October Comic Book Thread

[BEBOPlover]

Ultimate Six is good but is just starting off to damn slow, talk about build-up -- I hope that pay-of is worth it by issue six. I wonder who the sixth villian is going to be. I dont quite understand Osborn's quote at the end of issue #2 when he says who he has planned for the slot,,unless he plans on blackmailing ..the .uuhh person into it...BTW when the FUCK is Ultimates #12 coming out ???

New X-Men , I think is good right now.. I worry about where its headed after Morrison leaves though...or after Magster swaps the magnetic poles of the Earth... . I agree with you on the lameness of the New Brotherhood in this series.The design of all of them looks like something Mike Allred should be drawing. not Jimenez.

Bendis is notorious for slow plot development. I never really mind though. After I finish reading one of his series it's always a pleasure to go through them over again in one sitting. Number three really moved. I hope Bendis continues to do small cross-overs in the Ultimate universe. I love the dialogue between the characters.

I'm torn over New X-Men. I really, really liked Xorn. I may be in the minority, and I guess it was Morrison's intention to pull us in and then break our hearts. I look foward to his final three issues and will sincerely miss him on Marvel books for the next three years.

Whoever asked about Ultimates #12, well, who the hell knows, dude? I wish Cassady would take it over. Planetary is bi-monthly, I bet he could get the Ultimates out on a bi-monthly status as well. That would be more then the useless Hitch is doing. And before I get death threats, Hitch is my favorite artist after Cassady.

I can't believe all the "Hush" hate going on here. Like Frank Miller's recent Batman yarn, I don't belive "Hush" was a classic by any means, but it was a damn fun read each and every month. Loeb really did fan service by creating a story where Jim Lee would be forced to draw many of the favorites in Gotham. I think it was some of the best work of Jim's career. I hope he comes on to do an Ultimate project.

Hey, where are all my Planetary fans? My favorite comic of all-time gets issue # 17 next week and I couldn't be happier. Anyone else psyched?

[bloodyarts]

I can't believe all the "Hush" hate going on here. Like Frank Miller's recent Batman yarn, I don't belive "Hush" was a classic by any means, but it was a damn fun read each and every month. Loeb really did fan service by creating a story where Jim Lee would be forced to draw many of the favorites in Gotham. I think it was some of the best work of Jim's career. I hope he comes on to do an Ultimate project.

Fans of Jim Lee ate this arc up like a loaf of raisin bread, toasted with just a little butter and a medium glass of cold milk. *drool* Frankly, I think this was the plan all along. Boost Batman sales via Jim Lee art. The fans will buy it (multiple issues, even) no matter WHAT the story is.

I can't speak for anyone else who weren't particularly pleased with this arc, but the Hush hate on my part stems from the fact that the story seems to be an excuse to have Jim Lee draw a shitload of Batman characters (having all the women look the same and all men's builds identical) and that's it.

The motive behind the whole thing is about as unbelievable and ridiculous as comic vendettas go; "Your parents died and you inherited their money. Mine lived, so I get zilch. I'll kill you for that!" Never mind that Bruce's parents were MURDERED and prior to that Bruce's dad SAVED Tommy's mom. Never mind that Tommy inherited their money later on anyway.. No, none of that matters. You were rich before me and therefore I hate you and must ruin your life. Schumacher couldn't possibly do worse. This coming from one of today's most respected and prolific comic writers makes me think "Hack Job". Just threw a story together featuring a bunch of Bat-people for Jim Lee to draw and sell assloads of books.

What was Hush's ultimate goal? To kill Bruce? He could've done that anytime. In fact, he operated on him. Could'a just.. slipped with the knife there. To drive Batman nuts? To keep him guessing as to who the new "mystery villain" is? And then what? Why is the damned arc called "Hush" in the first place? Because the readers aren't supposed to know this is a thinly-veiled gimmick to sell books?

And like I said before, every point in the story that had the potential to be cool was shot down in the very issue it was born. There were better Bat-books on the shelves while this drivel was being consumed by the Lee-mings.

No one messes with Jason Todd. He's dead. It's a comic staple, along with the death of Gwen Stacy. Any attempts to bring them back in any form will bring shame to the writer responsible. Now we have to deal with the possibility of a Lazarus Pit-dipped Jason Todd (which itself is full of holes) or the mystery behind where his remains are.

