Fair Tax (take two)

[Fe 26]

Unless you are super-rich you wont ever have to deal with estate taxes.

wrong. You only really need to be some what successful to have to deal with estate tax. When my grandfather died my dad was forced to sell a lot of the land he inherited to pay for the estate tax. My grandfather, a doctor in Mississippi back in the 70s was hardly what I'd consider an robber baron.

But whatever, you hate the successful and educated.

(Hell, maybe the estate tax code has been heavily revised since 1984 and I'm wrong. It sucked in 1984 though.)

[g0zen]

But whatever, you hate the successful and educated.

This is the kind of narrow-minded stupidity (an IronPlant staple) that swallows the 'death tax' propaganda with a smile. There is a reason we don't want all the wealth in the land to become inherited (and let's keep in mind that the tax only effects estates valued over $2 million, and over $4 million for couples - that's a little more than 'somewhat successful' IP), and that is percisely because it often doesn't go into the hands of the educated and the successful but instead goes to spoiled, stupid, whore Paris Hilton and the like.

It's having a progressive tax system that keeps the middle class alive, and does not send us back to the fucking Gilded Age where the wealth disparity reached almost pre-revolutionary France levels (uber-rich elite, abysmally poor population).

[Saint of Killers]

"Fair" is a funny thing. Is it fair that if you're live in a wealthy community in Northern Virginia you'll receive a far better education than if you're born in South East DC? Is it fair that some kid gets into Harvard despite a C average and 1200 SAT scores over a much smarter kid with straight As and a 1500 because his dad gave a few million bucks to the institution over the years? Is it fair that just because a child was born to the "wrong" parents he'll battle malnutrition, poor education, drugs and crime his entire life and never get the chance to go to the right school or get the right job?

No of course not. And conservatives will be the first to tell you that life isn't fair (and of course it isn't). But they'll also be the first to bitch about it when shit ain't fair for rich people (progressive taxes are unfair!).

[MarkRyan]

And conservatives will be the first to tell you that life isn't fair (and of course it isn't). But they'll also be the first to bitch about it when shit ain't fair for rich people (progressive taxes are unfair!).

You should've put this part at hte front of your argument. I like to know when to ignore shit that contains "wah, conservatives do this" and "bitchmoan, liberals do that."

[Fe 26]

This is the kind of narrow-minded stupidity (an IronPlant staple) that swallows the 'death tax' propaganda with a smile. There is a reason we don't want all the wealth in the land to become inherited (and let's keep in mind that the tax only effects estates valued over $2 million, and over $4 million for couples - that's a little more than 'somewhat successful' IP), and that is precisely because it often doesn't go into the hands of the educated and the successful but instead goes to spoiled, stupid, whore Paris Hilton and the like.

It's having a progressive tax system that keeps the middle class alive, and does not send us back to the fucking Gilded Age where the wealth disparity reached almost pre-revolutionary France levels (uber-rich elite, abysmally poor population).

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I hope you didn't say that with a straight face. You attack me and then in the same paragraph make 2 or 3 character assumptions about people who are successful.

1). Making two million is only mildly successful. In 1984 it was only one million you had to be worth to pay estate tax. If you think two million is a lot for a person’s net worth, then you obviously have very small goals in life. It's easy for someone who dabbles in multiple ventures to rack that up. My grandfather racked up a net worth of a million by being a doctor, owning rent property, cattle, crops and other small ventures like selling cars. He was upper middle class. 2 million isn't chicken shit now. It may seem like that for someone still in college that is about broke, but it really isn't anything. The "super rich" that you hate so much make that in a day.

And he wasn’t born into that money. His dad was a small farmer in the depression. My GD joined up to be a marine in WWII. He came back, became a doctor, and the rest you already know. His family was very proud of him, and damn it, they kind of wanted to keep his stuff in the family.

lol, I guess fuck them for feeling that way, right? Some fucking trees and some cows in mississippi were very important to the econamy. God knows those cows would have never been sold or that timber cut on its own. Those evil rich people, they just hord that shit forever. Rich people cattle live forever, and they are red like demons.

