So I gave up milk.

I've always been a huge milk drinker. I guess I was raised on it, so didn't have much say in the matter. Unlike many friends I didn't stop drinking it as I grew up, and until three days ago it was my all-time most-consumed meal beverage. (Well, I guess it still is for the time being, though I won't be drinking any more.) I unfortunately have a very unhealthy all-American diet, so my affinity for milk seemed like one small bright spot.

I usually buy 2 gallons at a time. Maybe 10 years ago, when I was still living with my parents, my mom switched us to 1% fat milk. After some adjustment, I got used to the different taste. I still disliked skim, but eventually grew to like even that about a year ago. Anyway, three days ago I ran out of the last gallon of delicious skim milk, so it was almost time for a Ralph's run.

Before I went, for some reason I started surfing to sites about milk. I don't remember how I found it (my short-term memory sucks) but eventually I ended up at notmilk.com.

To put it simply, this guy, David Cohen, hates milk.

Though I dismissed him at first, for some reason I kept reading. I went to some other sites, such as milksucks.com (which I'd actually encountered before, but ignored since it was by PETA). I couldn't deny that there was a lot of evidence that milk was not the healthy beverage most of us believe it to be. It was the information about a hormone called IGF-I (insulin-like growth factor) that really disturbed me. This is a hormone that occurs in cows (and then, their milk) that are given Monsanto's bovine growth hormone to increase their milk output. Strangely, it is also found in the human body as a naturally-occuring growth hormone. Unfortunately, some researchers have linked it to prostate, breast, and other cancers.

Milk can be and is also contaminated with cow pus, feces, and an assortment of other chemicals. Of course, any and all dairy products will have such issues, since they all originate from cows and cow's milk.

And when you think about it, isn't it kind of gross that we're drinking the milk of another species? I'd have to say yes. As Cohen notes, no other animal in nature does this. Why do we? We find the thought of adults drinking human milk disgusting, but have no problem getting it from dirty bovines. Odd thinking, that.

Alright, so I'll kick my milk habit. But what to replace it with? Soy milk is the obvious answer. I read up on soy milk products and was impressed by soy's numerous virtues. After reading a bit of a warning about certain Soy drinks from Cohen I went to see what Ralph's had. The variety wasn't bad, but most had the carageenan ingredient that Cohen had warned about. I ended up getting Rice Dream Enriched (extra vitamins), 8th Continent Soy Vanilla and 8th Continent Soy Chocolate.

While I haven't opened the chocolate one yet, I more or less dislike Rice Dream and 8th Vanilla. They're reasonably gross. The former has some sort of rice aftertaste (surprise) and the latter is like sipping a mildly sweetened magnesium shake. I fear this will be a recurring pattern with other soy-based (or otherwise) milk-alternatives. I would like to enjoy some of the apparent health benefits of a milk to soy switch, but it will be hard if I can't stand the stuff I put my cereal in.

It turns out you can make your own soy drinks at home, and it's a lot cheaper than buying the commerical milk-alternative drinks. One product
made for this purpose is Cohen's SoyToy. It costs $150... quite steep for a product that's resultant beverages I'm not even sure I'll enjoy.

Anyway, that's where I am now... reluctantly sampling soy-based products and reading up on related nutrition topics. I also requested a free vegan starter's pack from PETA, offered at milksucks.com. (Hopefully that doesn't put me on their mailing lists now. :P) I really want to eat healthily, but it sure isn't easy.

interesting

...but you know, guys like...uh, n/m.

Yay, something else that causes cancer. Surprise, surprise.

BenT, I've always found many of the arguments for giving up cow's milk and switching to soy or a soy alternative to be good, for the most part. But that argument also has holes that can be shot in it.

Aside from the taste, generally I think MOST of the population would choose cow's milk over soy, there are so many other products out there many people enjoy: ice cream, cheese, chocolates, etc. that are made using milk, which means every product made using milk would also, technically, be bad for them, and they'd have to give it up or find some kind of soy-equivalent to buy. That's a hard pill for most people to swallow.

Secondly, it has been found in studies that many children whose parents are vegetarians and force that same kind of diet on them, have calcium deficiencies in them. Milk is the #1 source of calcium for kids, and there is no (or virtually no) calcium found in soy milk unless its put in as an additive. As a result, a lot of these kids develop brittle bones, have stunted growth spurts, etc.

