Japanese Developers Safe Haven?

[Tracer]

But they have not dominated the gaming market and it would simply be a matter of preference for American developers to take to console once again.

ºTracer

[Schlep]

I don't know about all of the Japanese developers migrating to the Gamecube, that does seem like wishful thinking to me. To the main point of Eastern-developed games vs. Western-developed games, I think this is a battle that Japanese developers as a whole are beginning to lose in both the US and in Europe/Australia.

If you look at the majority of games that are going through the roof right now, they're western developed games, from the more obvious sports and extreme games, to the traditional genres, to genres that are just getting started. When I look back at my gaming over the past year, I've played the hell out of and/or gotten excited about (without later getting disappointed, *looks in Sunshine's general direction*) 5 Japanese developed games. Gunvalkyrie, Jet Set Radio Future, Virtua Fighter 4, King of Fighters 2000 and Kingdom Hearts. Meanwhile, I've got Grand Theft Auto: Vice City, Starfox Adventures, Metroid Prime, Robotech: Battlecry, Ratchet & Clank, Sly Cooper, Splinter Cell and Mech Assault, all of which are Western developed. This may not seem too revolutionary, but during the transition from PSX/N64 to PS2/GC/Xbox, I imported almost all of my games for Dreamcast. Pretty amazing to me when I reflect back on it.

Are Japanese game companies going away? Ha....no. I do see alot more of these mergers taking place, though. The Western companies show no sign of relenting in this next year and it's looking like an all out battle for your dollars by both territories' developers. In all honesty, I love all the games, but I'm hoping this new competition gives some of the Japanese developers a huge kick in the ass that they've sorely needed for a couple years now. Moving to Gamecube? I'd like em all to move to GC or Xbox or both. Seeing a game in progressive or hearing it in DD5.1/DPL II doesn't make it a better game, but it sure as hell makes it alot prettier.

[Johnny Nighttrain]

Originally posted by StriderKyo
Okay.

Originally posted by Schlep
I don't know about all of the Japanese developers migrating to the Gamecube, that does seem like wishful thinking to me.

how can you guys seriously call this wishfull thinking? Capcom, Namco, Sega, Enix, and Square are all giving GameCube big support. although Square and Enix's support isn't out in the open yet, they both ahve subsidiary companys with Nintendo, so you know there's stuff in the works for sure.

it's not wishfull thinking. all these companys are giving Nintendo huge support. even if they're not exclusive, i just don't see how you guys can say this. were's the logic behind this? pleeeeeeeease explain this one to me.

[Schlep]

Originally posted by Lucas Barton
how can you guys seriously call this wishfull thinking? Capcom, Namco, Sega, Enix, and Square are all giving GameCube big support. although Square and Enix's support isn't out in the open yet, they both ahve subsidiary companys with Nintendo, so you know there's stuff in the works for sure.

it's not wishfull thinking. all these companys are giving Nintendo huge support. even if they're not exclusive, i just don't see how you guys can say this. were's the logic behind this? pleeeeeeeease explain this one to me.

You're trying to paint it like every Japanese developer is running full speed towards the GC when that simply isn't the case. Are they developing some games for it? Yes. Is it more Japanese support than the N64 had? Definitely. Are they abandoning PS2 and Xbox?

You've got RE Online, Devil May Cry 2, and Onimusha 3 heading for the PS2. Dino Crisis and Steel Battalion 1 (and online?) heading for Xbox. Kingdom Hearts 2 and Final Fantasy X-2 heading to the PS2. Soul Calibur 2 heading to all systems.

It's not that I don't want to be all happy and giddy that companies are starting to give the Gamecube some much deserved attention, it's just obvious that the Playstation 2 is way too entrenched worldwide for any of those companies to kick it to the curb.

[gamevet]

Originally posted by Schlep
You're trying to paint it like every Japanese developer is running full speed towards the GC when that simply isn't the case. Are they developing some games for it? Yes. Is it more Japanese support than the N64 had? Definitely. Are they abandoning PS2 and Xbox?

You've got RE Online, Devil May Cry 2, and Onimusha 3 heading for the PS2. Dino Crisis and Steel Battalion 1 (and online?) heading for Xbox. Kingdom Hearts 2 and Final Fantasy X-2 heading to the PS2. Soul Calibur 2 heading to all systems.