Oooo, Riddler knows who Batman is. That makes him much more dangerous.. No, it doesn't, and Batman himself explains why. The Riddler can strike a little closer to home now, but his modus operandi will always be the same and he dare not clue anyone else in on the secret. So what was the point? We're back to Riddler-prime, who was dangerous in his own right when written properly.

Hey, where are all my Planetary fans? My favorite comic of all-time gets issue # 17 next week and I couldn't be happier. Anyone else psyched?

I haven't followed this book since Issue #3. I don't even remember the cast anymore. What have I missed?

[bloodyarts]

Okay, here's a perfect example of a plot that actually goes somewhere AND sells books (New X-Men/Grant Morrison), and one that is just designed to boost sales (Batman-Hush/Jeph Loeb)

SPOILERS.... THIS LINK CONTAINS SPOILERS.... AVAST YE X-GEEKS, SPOILERS AHEAD....!!!!!!







http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&...n.co.uk&rnum=1

[BEBOPlover]

Fun, fun, fun. That's what "Hush" was. Did it come across as unvelievable and completely ridiculous? Yeah, but the comic medium can pull junk like that and still come out looking respectable.

I don't know any compaines that create a duo of writer and artist without the intent of selling a shit load of books. I mean, it doesn't take a marketing prodigy to realize if you put a fantastic artist like Jim on an icon character it's going to boost sales.

Hush is no where near the level of Grant Morrison's X-Men, and I never compared Hush to any other book on the market besides Miller's recent Batman. And even then I only offered up that it was a fun read. You sound like you take your reading very serious. I can dig it, but we'll be disagreeing often.

[bloodyarts]

Well, some books I take more seriously than others. Batman, X-Men, Avengers, etc.. I expect a continuing drama with real ramifications to the characters therein. The characters are portrayed realistically in a fantasy setting, so the reader is forced to apply real-world sensibilities, at the cost of suspending your disbelief.

Of course, the primary goal of any comic is to make money. And of course, when you put top-shelf talent on top-shelf books, the result will be lots of hurtin' forests. But in the case of this comic in particular, there came the promise of far-reaching ramifications, characters being forever changed and nothing is what you expect, when in actuality, nothing of substance has changed, what was expected is exactly what happened and the story went nowhere.

It didn't take a genius to figure out the new "childhood friend" who is introduced then quickly disappears would reappear as the antagonist. Again, what was Hush trying to accomplish? To what end did he turn all of Batman's rogues against him? All the while, we're led to believe that each issue's villain served a purpose in steering Batman toward some sinister goal. But there was none. The game ended at Batman facing Tommy (with a gun. Wow, Batman's never faced that challenge before) and Riddler, only to handily defeat them, never realizing what their intention was.

For this reason, we must assume this whole arc was set up as a "How To Draw Bat-characters The Jim Lee Way" (stolen from Sean Collins). For all intents and purposes, Jim should've drawn AND written the book, this way there's no false notions of a deep story.

Oh, and just to show that I'm not this anal on every comic I read, I actually enjoyed Dark Knight Strikes Again. Like you said, I just thought it was fun, and at the same time answered the questions, "What happened to the rest of the JLA and who is actually pulling the strings?"

[Jetman]

Well , I didnt think Hush was the greatest Batman story by a long shot - but it was a fun read. Yeah , Jeph admitted that he did craft a story to make use of Jim's talents so that Lee could draw Batman's full pantheon of villians. I'm not complaining though.It was a good chance to see all of The Bat characters drawn in Jim's style. I mean you dont usually see that kind of thing everyday ( well , we'll see it again briefly next year - but still).

And let's face it , Ive definitely read some worse Batman story's than this one: That Last Laugh multi-title "crossover" that DC pulled was such a gimmick driven piece of shit that I was stunned how badly it was when it all ended.The drama all lead up to Nightwing pummeling Joker and Joker didnt die so I guess DC got the "Last Laugh" at all the suckers who bought the series

And Bloody , I thought the Riddler's and Tommy's intention's were fleshed out pretty well in the last couple of pages of #619. I think Tomm'y motive fell under the insanity category - as he just wanted to BE Bruce.[he wanted to be an only child,ended up being a Doctor like Bruce's dad,wanted to be rich, he obviously learned some martial arts like Bruce did, how else could he hold his own in a fight against him?and when he found out Bruce was Batman he wanted to one up him and be his ultimate rival -] I would imagine Riddler didnt want Tommy to kill Batman just yet because it was HIS game to start with and in his mentality Nigma wanted Batman to figure out his riddle to see how clever it was.