So basically, drink cow's milk, and, yes, potentially drink a substance with cow's blood, piss, hormones, etc., I'm sure most of which are killed during pasteruization. Or don't drink cow's milk, and potentially deprive yourself (especially if your a kid) of necessary calcium and other nutrients.

In a way, its kind of a lose-lose situation. Personally I love milk and all dairy products in general way the hell too much to ever be able to give them up. People have been drinking or using milk products for centuries, and science has yet to come up with an exceptionally convincing reason to get us to stop doing just that. :)

now a days everything causes cancer. just add this to the long list.

If you're worried about calcium take calcium pills. You'll get more calcium out of them than out of milk anyway. I used to love milk when I was younger but I haven't drank any in about 7 years. If you like milk then why stop drinking it? It's definately not gonna kill you. I think there are many other things out there that will cause cancer before milk will.

Later all...

*sees Ethugg cross out BenT's name on his "people I really want to kill list"*

Milk is gross... no arguments here.

I'm lactose intolerant so my dairy intake comes from butter and the like, plus cow's milk tastes awful. Soy beverages are usually fortified with plenty of calcium, however you can just as easily get that from green veggies or supplements, and they won't make you fat. Carrageenan is derived from seaweed, it's a gum used in alot of food products like ice cream. There have been some studies where degraded carrageenan(molecular weight of 30,000 and lower), has caused ulcerations and cancer in animal test subjects. I wouldn't worry about it too much though.

Yay! BenT doesn't have to feel my wrath! Or at least, he's much farther down the list... ;)


I prefer Soy Dream Chocolate milk for, duh, drinking. I like Eden Soy Extra (Plain) for cereal, mash potato's, etc, but I have never found a tasty substitute for regular milk, for drinking. Silk is very popular I've found, but I just hated the taste. Try some Tofutti ice cream for a ice cream replacement, it's great. Cheese... well... there's no perfect dairy free cheeses, but I enjoy (again) Tofutti cheese slices melted on pizza, sanwiches etc, and there's this block cheese I forget the name of. It doesn't taste like cheese exactly, but I love it. I used to drink over a half gallon of milk a day, and giving up dairy was hard as hell. I waited quite a few years after giving up meat to give up dairy. The only thing I liked that I have yet to find a decent substitude for (besides regular milk) is eggs. There is no real replacment for eggs... that I know of. Maybe if I lived in CA I'd have more choices....

Tasty soy milk can be found in Chinatown usually. I haven't tried the stuff they sell in supermarkets like Soy Dream or whatever, but my (asian) roommate didn't really like it. The good stuff is usually independently bottled but they tend to have more sugar which is why they taste better. I have this cartoned Parmalat-like Soy milk that my parents bought for me and I get pleghm buildup in my throat when I drink it. It tastes alright but I'd rather have milk. :D

Milk is yucky. I drink NOTHING but water, and I take vitamins, so I really don't need anything else. :)

Amen Gongos, we should have a steak eating contest in front of his house. I will eat til I explode. :)

You can eat what you want elswhere, but if you were in front of my house, I'd shoot your ass.

And then be put into a federal prison, in which I'd be sure to come and laugh at you once I recover, or haunt you if I die.

Can we import some 'roo meat? And maybe some ostrich? And maybe cut off some chicken and turkey heads in front of his house..

Yes! Assortment of endangered species' ears, my treat! Then when we're done, we can cut off the toes and throw them at E's house.. :) I've taken this too far, but I would enjoy that 'roo meat. =P

It isn't funny.

Humans are supposed to eat meat. Not eating it is denying Nature. No one should feel bad about eating it, animals would eat you if they could get to you. We just found a better way to hunt. As for Milk and Cancer. Yeah just keep telling yourself that and then you will become a paranoid nut like all of those people. You can get cancer from everything, in 3 years someone will tell you you can get cancer from Soy. Someone probably already has. Its all based upon how much stuff it has that can give you cancer and the level of it it has. Cigarettes will give you cancer because its loaded with chemicals that naturally hurt the human body and you don't digest smoke, so the chemicals just build on your lungs soaking you in it, thus cancer. Milk ain't going to do jack shit to you. Milk is Milk. And Vegans are always a wealth of good information, just ask those people that refused their baby daughter milk, yeah their daughter almost died and the parents are facing criminal charges. Go Vegan!

