Superman

[Satsuki]

I wish they'd kill off superman once and for all. BATMAN RULESSSSSS!!!!!!

[Bacon McShig]

I wish the American comic market would take a look at the Japanese (and other countries', for that matter) comic market past it's surface. There's two major things lacking in the American market; familiarity and finiteness.

With the former, it's not hard to see the American market's chaotic disarray. Books are constantly changing artists and creative teams, and no matter how much the readers try and say "it's nice to see a new take" or what have you, they'd rather not have to "get used to" the way a new artist draws the characters, creative team after creative team, ad infinitum. Get people who do it right, and stick with 'em. We're seeing a small shift towards this in the pheripheral studios (Vertigo, MAX), but it should really be the rule, rather than the exception.

As for finiteness (finity?), well, here's a movie pitch for you. We start off with a few main characters, but we'll keep adding more every sequel. The basic outline for these characters' motivation may or may not be revealed in the first movie, and you'll probably only recieve a highly ambiguous hint as to ONE of their pasts once every 3-4 sequels, if you get anything at all. The cast changes every movie. And each movie, rather than making you feel closer to a resolution, they make you feel further away.

That's American comics.

It's time for DC and Marvel to wake up and realize that the best stories actually resolve issues throughout, parts that actually elicit response (most notably, deaths) shouldn't be undone ad nauseum, and that without even the possibility of an end, people just stop caring.

[MVS]

Matt, It was beyond perfect

That ones good, as well.

I agree, though. I think batman, if it had a definite end and he wasn't perpetually 30, would be much better.

Cowboy Bebop was a downer at the end, but it didn't make the entire series any worse, much better, actually.

BATMAN RULESSSSSS!!!!!!

Indeed he does.

[M]

I think one of the main problems with superman is what he is. What he represents. When you have a super being, indestructable, unkillable, after a while it gets very old.

some of the best superman related comics have been the ones embracing his humanity.

In a continueing story, imagine the difficulty of coming up with new story ideas and plots and villians to keep your audience captivated.

So he's superman. He saves day, flying around. He always wins. He a freaking boy scout. He does no wrong. He will never die. He will never go bad. and if he did, you know it would be some alien influence or Poison Ivy or something like that.

Unlike most superheros, we have one of the originals, whose been around so long and been through so much that its starting to repeat.

Its a struggle for new ideas. more so, i think, than any other comic character. If only because superman is so popular and so well known. The sub-mariner, the human torch, the phantom, even zorro go threw periods of obsurity and then some talent finds them and revamps them and we fall in love with them all over again.

Thats what they need to do with Supes. Not kill him off. Just let him fall in obsurity until some talent shows up with a killer idea and boom!

Boom people. Boom. we love him all over again, even more than before.

I love the idea of superman. I honestly dont care about his past that much, just who he is and what he's about. what they wanted him to be in the 50's doesnt matter to me. I want a new, fresh persepctive on him. I want him to be personalized by the artist and the writer. I want to see him go bad some day actually. Really bad.

and I loved the death and life of superman. I cry every time I read it when he dies though I know he comes back.

[Tragic]

With the former, it's not hard to see the American market's chaotic disarray. Books are constantly changing artists and creative teams, and no matter how much the readers try and say "it's nice to see a new take" or what have you, they'd rather not have to "get used to" the way a new artist draws the characters, creative team after creative team, ad infinitum. Get people who do it right, and stick with 'em. We're seeing a small shift towards this in the pheripheral studios (Vertigo, MAX), but it should really be the rule, rather than the exception.

I completely agree. The worst is when the artist changes right in the middle of a story arc. Especially if it's just for one issue. A lot of the time I can't even appriciate the new artist since I've gotten used to the old one, it feels wrong if it's too drastic of a change.

[Mzo]

My biggest gripe with Superman authors, both for the comics (but especially) for the cartoon is their total inability to specify his limits.

