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Thread: The Official Tales of Symphonia Thread

  1. The Official Tales of Symphonia Thread

    I wrote this to post on IGN, and I realize it's probably old hat to alot of you, as this is a much more knowldgable crowd, obviously. But I thought some of you might enjoy it, so I thought I'd share, and it's an excuse to make an official thread for the game.

    The Official Tales of Symphonia Hype Thread

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    What is Tales of Symphonia?

    Tales of Symphonia is the newest RPG in the long running "Tales of" series, produced by Namco, and developed by Wolfteam. It's the first game in the series to be done in 3D and uses a combination of cel shading and hand painted background textures to acheive a look true to past 2D entries in the series, while gaming the flexibility of 3D.
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    On the left, Tales of Destiny 2 for PS2, on the right, Tales of Symphonia.
    If you live in the US or Europe, odds are you haven't heard of the Tales series, or if you have, you haven't likely heard much hype surrounding it. However in japan the series has a feircely devoted following and has sold millions of copies since its birth on the SNES in January of 1995.

    Tales of Symphonia is currently scheduled to release in Japan on August 28, 2003 exclusively for the Nintendo GameCube. It is confirmed for a US release with a tentative release schedul placing it for April 2004.

    So what's it like?

    Tales of Symphonia is most definately something special. While it follows a traditional RPG format, the series has been very progressive, and made some nice innovations, while never abandoning the structure altogether. The main thing that sets the series apart is the slick presentation and art, the wonderful and deep battle system, and the clever level designs and puzzles.

    The game is definately of the light-hearted anime style variety. This isn't just appearent in the art, but in the writing and characterization as well. You'll get your share of laughs with the cast, as well as learn their more endearing qualities. Tales has very well-written charcters in general. It tries for a style of character portrayal not unlike Skies of Arcadia, but it succeeds much better than Skies ever did.

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    The combat system is definately the hook of game. It's far from the only thing boosting the gameplay, but it's a standout for sure. Tales of Eternia and ToD2 have my favorite combat system ever, and the series is eerily consistently uphill with its battle system with every release. It's an addictive realime hybrid of strategy and action.

    If you've played Tales' sister series Star Ocean (we'll get into that realtionship later), you have an idea of the format. You control the main character of the group, and the other characters in your party are your support. They have selectable AI, and can be given orders via menus. Control is side view, and similar to a fighting game. You keep four attack specials equipped and you hack and slash your way through the enemies as efficiently as possible. The game has a very real combo system, and it's possible to get some very good juggles going. You can also do magic cancels on enemies by hitting them in mid-cast which becomes a big part of minimizing damage.

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    Although the game is in 3D this time, it will still control in 2D. Whatever enemy you are targetting will be limited toa 2D side view plane with you, and it will control like a side scroller. You can change targetting whenever you want.

    Spells, items, commands to your allies, and other management are done by menus (the action freezes) like a traditional RPG. It's a strategy-action hybrid. Not only is it fun and novel, but it's honestly very deep. A skilled player will be able to progress much faster than a less capable one. If you're good in battle you won't have to do any leveling up, but if you aren't you'll need to compensate.

    The battles support 4 player co-operative play, which is a buttload of fun, though it does give way to some cheap combos if you know how to co-operate right. I suppose that's all part of the fun, too though.

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    The level design is a big part of the series as well. Any combat system can get old if battles are the only thing of inrest to do. So Tales (not so much Tales of Phantasia, but the later ones) makes sure that the dungeons of the game are well thought out challenges, and not just sprawling labyrinths. Traditionally the series has used a combination of random combat and encounter-based combat in different levels, but Tales of Symphonia seems to have done away with random combat altogether. In addition to some creative and fun puzzles, the games often use the enemies as part of the challenge. Some levels will have you trying to creep around enemies. Another might have you blowing them up on a grid like Bomberman to avoid battles. Then another might have no enemies at all, only puzzles. And then another still might place you in a classic arcade game, while another is a giant board game. They really mix it up, and its something I love about the series.