:rolleyes: You said too many stupid things, you make my brain hurt.

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You said too many stupid things

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Pot. Kettle.

Maybe thats because you don't eat enough Meat. Drinking some Milk might help make you Human again.

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Originally posted by Rob
Pot. Kettle.

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If I say something stupid, it's usually a joke. Or just unpopular, which is often confused with stupid by the daft posters 'round these parts.

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Originally posted by Clash_Master
Maybe thats because you don\'t eat enough Meat. Drinking some Milk might help make you Human again.

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Drinking cows milk thats sole purpose is for baby cows will help make me human? The circus continues... please, wipe your feet and leave your brain outside before entering the tent.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Clash_Master
Humans are supposed to eat meat. Not eating it is denying Nature. No one should feel bad about eating it, animals would eat you if they could get to you. We just found a better way to hunt. As for Milk and Cancer. Yeah just keep telling yourself that and then you will become a paranoid nut like all of those people. You can get cancer from everything, in 3 years someone will tell you you can get cancer from Soy. Someone probably already has. Its all based upon how much stuff it has that can give you cancer and the level of it it has. Cigarettes will give you cancer because its loaded with chemicals that naturally hurt the human body and you don't digest smoke, so the chemicals just build on your lungs soaking you in it, thus cancer. Milk ain't going to do jack shit to you. Milk is Milk. And Vegans are always a wealth of good information, just ask those people that refused their baby daughter milk, yeah their daughter almost died and the parents are facing criminal charges. Go Vegan!

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Ryu fuck him!!!! lol much comedy! ryu laugh!

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If I say something stupid, it's usually a joke.

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It's a convincing act.

Anyways, I'd like to thank this topic for pushing me an inch closer to vegetarianism.

I never said Cows milk. Go grab ya mommies jugs and slam some back.

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Originally posted by Clash_Master
I never said Cows milk. Go grab ya mommies jugs and slam some back.

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You need help.

Good call BenT.

Check out these facts....

~MKU2ooo™

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Dangers Of Milk And
Dairy Products - The Facts
By Dave Rietz
Webmaster www.notmilk.com
7-6-2

