natural law and proccess.Quote:
How so? Nature has given us intelligence, and so we use it.
And what? You think these super human genetic freaks will somehow live better and more naturally than the regular ol' human? I am against having kids if you can adopt, yes.Quote:
The world can support many more people, the problem lies in how those people use it's resources. I don't see how this is a case against cloning. Should we not allow people to make kids the regular way, because there are plenty to adopt?
It won't help, but allowing it certainly has a lot of potential to hurt. And in a way, preventing the worse by preventing cloning is the intelligent thing to do.Quote:
The technology is not just going to be used to create babies, it'll be used in many other areas to improve human life. And what does the third world have to do with anything? We all know the poor suffer, how's a ban on cloning going to help?
No, but if we eliminated all trash research like this, and only allowed smart, earth friendly research, he might. Not that that matters, my point had nothing to do with any scientists chosen field.Quote:
The resources put into cloning aren't going to hurt advances in new energy sources. Some genetic engineer isn't going to pack up and move onto windmills, if he gets the boot.
Assuming that nearly impossible scenerio occured, no, it's still unnatural. If you live to be 1 or you live to be 100, it should be due to your body, and your genes, and basic lifestyle. Not life 'enhancing' procedures, drugs, or cloned body parts.Quote:
Why will you be opposed to it? I mean your argument to date has been that earth doesn't need more people. However once we shape up, and meet your criteria, it should be okay then, correct?
It's a nature thing. Or maybe just a EThugg thing. I fear nothing, only am saddened...Quote:
There must be some reason behind your decision, I mean you aren't just afraid of the unknown are you?
[quote]You guys watch too many horror movies. Armies of zombie-clones aren't going to walk the earth, they'll be perfectly normal human beings. Actually they are perfectly normal human beings, since twins are technically clones.[quote]
They are not human beings. Human beings are born due to copulation. No other procedure creates a real human. That's not to say it isn't as smart, or have the same feelings, but I would never call a clone a human. Ever. Did anybody even pat attention to The 6th Day and other movies that warn about this stuff?
I'll take robots. At least no one will pretend they are human. PS: Twins are born due to copulation, they are not cloned. Clones are not real people, they are animate objects that can be treated as inanimate.Quote:
New advances in technology will simply produce twins that are months to years apart in age. Ontop of that, with new advances in stem cell research, we'll be able to grow compatible organs in a dish and fight off diseases. Then we'll move onto designing new species. It's the next evolutionary step people, it's either super-humans or robots, take your pick. :)
How?Quote:
Originally posted by EThugg
It's very simple. You are defying your fate and nature and extending your life. It's bad for society, bad for the planet, bad for the natural balance of the planet, and is more ripe for misuse than any single scientific advancment outside of maybe atomic energy.
You get it, or you don't. I've provided all the reasons I'm going to, you agree, or don't. But be prepared when I beat the shit out of your little clone and treat it as if I just kicked your mailbox... (IE: Not like a human).Quote:
Originally posted by burgundy
How?