    Tales of Symphonia is a true sequel (although the time setting is ambiguous; it may be a prequel) to Tales of Phantasia, the last Tales game to be released on a home Nintendo console (on the Super Famicom back in 1995). The world of Tales of Phantasia had two moons, a lush green one called Tesseala and a dead one much like our moon called Silveranto. These two worlds feed off each other such that one's success is the other's demise. The game begins when someone tries to revive Silveranto. Collet Brunel, the last decendant of the Mana tribe (much like Mint before her) beleives that she has the power with in her to save Tessaela, and so, with the help of her childhood freinds, she sets out to realize her hidden power. Expect themes of moral ambiguity and questions of who is truly right or worng to play a big part in the telling of this war of worlds. Also expect nice tie-ins to Tales of Phantasia for the few of us that have played it.

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    Thanks to the new 3D engine, where there were once just screen chats for much of the story in the previous games, now even more minor plot events can be told with a more cinematic style. To compliment this the game will have more recorded dialogue than any previous game in the series, despite being comperable in length. Key scenes will be done using anime scenes done by Production IG, the animation studio responsible for Ghost in the Shell and Blood: The Last Vampire. The game's characters are designed by Kohsuke Fujishima, the man responisble for "Ah! My Goddess", "You're Under Arrest" and Sakura Taisen". There will be an anime intro set to a new theme entitles "Starry Night" by j-pop band "Day After Tommorrow".

    Always rich in the audio department, the import version will feature the voices of accomplished anime seiyuu, though don't expect much from the english dub (given Namco's track record we'll be lucky if they even bother to dub the whole thing). ToS's music will be composed by the legendary Motoi Sakuraba whose accomplished career includes the sountracks for Star Ocean (series), Golden Sun, Shining Force III, El Viento, and dozens more. One of gaming's most accomplished composers. From what I heard the music is going back to a style similar to the original Tales of Phantasia, which I personally think is the best RPG sountrack ever. The battle themes are less impressive, but those have never been a favorite.

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    The Legacy

    The Tales series has been one of japan's most popular RPG series for nearly a decade now, so needless to say there's quite a bit of history. Tales of Symphonia will be the 9th Tales game released in japan, but only the third released in the US. There have also been at leas 2 manga (comic) series based on the franchise, and an anime based on Tales of Eternia (with a Tales of Phantasia anime currently in production). The series is definately big stuff in japan, and the vast majority of you have probably missed most of it, so let me wrap up the history of Tales for you and how it will relate to this game.

    Tales of Phantasia
    The first game in the series. Released in early 1995, Tales of Phantasia was an immediate hit. It sported some of the best graphics the system had seen, and the largest cartridge size up to that point with 48 megs. This special cartirdge offered the 32 megs for the main game and an additional 16 megs just for sound. This fidelity was not wasted, as Tales of Phantasia had the best soundtrack of any RPG, a title I feel it still holds. The game also introduced the "Linear Motion Battle System", an innovative blend of action with traditional strategic elements. It also featured an endearing story with a very well developed cast who the player could really come to know as the game progressed. The story played on traditional RPG themes, but it took it someplace different, and I really enjoyed it. It was originally conceived as a novel written by the programmer Yoshiharu Gotanda, and as a result has a different feel to its storytelling.
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    In 1998 Namco and Wolfteam released a remake of Tales of Phantasia for the Sony Playstation. Contrary to what some have been led to beleive this game was in no way a port. It was a total remake and a truly excellent one. I really wish that more games were given this kind of second chance, as it reaches near perfection this time around. Not only were the graphics remade, but the gameplay improved greatly as well. It featured a newly remade battle system based on the Tales of Destiny engine, but with numerous improvements. It introduced the cooking system which was in turn borrowed from or inspired by Star Ocean. It allowed players to mix ingreedients to make special items by following recipes given by hidden "Wonder Chefs". It also had a newly playable character, MUCH lower encounter rat, new subplots, re-written script, and some truly, truly stunning anime scenes which have yet to be equalled in any game (or possibly even film animation). The one down side is that the PSX was not actually able to handle the high fidelity samples of the SNES version and the music suffered as a result. A small price to pay for such huge improvement. I consider this remake to be my favorite RPG. A must-own for fans. Full review here
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    A port of Tales of Phantasia is scheduled for release on Gameboy Advance on august 8. It appears to have most of the graphics lifted from the SNES version, but with sprites from the PSX version. It soesn't appear to offer much in the way of new improvements.