Yes... milk is Mother Nature's "perfect food" ...for a calf... until it is weaned.
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Everything you know about cow's milk and dairy is probably part of a Dairy industry MYTH.
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Cow's milk is an unhealthy fluid from diseased animals that contains a wide range of dangerous and disease-causing substances that have a cumulative negative effect on all who consume it.
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MILK'S BASIC CONTENTS
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*ALL* cow's milk (regular and 'organic') has 59 active hormones, scores of allergens, fat and cholesterol.
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Most cow's milk has measurable quantities of herbicides, pesticides, dioxins (up to 200 times the safe levels), up to 52 powerful antibiotics (perhaps 53, with LS-50), blood, pus, feces, bacteria and viruses. (Cow's milk can have traces of anything the cow ate... including such things as radioactive fallout from nuke testing ... (the 50's strontium-90 problem).
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LEADING CAUSES OF DEATH IN AMERICA
http://webapp.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/leadcaus.html (1998)
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Rank Total Description
_
1 724,859 Heart Disease (think fats/cholesterol: meat/dairy)
2 541,532 Malignant Neoplasms (cancer: think toxins/milk/dairy)
2a 250,000 Medical system (drugs/etc. think ignorance/incompetence)
3 158,448 Cerebro-vascular (think meat milk and dairy)
4 112,584 Bronchitis Emphysema Asthma (think toxins/milk/dairy)
5 97,835 Unintentional Injuries and Adverse Effects
6 91,871 Pneumonia & Influenza (think weak immune systems and
mucus)
7 64,751 Diabetes (think milk/dairy)
7a 40,000+ Highway slaughter (men, women and children)
8 30,575 Suicide (think behavioral problems)
9 26,182 Nephritis (Bright's disease: inflammation of the
kidneys)
10 25,192 Liver Disease (think alcohol and other toxins)
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(2a and 7a were added for completeness)
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(note: Number 13 on the CDC list is -18,272 Homicide & Legal Intervention-. It is curious that the CDC would readily list law enforcement and homicides... and not the 250,000 deaths caused by the medical system!)
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CANCER FUEL
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Of those 59 hormones one is a powerful GROWTH hormone called Insulin- like Growth Factor ONE (IGF-1). By a freak of nature it is identical in cows and humans. Consider this hormone to be a "fuel cell" for any cancer... (the medical world says IGF-1 is a key factor in the rapid growth and proliferation of breast, prostate and colon cancers, and we suspect that most likely it will be found to promote ALL cancers).
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IGF-1 is a normal part of ALL milk... the newborn is SUPPOSED to grow quickly! What makes the 50% of obese American consumers think they need MORE growth? Consumers don't think anything about it because they do not have a clue to the problem... nor do most of our doctors.
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(See http://www.notmilk.com/igf1time.txt for a time line)
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QUANTITY
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Each bite of hard cheese has TEN TIMES whatever was in that sip of milk... because it takes ten pounds of milk to make one pound of cheese. Each bite of ice cream has 12 times ... and every swipe of butter 21 times whatever is contained in the fat molecules in a sip of milk.
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MONSANTO AND rbGH (Posilac)
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Monsanto Chemical Co., maker of fine poisons such as DDT, agent orange, Roundup and more... spent around half a billion dollars inventing a shot to inject into cows... to force a cow to produce MORE milk (for an already glutted taxpayer subsidized market).
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Unfortunately, they created *FIVE* errors in their Frankenstein Posilac (rbGH) shot that direly affected all test animals... but that important report (Richard, Odaglia & Deslex, 1989) has been hidden from everyone under Clinton's Trade Secrets act. The Canadians read enough of this report (before it was stolen) to reject rbGH for their country.
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Monsanto's Posilac creates additional IGF-1 in milk: up to 80% more.
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The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) insists that IGF-1 is destroyed in the stomach. If that were true, the FDA has proven that breast feeding cannot work. Common sense says their "finding" is ridiculous because this growth factor DOES make the baby calf grow (rapidly, as mother natured intended). Visit the Dairy Education Board at http://www.notmilk.com/deb/100399.html to review a DAIRY study that confirms what the FDA has lied about this for years.
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IGF-1 INCREASES
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This study involved two groups. One group consuming 12 ounces of milk a day and the other consuming the USDA recommended allowance of 24 ounces (three cups). This report notes that the participants consuming 12 ounces more milk per day... HAD A 10% RISE IN IGF-1 IN THEIR BLOOD SERUM! Now, consider that PER DAY, from ALL sources, the typical milk/dairy consumer ingests approximately 39% of daily diet from dairy... and that 10% increase becomes the "tip of the iceberg". We have NO idea of the non-dairy versus full-dairy difference but considering cancer rates... it has to be significant.
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FAT
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Whole milk 49% of the calories are from fat.
"2%" milk 35% of the calories are from fat.
Cheddar cheese 74% of the calories are from fat.
Butter 100% of the calories are from fat.
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Most folks suspect that butter is all fat. Most folks have no concept of the just how much fat is in the rest of milk and dairy. Perhaps the 54% of Americans who are obese need to comprehend that milk, ice cream, cheeses, yogurts, and all the OTHER products that use milk derivatives (casein, whey, lactose, colostrum) are most likely a significant cause for their weight and health problem.
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CALCIUM
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Calcium? Where do the COWS get calcium for their big bones? Yes... from plants! The calcium they consume from plants has a large amount of magnesium... necessary for the body to absorb and USE the calcium.
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The calcium in cow's milk is basically useless because it has insufficient magnesium content (those nations with the highest amount of milk/dairy consumption also have the highest rates of osteoporosis. Proof? How about a controlled study of 78,000 nurses over a period of 12 years?
_