[BEBOPlover]

Of course, the primary goal of any comic is to make money. And of course, when you put top-shelf talent on top-shelf books, the result will be lots of hurtin' forests. But in the case of this comic in particular, there came the promise of far-reaching ramifications, characters being forever changed and nothing is what you expect, when in actuality, nothing of substance has changed, what was expected is exactly what happened and the story went nowhere.

I'll be honest, I wasn't aware that "far-reaching ramifications" were promised. I imagine I would have been disappoinred if those were my expectations. I hate to admit this but I'm not a regular reader of Batman books, sans the mini-series that occassionally get brought out. With that said, I guess I can see our tastes may not be different, but our expectations are.

Now that that's out of the way: How can you be a lover of comics and not be head-over-heels for Planetary. I couldn't sum up Planetary if I tried. You, and everyone on this thread, owe it to themself to pick up the first two volumes of the TPB. If you have a fine knowledge of comic book past, then you have to enjoy Planetary. It's Warren Ellis's homage to everything we've loved growing up:Godzilla and friends, Hong Kong action flicks, comic book icons, pulp noir stories, pulp anti-heoes ect. Each story is self-contained, but as you get through the seventh and eighth issue you see everything is tied together, and brilliantly I might add. Just a phenomenal read.

[bloodyarts]

And Bloody , I thought the Riddler's and Tommy's intention's were fleshed out pretty well in the last couple of pages of #619. I think Tomm'y motive fell under the insanity category - as he just wanted to BE Bruce.[he wanted to be an only child,ended up being a Doctor like Bruce's dad,wanted to be rich, he obviously learned some martial arts like Bruce did, how else could he hold his own in a fight against him?and when he found out Bruce was Batman he wanted to one up him and be his ultimate rival -] I would imagine Riddler didnt want Tommy to kill Batman just yet because it was HIS game to start with and in his mentality Nigma wanted Batman to figure out his riddle to see how clever it was.

I didn't get the impression Tommy wanted to be Batman, just prove he was better. Nor did I think he was insane. His motive is certainly insane, but I chalk that up to bad writing, as Tommy's personality seemed to be one of someone totally in control and self-aware. The plan, with Riddler's help, was meticulously orchestrated to bring Batman to a certain frame of mind (disorientation). But we still don't know why he sent those villains, in that order. If it was part of Riddler's riddle, I'm just not seeing it. Riddler not wanting Tommy to kill Batman until the game had played out makes sense, as Riddler always operates in this fashion. But why would Tommy comply? If he was insane, I imagine he'd have just said "to hell with it" and toe-tagged Bruce whenever he was ready.

I know I'm making this out to be the worst Batman arc in history, but I don't really mean to come off that way. It's just that this thing was hyped to high-heaven, and alot of people think it's the best Batman story ever simply for the art.

Now that that's out of the way: How can you be a lover of comics and not be head-over-heels for Planetary. I couldn't sum up Planetary if I tried. You, and everyone on this thread, owe it to themself to pick up the first two volumes of the TPB. If you have a fine knowledge of comic book past, then you have to enjoy Planetary. It's Warren Ellis's homage to everything we've loved growing up:Godzilla and friends, Hong Kong action flicks, comic book icons, pulp noir stories, pulp anti-heoes ect. Each story is self-contained, but as you get through the seventh and eighth issue you see everything is tied together, and brilliantly I might add. Just a phenomenal read.

Crap, now I just feel guilty. After I pick up Leinil Yu's High Roads TPB, Planetary will be next on my list.

[BEBOPlover]

Make sure you start with vol. 1. Ellis is respecting his long-time readers and doesn't go back and reveal the plot hints. You have to study each word bubble and look for clues.

If your unsure of some of the references make it a point to come and discuss it in the thread. Here are some starters for the first six issues.

Look for the JLA, Fantastic Four, and Doc Savage. The homage to John Woo, and Godzilla are blatant.

[Tragic]

I dunno about you guys but I'm looking forward to tommorow's Amazing Spider-Man #500!