    A word about tri-Ace and Star Ocean
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    About 2 months after Tales of Phantasia was released, the bulk of the game's staff left to form a new company called tri-Ace, headed by programmer/writer Yoshiharu Gotanda. Their first game was the stunning SNES RPG Star Ocean, and tri-Ace would continue to be a formidable force in the RPG market with innovative and progressive RPGs.

    It was an amiable split, however, and Wolfteam would remain in close contact with tri-Ace and Star Ocean and Tales would develop as sister series, making it a regulat practice to adopt ideas from each other with each new release. Some examples of this would be the cooking system, the SP guage, the battle systems themselves, ideas about item creation... There was once even some shared staff, though that's more or less done with now except for the composer. But Tales and Star Ocean are definately cousins and it's common to see them develop each others ideas. That said, I do feel Tales is the better of the two series for its deeper combat system and better deungeon design, and better pacing.

    Tales of Destiny
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    With most of its staff gone, and pressure from Namco to produce a sequel in short order, Wolfteam was in a bit of a bind with this one. I've also heard that it began development on Super Famicom, and shifted to PSX late in the development cycle, but I'm not sure how true that was. Regardless it was a troubled development cycle, and it shows in the quality of the game.

    I consider Tales of Destiny to be the black sheep of the series. It's not a bad game, but it has alot of problems that drag it down. The story has alot of filler (it's unrealted in plot to Phantasia, btw). The first half of the game consists of little more than chasing a villain from town to town. The characters abilities are overly balanced as well, meaning there are not clear classes like in Tales of Phantasia, and characters are entirely too interchangable. There's also too many of them, and they aren't developed as well as a result. And overall, the game was eerily easy with little incentive to master its systems. To add insult to injury, the localization was incredibly bad. It removed all voice except for battles. It cut out all the face chats that took place on the map (which was ALOT). It removed a playable character for no reason at all. It replaced the theme song with some Tommy Tallarico garbage.

    That said it did advance the series in other ways. It developed the battle system alot, and introduced combo tracking. It also introduced non-random combat in some areas. IT put a greater emphasis on puzzles and clever level design, which really was great in the game. It also allowed 4-player co-op for the first time, but required special items to unlock it. It introduced manual control as well which allowed for more direct character control. A major enhancement, but also required an item to unlock. It was also the first Tales game to have an anime intro and cutscenes, and also the first to use character designer Mutsumi Inomata (who was no substitute for Fujishima). It had plenty going for it, but its still the worst game in the series, and unfortuately in the US, it was the most popular (or at least best selling)

    There's no justice.

    Tales of Phantasia: Narikiri Dungeons
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    The first handheld title in the series. Narikiri was a bit of a departure, and wasn't really like a handheld version of the console games, but rather something custom tailored to the GB's needs. It was a dungeon-rpg, with randomly generated dungeons. The battles were turn based, but done in a way reminiscent of the LMB. The game's hook was that it allowed different costumes or "Narikirishi" which would give the characters different class abilities. It's most signifigant here because it was a direct sequel in plot to Tales of Phantasia and further developed the world and mythos to which Tales of Symphonia also relates.

    Tales of Eternia:
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    The third game in the proper series (once again, unrelated to the previous two in plot) did alot to make up for the shortcomings of Tales of Destiny. In fact it offered nothing but improvemnt. While still 2D, Tales of Eternia took full advantage of the CD medium to offer gorgeous hand-painted backgrounds. The game was a real visual stunner, and I love the art style. Character designs were still done by Mutsumi Innomata, but worked well with the game's colorful style. It had a much less medieval feel this time, instead opting for a world very much its own.