Cows milk has three times the calcium as does human breast milk. No matter, neither are very usable because in order to be absorbed and used their MUST be an equal quantity of MAGNESIUM (as exists in the greens that cows eat to get all the calcium they need for their big bones). Milk has only enough magnesium to absorb around 11% (33mg per cup) of calcium.
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Per the USDA 8 ounces (one cup) of cows milk contains:
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Calcium, Ca mg 291.336
Magnesium, Mg mg 32.794
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The USDA recommends 1200mg of calcium per day. The USDA recommended three cups of milk a day only have 900mg of calcium. Some argue that only 1/3 of the magnesium is necessary. Mother nature seems to suggest it should be one to one. If the ratio for proper absorption were 1/3 magnesium to one calcium then no more than 300mg of that 900mg of calcium is usable. If, in fact, it is a one to one ratio... only 98.38mg of calcium is usable.
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It is not a matter of how much calcium one ingests... but how much one does not lose.
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PROTEIN
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Milk can be thought of as "liquid meat" because of its high protein content which, in concert with other proteins, may actually LEACH calcium from the body. Countries that consume high protein diets (meat, milk and dairy) have the highest rates of osteoporosis.
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THE 'WHOLESOME' PROTEIN MYTH
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87% of milk is water. That makes it VERY expensive water.
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Broken down into its basic groups... WHOLE MILK is:
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WATER FAT CASEIN OTHER PROTEIN
87% 3.25% 4% 1% 4.75
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(note: that is 3.25% "milkfat" which includes the 87% water.)
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80% of the protein in milk is casein. Casein is a powerful binder... a
polymer used to make plastics... and a glue that is better used to make
sturdy furniture or hold beer bottle labels in place. It is in
thousands of processed foods as a binder... as "something" caseinate.
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Casein is a powerful allergen... a histamine that creates lots of
mucus. The only medicine in Olympic athlete Flo-Jo's body was Benedryl,
a power antihistamine she took to combat her last meal... pizza.
For the whole Flo-Jo story:

BACTERIA
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Cow's milk is allowed to have feces in it. This is a major source for bacteria. Milk is typically pasteurized more than once before it gets to your table... each time for only 15 seconds at 162 degrees Fahrenheit.