It's not that I don't want to be all happy and giddy that companies are starting to give the Gamecube some much deserved attention, it's just obvious that the Playstation 2 is way too entrenched worldwide for any of those companies to kick it to the curb.

No, they're not going to kick the PS2 to the curb, when it come to making games for it, but when you consider the amount of Western developed games, that they'll have to compete against on the PS2, the Gamecube does look like a more favorable place to put those Japanese games. You also have to consider, that the PS2 is practically maxed out, as far as graphic potential is concerned. Nintendo's camp offers more powerful hardware in the Gamecube, a steady sales pace in all regions, and potential to develope games for the GBA, which is starting to outsell the PS2 in Japan. The Xbox is'nt Japanese developed games friendly, and those Japanese game that have been developed for it, have been pushed to the wayside by those US gamers who own the system.


Right now, the Gamecube is looking pretty good, for developers that don't want to be lost in a sea of games provided on the PS2 and want to make games that are cutting edge in graphics. Something the PS2 won't provide them.

[Schlep]

Originally posted by gamevet
No, they're not going to kick the PS2 to the curb, when it come to making games for it,

Ok, so then what's this about?

but when you consider the amount of Western developed games, that they'll have to compete against on the PS2, the Gamecube does look like a more favorable place to put those Japanese games.

Gamecube's a favorable place to put just about anything right now because of how incredibly small the library is.

You also have to consider, that the PS2 is practically maxed out, as far as graphic potential is concerned.

I don't know why you say this. Kingdom Hearts and Ratchet & Clank are both very nice looking games, and Devil May Cry 2 and Resident Evil Online both look better than either of those games, imo. There's always tricks that developers learn to make the system push more than thought possible. Even though Saga Frontier 2 wasn't my favorite game ever, I never thought anyone would be able to make a game that looked like that on PSX. Starfox on SNES. Virtua Fighter 2 on Genesis. Shenmue on DC. The list goes on. Even if it were the case, and the hardware were truly maxed out, when was the last time 90% of the developers cared about that anyway? If they were truly looking at getting the best looking game out there, they would've gone with N64 in that generation (or Dreamcast if you consider that to be part of the 32/64bit era). They could put games right now on Xbox, etc.

Nintendo's camp offers more powerful hardware in the Gamecube, a steady sales pace in all regions, and potential to develope games for the GBA, which is starting to outsell the PS2 in Japan.

Steady sales pace, yes. High sales pace? I dunno. I try not to get into those numbers, but from what I've seen, the PS2 absolutely dwarfs the GC. And I thought developers could make games for GBA regardless (unless they were Square)?

The Xbox is'nt Japanese developed games friendly, and those Japanese game that have been developed for it, have been pushed to the wayside by those US gamers who own the system.

The hardware has nothing to do with that.

Right now, the Gamecube is looking pretty good, for developers that don't want to be lost in a sea of games provided on the PS2 and want to make games that are cutting edge in graphics. Something the PS2 won't provide them.

The way you say it, it sounds like they're just looking for a place to dump their garbage.

[Andy]

Originally posted by Lucas Barton
Capcom, Namco, Sega, Enix, and Square are all giving GameCube big support.

What are Namco and Sega doing? Looks to me like Sega is giving a lot more to PS2 and XB, and Namco is giving a lot more to PS2, aside from both of their Nintendo co-developed stuff.

[Johnny Nighttrain]

Originally posted by Andy
What are Namco and Sega doing?

Namco is making 2 Exclusive RPGs, Co-Developing Star Fox, possibility of a Ridge Racer game, and although these other games aren't exclusive, i'd still consider Soul Calibur, New Racing Game Project, and 2-3 un-anounced exclusive games that we don't know about yet. not to mention that they co-developed the TriForce Board, and that Nintendo is publishing all of Namco's games on Nintendo systems.

there's no way you can say that they're not buddy buddy.

as for Sega, there's as many GameCube games in development that we know about as there is xbox games that we know about. off the top of my head, we know about what? Panzer and F-Zero? i guess i through in Sega just cause they're important to us, but i guess we should stick to major japanese developers.

oh wait, i forgot about Virtua Fighter Quest. i guess that makes it 2 to 1. although i get the feeling im forgetting some xbox games. still, let me know if im wrong.

[Viper]

Originally posted by SearchManX
Code Veronica wasn't developed by Sega...it was handled by Flagship as usual, I think.