    Gameplay was overhauled as well. All the improvements from the Tales of destiny and Tales of Phantasia Remake were incorporated, and the battle system was further progressed to put more emphasis on combos. This time there was the potential for 60+ hit combos if played right. It also had a unique magic system not adopted in the later games that used your two mages to fuse different elements and create new spells. It once again featured anime from Production IG and this time had a theme song which I consider to be the best theme from any game ever.

    Click here to see the Japanese intro to Tales of Eternia (requires DivX)

    Tales of Eternia was brought to the US as "Tales of Destiny II", a move which would later haunt Namco and fans. It was a much better job than Tales of Destiny, but still pretty poor. Voice acting was in this time, but of very bad quality. The face chats were still gone, and some of the voice was still missing. And once again, the beautiful theme song was removed and replaced with garbage. But despite that, the qualities of the game shine through, and it's a highly reccomended purchase. Although the plot and characters are not as strong as Phantasia's, it is a better game in every other way. Get it.

    Tales of Fandom
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    Not very signifigant. This was basically a "fan disc" released to exploit Tales' rabidly devoted fanbase. It worked wonderfully as the disc sold something like 200,000 copies. I own it and it's very nice for what it is. It has a compotent puzzle game with a cool scenario mode, 3 adventure games that tell some cool side stories of characters from each of the previous games, and bunch of humorous skits, as well as unlockable art galleries. It's got a ton of voice acting and pretty nice production values. Pretty much just for the hardcore fans, but a good game if that's what you are.

    Tales of the World: Narikiri Dungeons 2
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    Another handheld D-RPG. This time it incororated an iteration of the LMB combat system similar to Tales of Eternia which made it more fun. Shorter than it's predeccessor, but lots of replay. It was an out-of-continuity crossover title with characters from all the games. Fun stuff. On an interesting side note, this game was co-developed by Alfa System, who brought us Elemental Gearbolt and Shikigami no Shiro (Mobile Light Force 2).

    Tales of Destiny 2
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    Hoo boy, this is where renaming gets you into trouble. At this point the success of the series is very secure in japan, and Namco and Wolfteam decide to do what Square had been doing for the past 8 or so years and start developing multiple installments at once. It was a little different though because the two games were not really worked on by different teams, but rather the same team doing different parts at different times. A unique approach, but it protects the integirty of both games. For their next-gen installments Namco decided they would make a proper sequel to Tales of Destiny for PS2 in the vain of ToE, and a more ambitious 3D sequel to Tales of Phantasia on Gamecube.

    Tales of Destiny 2 was set 17 years after the end of Tales of Destiny. It starred Stahn's son, and was set in a world rebuild after being torn apart by war. It had a strong story line, and gorgeous hi-res 2D artwork and fantastic animation, and offered a couple unique enhancements to the gameplay. First was an SP guage which would deplete if you attacked rapidly. If you attack to fast, you will grow "tired" and your attacks will weaken. This was later borrowed in Star Ocean 3. The other was a grading system that would rank your battle prowess and reward you for your skill, giving incentives to those who want to play well instead of just leveling up. While the SP guage would not be adopted in Symphonia, the grading system would.

    Tales of the World: Summoner's Lineage
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    I actually haven't played this one. Oddly enough, this game is the sequel to an earlier Namco game unrelated to Tales called Demon King. But it's been converted to a Tales game this time, and stars a decended of Klarth from the original ToP. It's set entirely in the Phantasia continuity, but plays nothing like a Tales game. I've heard good things, and I'll probably pick it up this summer. It probably won't have alot of bearing on Symphonia, even if it is part of the same time line.