Keep in mind that at room temperature the number of bacteria in milk DOUBLE around every 20 minutes. No wonder milk turns rotten very quickly.
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CHOLESTEROL
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The cholesterol content of those three glasses of milk is equal to what one would get from 53 slices of bacon. Do you know of any doctor who recommends that much bacon per day?
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KOSHER
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Is cow's milk and dairy "Kosher"? Consider this:
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"D-3 always is derived from an animal. The sunlight reaction that converts 7-dehydrocholesterol to vitamin D-3 is a 'pure' chemical reaction that occurs in your skin in certain cells."
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"The provitamin known as 7-dehydrocholesterol is extracted and isolated from the skins of mammals and purified." (Marian Herbert of the Vitamin D Workshop U of C)
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Vitamin D-3 can come from four different sources:
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Pig skin, sheep skin, raw fish liver, and pig brains. Most of the time, Vitamin D-3 is extracted from pig skin and sold to dairy processors.
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Short answer to "is milk kosher" - probably not.
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HOMOGENIZATION
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Large fat molecules cannot get through the intestinal wall into the bloodstream. The cream no longer rises... because homogenization breaks up those large molecules into small ones that DO get into the bloodstream! This becomes an expressway for any fat-borne toxins (lead, dioxin's, etc.) into your (otherwise) most protected organs.
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CUMULATIVE EFFECTS
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How does this impact humans who consume cow's milk and dairy? Obesity (over 50% of Americans and rising), heart disease, cancer, allergies, digestive problems, diabetes, asthma, desensitization to antibiotics, behavioral problems, and the constant ingestion of dioxin's, herbicides, pesticides (and anything else the cow eats that is not good for any critter), that winds up getting stored in HUMAN fat... is not healthy by any measure.
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Those who resist believing the truth should understand that MOST of the world's population CANNOT tolerate the lactose in cow's milk. Up to 95% of the black population, around 53% of the Hispanics, etc.) So much for cow's milk being "natures perfect food" for humans! Mother nature knows better.
_
Common sense question: Where was this massive "milk is a must" before refrigeration, pasteurization and mass transportation? Back when cows gave only 1-4 pounds a day it was quickly made into BUTTER and cheese! Now that those same cows have been tweaked and shot-up with Posilac to produce up to 55 or more pounds of milk per day... almost all year long... it is suddenly (after many thousands of years) a daily "staple". NOT!
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POLLUTION
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There are around 9.2 million dairy cows in the United states. Each dairy cow ingests around 330 pounds of feed (perhaps 50 pounds) and water (around 280 pounds or 33 gallons) per day. Allowing for the best dairy production of 55 pounds of milk per day (over ten times what mother nature designed the cow to produce) that means that what remains becomes "slurry".
_
That means around 275 pound of urine and feces per day... per cow, for a daily total of 2.53 BILLION pounds of pollution. Per year... that amounts to around 923 billion pounds of UNTREATED pollution entering our streams, rivers, lakes... and drinking water systems.
_
Cows are hot-blooded mammals. Like all other mammals they pass gas. Somewhat like elephants their compartmented digestive system is rather inefficient... which leads to the creation of MORE gas. During a Discovery Channel documentary on elephants a parting quip was that the average adult elephant passes enough methane gas per day to run a car about 20 miles.
_
Cows are not much better. The English New Scientist (page 5 -31.8.96) mentions that cattle produce around 48 kilograms (105 pounds) of methane each per year and that more bubbles out of the animals' manure. Dairy cows eat more because they produce milk. With 9.2 million dairy cows times a minimum of 100 pounds of methane gas per year... that amounts almost a billion pounds of methane gas released into the atmosphere each year. With around 100 million beef cattle... pigs, sheep, and other "factory farmed" animals it should not be difficult to fathom the extent of this problem.
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This means that "Beef is a greenhouse-intensive food" and a major cause of global warming (with dairy a significant part of the problem).
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Another major point is:
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"Milk is a very strong pollutant: it is about 400 times more polluting than untreated sewage. To put it another way, 1,000 gallons of milk has the same polluting potential as the untreated sewage from a town of 7,000 people." Morlais Owen. Chief Scientist for Welsh Water. North Wales Weekly News. 24.3.88.
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SOME QUESTIONS ANSWERED
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Q: What is WHEY?
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A: Whey results when the FAT and CASEIN are removed from milk.
In making cheese, the curds become the cheese.
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Whey's main components are bovine serum albumin and lactalbumin.
There are other hormones contained in whey.
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Q: What happens to the:
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59 hormones, scores of allergens herbicides, pesticides, dioxins
up to 52 antibiotics
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When made into cheese?
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A: Everything gets concentrated.
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When made into butter?
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A: The allergens get lost: but the dioxin's and
pesticides and antibiotics remain in the fat.
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In the digestive system?
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A: Steroid hormones survive, as do dioxins and antibiotics.
In homogenized milk, protein hormones survive... depending upon the
gastric pH, some protein hormones in cheese survive, but not all...
eleven steroid hormones survive.
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AND WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?
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Eventually, everything is broken down, but not before the chemical messengers (hormones) "deliver their message."
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Each of those hormones and proteins acts differently and has different rates of degradation. BOTTOM LINE... they all survive to a certain degree... and the effects are cumulative.
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OTHER HEATH-TRASHING SUBSTANCES IN COW'S MILK
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Whey: Blood proteins. Bovine serum lactalbumin has been identified as a trigger for diabetes and other autoimmune diseases.
_Lactose: Two sugars. Glucose and galactose. Galactose has been indentified as a trigger for glaucoma. There are several columns that cover lactose (covering galactose and galactosemia):
_ _
Perhaps the BEST single reference:
http://www.notmilk.com/a-z.txt

_QUOTES
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"It's not natural for humans to drink cow's milk. Humans milk is for humans. Cow's milk is for calves. You have no more need of cow's milk than you do rats milk, horses milk or elephant's milk. Cow's milk is a high fat fluid exquisitely designed to turn a 65 lb baby calf into a 400 lb cow. That's what cow's milk is for!" --Dr Michael Klaper MD
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"I no longer recommend dairy products after the age of 2 years. Other calcium sources offer many advantages that dairy products do not have." --Dr. Benjamin Spock
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Dave Rietz

I say eat whatever you think is good for you because you never know, some people who end up eating 5 steaks a day may live to be 85 perfectly happy, some people may be vegans and die from stress and anxiety from looking for a vegan meal in Japan, or you may live a very good lifestyle and get run over by a herd of kangaroos. Life is short, enjoy it. :p

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Originally posted by SearchManX
Life is short, enjoy it. :p

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I'm not sure if you are implying it, but just so people know, I enjoy eating vegan very much, and vegans aren't just sad mopey people who are denying themselves stuff cuz they hate themselves. I love me very much...:D

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Originally posted by 88mph
Ryu fuck him!!!! lol much comedy! ryu laugh!

