The National Endowment of the Arts

[Six]

ok, you got me there, pell grants are a touchy subject because seperating the funds spent on college students that will actually provide something for the world, as opposed to the nonsnese you mention sometimes requires very difficult value judgements that would anger a lot of people who make it their purpose in life to be outraged loudly. but i dont think that the nea is as difficult a case, pirvate funds should pay for social engineering, not the government, otherwise you get into areas where the government seems to be supporting particular viewpoints that its really not in its best interests to have any public say in.


Couldnt agree more, i really dont feel qualified to make a judgement on wether the amount is enough(but it should be) but there is tremendous waste that should be trimmed and put back into more effiecient and effective technologies and training.

100% disagree.

I'm very surprised that Bush did anything of this nature at all. Spending for the arts is never bad but I'd like to see a breakdown of where the money is intended to be spent - I have a feeling it's not going where I think it is.

And I'm very glad to see that our educational system manages to achieve such high levels of success as producing people who consider Shakespeare to be nonsense. I suppose that the masterworks of Mozart, Beethoven, Mahler, Tchaikovsky are just junk as well? Come on. It's art like this that gives value to life and is what we use to measure a civilization. And any art is worth more than a hundred drunken frat boys spreading mischief and social diseases while on government scholarships and grants.

And if you don't want a government that supports a particular viewpoint, then you're out of luck - you already got one. Our government sometimes seems to forget that we're here at all until election year. I know that I, for one, am in 100% support of the DMCA and the Patriot Act and that there are millions of freedom loving americans who feel the same way.

Besides, war is a waste of money. It works to take the public eye off issues that really matter, but costs billions in dollars and much more in lives (based on 1 life > $100M) at the same time.

Oh well. At least this may tip your vote in favor of someone who isn't GWB and that can *not* be a bad thing.

[frostwolf ex]

six, the nonsense i was referring to was the rather questionable fields of study that stone mentioned with the pell grants example he used. I dont consider shakespear nonsense.
and if you read my post, i am not advocating anything for the drunken fratboys, i was saying that priorities are social problems first, then social engineering(which is what art is) second i will go further and say that sciences are far more important than arts too, if we are talking schools, then the government should be spending more to see that physics and chem labs as schools are adequite and the teachers are trained before worrying that the kids havent read chaucer. priority is key, if you want arts, then spend to support them, but it should not be the government's responsibility to bankroll them.

[Six]

six, the nonsense i was referring to was the rather questionable fields of study that stone mentioned with the pell grants example he used. I dont consider shakespear nonsense.

Yay!

I was thinking you were not....all....there....

[frostwolf ex]

Yay!

I was thinking you were not....all....there....

actually i am not, but thats for another thread

[Diff-chan]

And I'm very glad to see that our educational system manages to achieve such high levels of success as producing people who consider Shakespeare to be nonsense. I suppose that the masterworks of Mozart, Beethoven, Mahler, Tchaikovsky are just junk as well? Come on. It's art like this that gives value to life and is what we use to measure a civilization. And any art is worth more than a hundred drunken frat boys spreading mischief and social diseases while on government scholarships and grants.

I dont think you should necessarilly blame the educational system that kids are too stupid to realize how great that stuff is. We are certainly exposed to it, there's not a whole lot the educators could do besides that. Most people hate that work. Im not trying to be elitist here but thats how it is. Theyd rather read Chuck Palahniuk or the latest Fabio book than Shakespeare. Theyd rather listen to Cash Money Millionaires than Bach. Why? Because theyre kids. Its like that guy said on the Simpsons. "that's why you're kids. Because you're stupid!".

[Johnny]

Some of you make it sound like there would be no art without government backing. I see a lot of wasted money when I walk through a public gallery and bump into virtually no one, or watch as someone spends their grant money on lottery tickets. I'd like to see concrete results, like improved academic performance thanks to music programs in schools. That kind of thing clearly enriches society.

[Diff-chan]

Some of you make it sound like there would be no art without government backing. I see a lot of wasted money when I walk through a public gallery and bump into virtually no one, or watch as someone spends their grant money on lottery tickets. I'd like to see concrete results, like improved academic performance thanks to music programs in schools. That kind of thing clearly enriches society.

Aren't most museums funded by government, at least in part? I know that NYC owns the building the Met is in, and Im sure the LA County Museum of Art gets a lot of its money from the county. And UCLA runs two museums, and those are obviously state funded.

[Johnny]

The smaller museums are more interesting anyways, you'll find more provocative work and it's often created locally. That's not to say they don't recieve funding or tax breaks, but much of the work is produced free of government influence.

[Diff-chan]

What the hell are you talking about? Im talking about the museums in existence today, like the Met, or the LACMA. I dont know how much art is created for them today, but I do know that they have art thousands of years old... which was, in all likelihood, commissioned by the government (or at least the ruling elite of the day).

And yes, small museums do have their charms, but the Met is wondrous. If you think anything but you are an unfeeling ogre.

[Melf]

I'm glad the arts get more funding. Perhaps if schools were able to give the arts the same attention and cash others subjects get, there'd be a lot more enlightened and productive people in society. I'm in favor of all the arts (music, art, theater, etc) and believe they should be strengthened and expanded in schools.

....and any poet of the 20th century>Eliot. He was too highbrow for my taste. I personally prefer Frost and William Carlos Williams (Puerto Rican!).