Don't confuse someone that is successful and has a net worth of 2 million with being super rich. Those are two completely different kinds of people.

2) wow now, we are going to talk shit about one type of propaganda only to spew our own? Saying that a person's family has no right to said person’s goods, and said person’s family is stupid and spoiled are both assumptions. Both assumptions are little more than propaganda. And both assumptions are little more than your very subjective opinions.

3) with the way you talk it doesn’t feel like I’m stupid. It really sounds like you and diff hate anyone that uses their brains to make money. You demonize them, rip their achievements away, and shit all over their families. You generalize everyone that makes money doing anything complicated in to one big group. A simple town doctor is just as bad as a sleazy business man in NY that drives 4 sports cars in your book. It really looks like you are blinded by your own ideologies as you rarely make the kind of distinctions that you should be making between people.

4) You’re utopian beliefs make me sick. You’d dash many men’s success to the rocks just to fulfill your own ideals of society. You want to destroy one man to lift up another.

[Saint of Killers]

4) You’re utopian beliefs make me sick. You’d dash many men’s success to the rocks just to fulfill your own ideals of society. You want to destroy one man to lift up another.

Yeah that stifling 35% top tax bracket means those poor bastards earning $326,451 or more a year can't catch an even break. How are they supposed to feed their kids on that paltry take home pay of $212,000+?

[Fe 26]

Yeah that stifling 35% top tax bracket means those poor bastards earning $326,451 a year can't catch an even break. How are they supposed to feed their kinds on that paltry take home pay of $212,000+?

justice doesn't work like that. You can't decide who gets fair treatment by how much they can put up with being treated like shit. Everyone needs a fair shake, not just the people that have it bad.

But this doesn't really have anything to do with justice or being fair, does it? You really just want to help your own, or someone you know, right? That's what this all comes down to, two groups fighting the other for resources. It has nothing to do with being fair for most of you. You want your group to win, and fuck everyone else.

These problems will never be fixed as long as this is just a stupid resource war. Those in power will never give an inch that way. Someone is going to have to actually want a real compromise before anything gets done.

Demonizing the other side isn’t going to achieve anything. As long as the rich look at the poor like retarded slobs and the poor look at the rich as being demons and monsters, nothing is going to change. How can it, you don’t even understand who you are trying to work something out with. You don’t know your enemy.

[Saint of Killers]

But this doesn't really have anything to do with justice or being fair, does it? You really just want to help your own, or someone you know, right?

Edited because I don't like bragging about money (and I have none, to be honest) but at least Buttcheeks now knows how stupid this comment was.

justice doesn't work like that. You can't decide who gets fair treatment by how much they can put up with being treated like shit. Everyone needs a fair shake, not just the people that have it bad.

Like I said above, fuck those poor kids going to some of the worst schools in the country in SE DC. We need to concentrate on the rich getting fair treatment.

[MarkRyan]

Yeah that stifling 35% top tax bracket means those poor bastards earning $326,451 or more a year can't catch an even break. How are they supposed to feed their kids on that paltry take home pay of $212,000+?

If they only need to feed their kids then we might as well move towards pure communism. Hey-oh!

Just curious, but does anyone know what percentage of tax dollars comes from "the wealthiest 2 percent"?

[Fe 26]

very little I think. Industry and the middle class pay most taxes.

Fun little fact, the entire oil industry pays in slightly less tax than the entire middle class. Just throwing that out there if you ever wondered why our gov sucks their dick so hard. (this was on the history channle btw.)

Like I said above, fuck those poor kids going to some of the worst schools in the country in SE DC. We need to concentrate on the rich getting fair treatment.

If the rich doesn't deserve fair treatment, neither do those poor kids going to shitty schools. Pitty is not a deciding factor for who gets treated right and who doesn't.

If you want to be a philanthropist when your parents die, fine, but you don't have a right to force that on anyone that makes over some arbitrary amount of money.