    Links

    Tales Channel: Namco's official page for the Tales series.
    Official Tales of Symphonia Page: Stay tuned here for updates.
    IGN Tales of Symphonia media page

    That's about all I can muster to say about this game and this series. Suffice it to say I am very excited. Thanks for reading my rambling, and I hope you all enjoy this game as much as I know I will. This is not just an RPG fix for genre starved Cubies. It is the most promising RPG this generation.

    EDIT: 22000 characters! Take THAT word limit!

  2. #2
    Great thread. I wanted to know about all those portable Tales games and all my questions were answered.

    I haven't played much of the series unfortunately, just the SFC Phantasia. Eternia is on my must-own list and I'm looking forward to Symphonia.

    Star Ocean Second Story greatly disappointed me. I sold mine after only playing a few hours into it.

  3. Originally posted by NeoZeedeater
    Star Ocean Second Story greatly disappointed me. I sold mine after only playing a few hours into it.
    The first is a MUCH MUCH better game, but SO2 does get better. Man those character can prattle on about NOTHING in that game... and not alot doing for dungeon and puzzle design either. But still in the end it was a very forward-thinking game with alot of merits.

  4. Wow great post. I'm really pumped up about Symphonia now ^_^

    I still need to finish Eternia though. Is there any chance the PS2 Tales of Destiny II will be released in the USA?

  5. Nice post. I would have mentioned that Nintendo is releasing a sweet looking Tales Gamecube though.

  6. Originally posted by Kinopio
    Nice post. I would have mentioned that Nintendo is releasing a sweet looking Tales Gamecube though.
    I also forgot to mention the replay gimmick that give you new story elelments, sub-plots, and playable characters on subsequent plays. But unfortunately, the post is so large that it won't let me edit it

    Insert this paragraph wherever you feel it belongs:

    Tales of Symphonia adds for the first time a new replay system that rewards players for playing it again. On subsequent plays, you will be rewarded with new story elelements, new sub-plots, and new playable characters. It is beleived that this will be tied into the grading system (introduced in ToD2). The grading system judges your battle skill in a way not tied to just how much battling and leveling you do. So there are incentives to get better at the game and play again and again: something usually missing from the RPG genre
    Originally posted by Takumi
    Is there any chance the PS2 Tales of Destiny II will be released in the USA?
    Not really. Game's been out like 8 or 9 months now and no signs of intrest from any publisher.

  7. Hey, nice post, Frogacuda. This is exactly what I wanted to see. Rather than improve the dismal state of my social life I've been trying to track down and finish all the RPG series I never got around to. The Tales games were ones I was always curious about so I've been pricing ToD on ebay lately (figure that's a good place to start seeing as how I don't speak a lick of Japanese), waiting to strike. I was confused about the whole ToDII PSX/PS2 thing but now I'm not.

    Also, your post reminds me how much I loathe the state of affairs as far as US localization goes for many RPGs. Good lord, it makes me sick. I'm a relatively honest person but if there were pirated, straight-translated versions of these games, I'd buy those in a heartbeat and not feel the slightest bit guilty about it. It would serve Namco (US) right.



  8. Tasty.

  9. Originally posted by Compass
    Hey, nice post, Frogacuda. This is exactly what I wanted to see. Rather than improve the dismal state of my social life I've been trying to track down and finish all the RPG series I never got around to. The Tales games were ones I was always curious about so I've been pricing ToD on ebay lately (figure that's a good place to start seeing as how I don't speak a lick of Japanese), waiting to strike. I was confused about the whole ToDII PSX/PS2 thing but now I'm not.

    Also, your post reminds me how much I loathe the state of affairs as far as US localization goes for many RPGs. Good lord, it makes me sick. I'm a relatively honest person but if there were pirated, straight-translated versions of these games, I'd buy those in a heartbeat and not feel the slightest bit guilty about it. It would serve Namco (US) right.
    I reccomend starting with the translated ROM of ToP, or with ToE, but that's because I think ToD was kinda weak.

  10. Oh yeah, I also forgot to mention ToS will be having a relationship system that sounds similar to Star Ocean's that should provide some non-linearity.

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