This comes from their inability to think up clever storylines and villains that will actually CHALLENGE the Man of Steel in creative ways. This is why Luthor the businessman is a brilliant arch-nemesis.

To point out a few things that piss me off... in the cartoons, Superman's race with the Flash ended in a tie, right? Yet it takes him 10 or so minutes to catch up to some criminal wearing a jetpack. WTF??

Justice League is by far the WORST offender, with an entire 10 minute chase sequence involving the Flash... and a motherfucking truck. THE FLASH CAN OWN THE TRUCK AND THE DRIVER IN SECONDS. WHY THE FUCK IS HE CHASING IT AND LETTING HIMSELF BE SHOT AT, CAUSING INCREDIBLE PROPERTY DAMAGE???

I hope the upcoming Titans cartoon is better. I always liked them (Starfire's hot in an '80s kinda way), and this looks to have an anime-wannabe style to it. SUGOI ROBIN-CHAN KAWAII KEKEKEKE!

I love the idea of superman.

Fuck yeah. When they have some sort of world-stopping crossover, and he's shown as the leader, the first (though I think Bats was before him, in the DC timeline), and the best. He's such a great symbol for heroism that it fucking rocks when he's used right, but...

BATMAN RULESSSSSS!!!!!!

Can't argue with the facts.

I love the speech that Gordon gives the new Commish about the Bat in DKR, about who he is and what he does and how it's too big to judge. And I love when she realizes it, as he rides through town horseback with the SOBs. Brilliant.

DK2 was, however, complete and total ass.

PS - Fuck Marvel.

[rezo]

hope the upcoming Titans cartoon is better. I always liked them (Starfire's hot in an '80s kinda way), and this looks to have an anime-wannabe style to it. SUGOI ROBIN-CHAN KAWAII KEKEKEKE!

Its horrible. Don't watch it. Or, you know, watch it once to confirm.


I've been watching the reruns of the original Superman series recently(probably how I ended up posting in this topic). I think that's the best version of him I've seen. He isn't just flying out and stopping bullets with his chest whenever he hears a scream, he's playing Clark Kent and outwitting the criminals into revealing themselves. He comes up with the corniest excuses for why he isn't actually Superman whenever Jimmy and Lois pester him and they just eat it up. He's so damn sure of himself when he's doing it too. That's what he should be. Someone so damn greater than everyone else that knows it, and his adventures should consist of him making every criminal that challenges him look stupid. With an occasional kryptonite story thrown in so that the gang at the paper can help him out every now and then.

[gamevet]

Fuck yeah. When they have some sort of world-stopping crossover, and he's shown as the leader, the first (though I think Bats was before him, in the DC timeline), and the best. He's such a great symbol for heroism that it fucking rocks when he's used right, but...

Nope, Superman debuted in 1938, batman 1939.


http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stat...es/HEROES.html



On a side note:


One time I was looking at my Grandmothers bookshelf and she had an old Superman paperback. I don't recall the date of the paperback, but it had the debut of Superman comic in it. The storyline explained Superman's powers and how they worked. It explained how Superman could fly. It said that Superman could leap, like a grasshopper, but at incredible heights. By that theory, Superman was'nt flying, but leaping incredible distances across the earth.

[Satsuki]

PS - Fuck Marvel.

I wish *sooooo* much I could say this, but Deadpool, Agent X, and Taskmaster keep my small love flame for marvel still burning. Besides Batman, the first 6 issues of Agent X have been my fav comic book experiences so far =X

But anyway......I'm going to have to be one of those "burn in hell, superman" nerds. I was never fond of the guy, I was never fond of the villians, or the story, or anything. I've heard rumors of good Superman stories out there, but i personally haven't found em.

Batman on the other hand, I could talk about nonstop for hours. seriously. I have. without the influence of alcohol!

[Regus]

On a related note, I recently waited 3 hours in line at Six Flags so I could ride the new Superman Roller Coaster.

I was okay, but Nitro is better.