Page 499 of 662 FirstFirst ... 485495497498499500501503513 ... LastLast
Results 4,981 to 4,990 of 6616

Thread: The Trump Presidency

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Fe 26 View Post
    So we move from being slaves of materialism to slaves of labor?
    You become a slave to neither when given the choice. Marx’ whole dream was to reduce time spent working by sharing the profits, however that is not what happened in the USSR or China and it doesn’t happen here under current Capitalism. Again, if a majority of us became ethical shoppers, retail, fast food, and other minimum wage jobs would earn enough and receive enough benefits to take time off as companies competed to pay better as it became a necessary selling point.

    Do you not realize that so much of our achievement in the past 200 years has been because we have more free time due to specialization? Similarly to improvements in farms, many of our advancements have come from people having the free time to think and tinker. The less we specialize, the more of our individual time goes to producing things that we currently would just buy.

    Also, it is interesting how society eventually circles back to dreaming of this craftsman's world. The nazi's dreamed of the same things. Its why their tanks and plains were built in batches like finely crafted watches, instead of on the assembly line like Model-Ts.
    ¿Por que no los dos? It may not even be possible for the fast food worker to earn over $12/h. But $12 is possible because In & Out does it.

    In the begining, Henry Ford paid exceptionally well and expected hard work in return, which people came in herds to get the jobs and people bought Fords because Henry was a great American. But when things went sour in the 30’s, he cut wages and increased production speed to keep profits up. If every American knew this at the time and stopped buying Fords, Henry would have had to raise pay and slow down production to make any money at all. Henry was rich as fuck, he could afford it. The only time he should have cut costs was to retool for the model A, but that was ‘27 and they were flush with money anyway.

    There’s no free lunch. You can’t have a $5 t shirt or $100 TV and everyone paid $15/h. But if companies had to compete in better wages, sacrificing some profit for higher sales, they would.
    "Question the world man... I know the meaning of everything right now... it's like I can touch god." - bbobb the ggreatt

  2. Quote Originally Posted by kedawa View Post
    The few people I know that started successful businesses didn't do any of that shit until the business actually became profitable and stable. Even my friend who ran his business out of a storefront just did everything under the table for the first couple of years.
    It's the American Way™
    Quote Originally Posted by dechecho View Post
    Where am I anyway? - I only registered on here to post on this thread

  3. I fail to see how you don’t currently have that choice. Wealth is not a zero sum game.

    Marx’ ideals were well rationalized but the reason they fail and create the absolute hellscapes of human rights they do is because they dont acknowledge irrational, selfish aspects of humanity. Both good and bad aspects of yourself are necessary to function. Capitalism took in to account both, and gave us a more balanced system in which to grow collectively. More stuff to tax, too, which helps with socialist programs.
    Last edited by Drewbacca; 31 Dec 2017 at 01:39 PM.

  4. #4984
    Quote Originally Posted by kedawa View Post
    The few people I know that started successful businesses didn't do any of that shit until the business actually became profitable and stable. Even my friend who ran his business out of a storefront just did everything under the table for the first couple of years.
    Thats great, but you kind of need to know some of it if you're at the point of getting a multi thousand dollar loan from the government like doc suggest.

    I'm not saying people can't make money on their own. Yeah, do that. That is great. But no one out of college knows how to start a real deal legal taking out loans dotting all their Is, crossing all their Ts business.

    I'm also operating under the assumption that everyone knows it is exceptionally unwise to take out large loans on a business that you're phoning in the legal and tax aspects of.

  5. #4985
    Like, if you don't understand the health requirements of a restaurant and you take out a loan and then get shut down by the health inspector and aren't paying the loan back, your world is about to get rocked.

  6. Quote Originally Posted by Drewbacca View Post
    I fail to see how you don’t currently have that choice. Wealth is not a zero sum game.

    Marx’ ideals were well rationalized but the reason they fail and create the absolute hellscapes of human rights they do is because they dont acknowledge irrational, selfish aspects of humanity. Both good and bad aspects of yourself are necessary to function. Capitalism took in to account both, and gave us a more balanced system in which to grow collectively. More stuff to tax, too, which helps with socialist programs.
    Yes, it's important to understand that successful capitalism always incorporates aspects of socialism. Pure socialism and pure unchecked laissez faire systems both consolidate wealth and power in a way that is antithetical to capitalism, where real capitalism is always a balance that affords enough freedom for growth to keep people motivated, while successfully exploiting that to fund the programs that allow more people to successfully participate in the system.

  7. #4987
    I would argue that true laissez Faire would do that stuff anyway because people and labor are a resource that has to be maintained much like farm land or timber land BUT 99.9% of humans are idiots that have to be forced to not sacrifice future profits for a good looking quarterly report.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Fe 26 View Post
    I would argue that true laissez Faire would do that stuff anyway because people and labor are a resource that has to be maintained much like farm land or timber land BUT 99.9% of humans are idiots that have to be forced to not sacrifice future profits for a good looking quarterly report.
    Also, people, particularly those most motivated to relentlessly pursue financial gain, will reliably choose personal gain over the collective good. Even if it means having less, there's power to be gained by controlling a bigger piece of a smaller pie.

    It's as naive to expect rich people to consider the collective good as it is to expect the proletariat in a communist state to compete as hard as they would solely for the sake of the strengthening the nation without any personal glory or gain.
    Last edited by Frogacuda; 02 Jan 2018 at 11:59 AM.

  9. Look up the “2008 Chinese milk scandal”, the weird communist-capitalist hybrid they are leads to crazy corruption and horrible things, if the company that was putting melamine in baby powder wasn’t minority owned by the NZ milk giant Fonterra, it would have been covered up and more babies would have died.

    On the social pure capitalist side, look up the “2013 horse meat scandal”, the ridiculous layering of sub-contracts and suppliers in advanced capitalism means brand =/= product, which makes consumer advocacy a hard thing to do.

    Humans just kinda suck regardless.
    Quick zephyrs blow, vexing daft Jim.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by AstroBlue View Post
    Look up the “2008 Chinese milk scandal”, the weird communist-capitalist hybrid they are leads to crazy corruption and horrible things, if the company that was putting melamine in baby powder wasn’t minority owned by the NZ milk giant Fonterra, it would have been covered up and more babies would have died.

    On the social pure capitalist side, look up the “2013 horse meat scandal”, the ridiculous layering of sub-contracts and suppliers in advanced capitalism means brand =/= product, which makes consumer advocacy a hard thing to do.

    Humans just kinda suck regardless.
    Humans are just unpredictable if you don't take into account behavioral psychology.
    Check out Mr. Businessman
    He bought some wild, wild life
    On the way to the stock exchange
    He got some wild, wild life

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Games.com logo