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Eh, ryuROCKst does it better.

Quote:

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Originally posted by EThugg


I'm not sure if you are implying it, but just so people know, I enjoy eating vegan very much, and vegans aren't just sad mopey people who are denying themselves stuff cuz they hate themselves. I love me very much...:D

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I don't mind vegans/vegetarians as long as they don't tell me what I should eat. I wish there was a smiley for eating foods...

: insert smiley eating here :

I do find it odd though that someone decided to drink Milk from a cow, and what about those Greeks and that Goat milk? Somewhere in the timeline of history someone looked at the naked breast of a woman, and then looked at the udder of a cow and went, "Hey those look a little alike! I got me an Idea!" I guess most people accept the who Cows Milk thing since so many of our common foods have milk in it, plus people started drinking Cows milk like 2 thousand years ago. But whatever.

But I can not trust Soy milk personally. How the hell do you make milk out of Soy?! Its not milk, its soy liquid or something. At least when I see Milk streaming out of an udder I can say, "Hey, thats milk!" When I see a soy bean I go, "Hey thats a soy bean."

I read all of those facts about Milk and I still don't fear cancer from it. Until people start dropping like flys and "DON'T DRINK MILK ITS AS BAD AS CIGARETTES!" Is the headline on USA Today I will stop drinking it and fear it. But everything has something that links to something that can link to something that links to something that links to cancer.

Blah blah blah....

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Milk can be and is also contaminated with cow pus, feces, and an assortment of other chemicals. Of course, any and all dairy products will have such issues, since they all originate from cows and cow's milk.

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And non-dairy foods don't have similar problems? Do you know how many insects are legally allowed in even vegetarian foods? Believe it or not, most everything we eat is quite filthy.

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Originally posted by Atariguy
And non-dairy foods don't have similar problems? Do you know how many insects are legally allowed in even vegetarian foods? Believe it or not, most everything we eat is quite filthy.

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Sure, but milk is especially bad in that regard. It's one of the few accepted foodstuffs that we harvest from another species' nether orifices. That's gotta count for something. ;)

Btw, thanks for all the thoughtful replies, to those who made them. I haven't had much time to post here lately, but I read 'em.

Quote:

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Originally posted by BenT
Sure, but milk is especially bad in that regard.

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No, you've just spent too much time reading websites run by lunatics who are fixated on one part of a normal diet as being incredibly bad for you. The truth is that pretty much everything is horribly dirty. You know that many vegetables are grown in soil that was fertilized with manure? And the nutrients in the manure are used by the plant to grow, and actually end up in the vegetable? OHMYGOD VEGANS ARE EATING SHIT. That's pretty much the same conclusion being drawn by the milk lunatics.

Oh, and if you're worried about what you're ingesting, never, NEVER eat food you haven't prepared yourself. You really don't want to know what goes on behind closed doors in restaurants and such. Even the high class ones.

Saint of Killers said it all. Its time we evolve into energy.

Milk is bad for you by itself, not just because of things that might get in it. I don't really care, drink what you want. Just don't act like someones retarded for wanting to be healthier or have higher morals (depending on the situation and person) even if you feel that person is going about it wrong.

PS: I never eat at resturants or fast food places. And yes, I'm perfectly ok with eating plants fertilized by shit. Even shit provided by carnivourous animals. I'm not ok with shit provided by animals fed 'grab bags' of slop they shouldn't be eating though... that shit is what spreads disease to animals and plants.

I hope you get cancer from a Carrot.

Milk is good for you. But hey if you want to live a short life, that's your concern. You might try to find a substitute for the lack of nutrients though.:)

.....Well now we know Bio is into believing propoganda, and it only took, what, 15 posts? =P And most people who don't drink milk take vitamins, including myself. (cereal being the exception with milk)