It was actually programmed by Sega, under supervision from Capcom. Capcom came up with the scenario and basic game design concepts, and then went to Sega to get them to program it for them. Shinji Mikami wanted to make a game that took as much advantage of the DC's hardware as possible, and felt that he could only do so by getting Sega themselves to program it for him.

[gamevet]

Originally posted by Schlep
"Ok, so then what's this about?"

It's about other options for their games, besides PS2.



"Gamecube's a favorable place to put just about anything right now because of how incredibly small the library is."



The library of games available on the Gamecube is about as big as the library of games available on the Xbox. The difference is, that the Xbox caters more to a Western style of gamer.



"I don't know why you say this. Kingdom Hearts and Ratchet & Clank are both very nice looking games, and Devil May Cry 2 and Resident Evil Online both look better than either of those games, imo. There's always tricks that developers learn to make the system push more than thought possible. Even though Saga Frontier 2 wasn't my favorite game ever, I never thought anyone would be able to make a game that looked like that on PSX. Starfox on SNES. Virtua Fighter 2 on Genesis. Shenmue on DC. The list goes on. Even if it were the case, and the hardware were truly maxed out, when was the last time 90% of the developers cared about that anyway? If they were truly looking at getting the best looking game out there, they would've gone with N64 in that generation (or Dreamcast if you consider that to be part of the 32/64bit era). They could put games right now on Xbox, etc."


The PSX offered a better developing environment, than the PS2 does in this generation. That was one reason, that the harder to program Saturn, did'nt see too many titles that took advantage of the 3-d prowess of the Saturn. Sega made some incredible 3-d games on the Saturn (Sega Rally 95, Panzer Dragoon series, Manx TT, Daytona CCE and Virtua Fighter 2). The PS2 seems to be in the same kind of problem, that the Saturn was. Most of the high profile game developers have stated their dislike of the PS2 hardware, because of how hard it is to get the true potential out of the hardware, unlike the Gamecube and Xbox.



"Steady sales pace, yes. High sales pace? I dunno. I try not to get into those numbers, but from what I've seen, the PS2 absolutely dwarfs the GC. And I thought developers could make games for GBA regardless (unless they were Square)?"


Square wanted in on the GBA market, but Nintendo told them that if they wanted to make games on the GBA, they also had to commit to the Gamecube.



"The way you say it, it sounds like they're just looking for a place to dump their garbage."

Not a place to dump their garbage, but a place that they can make a quality game and have a userbase that will take notice of it. Look at the top sellers on the PS2 in the US and you'll see titles like Madden, SOCOM and Grand Theft Auto III taking the top spot in sales. Meanwhile a game like Madden on the Gamecube is practically ignored by it's userbase. I've seen Madden selling for $30 on the Gamecube, meanwhile the PS2 and Xbox versions are selling at full price. The Gamecube owners seem to have a more Japanese style of taste in games. Has Sega really had a bad seller on the console? Only titles like Soccer Slam and older titles like Crazy Taxi have'nt fared as well on the Gamecube, meanwhile PSO, Sonic Adventure 2 battle and Super Monkeyball have done very well.

[Yoshi]

Originally posted by Black Arts Viper
It was actually programmed by Sega, under supervision from Capcom. Capcom came up with the scenario and basic game design concepts, and then went to Sega to get them to program it for them. Shinji Mikami wanted to make a game that took as much advantage of the DC's hardware as possible, and felt that he could only do so by getting Sega themselves to program it for him.

You're absolutely right. I believe it was handled by many of the same people who did Deep Fear on Saturn.

[NeoZeedeater]

Nextech also worked on Code Veronica. I'm confused as to what they're part was though.

[Schlep]

I get what you're trying to say, but I stand firm in my opinion that 10-15 GC games from prominent publishers doesn't make for a mass exodus from the PS2. If it's not about game companies moving from PS2 to GC, then I missed the original point somewhere. From Lucas' original thread, I thought he was pretty much saying, "Look! All the Japanese developers are dumping PS2 in favor of GC? Grrrreat!"

because of this, i think japanese developers are gonna start looking for a safe haven. obviously the xbox is out of the question, so an exodus to the GameCube doesn't seem unlikely to me at all right now. just hear me out...

It looks more like dabbling than an exodus to me, and this all shines through as rabid fanboyism. I think liking a company and their system or whatnot is fine, but letting it skew your perception of reality is another. If 2 years from now, that many powerhouse Japanese developers completely or almost completely abandon the PS2 in favor of GC, I'll eat a memory stick.