How to get 500 happy people? Could you win "Relations" on the Russian side?

[rakovsky]

Are you able to get 500 people and have them at "60% happy"?

This is the goal of the game "Relations," which you can download at "CAFE TROPICO." It's fun, which interesting scripting events.

But it's hard too. it seems that people have low tolerance for problems, or else they grow to fast for me to build up a service infrastructure like hospitols big enough to keep their happiness levels high.

Another difficulty is that there is no gold, only a bauxite mine far away. So I tried relying on pineapple growing to keep the population on a good food source that is also profitable. Then I built a cannery, but it seems hard to get the proportion of farms: teamsters: canneries: ports at the right level.

What is your advice?

[TeamStar]

Another difficulty is that there is no gold, only a bauxite mine far away. So I tried relying on pineapple growing to keep the population on a good food source that is also profitable. Then I built a cannery, but it seems hard to get the proportion of farms: teamsters: canneries: ports at the right level.

I also had difficulties with canneries before, my advice is don't build them too soon, wait until you have a strong positive balance in your treasury. I think the trick for this scenario is to use tourism industry to keep the economy strong, to help the development of other industries and build social services. Instead of relying on one industries, have a variety of production lines, like tobacco, coffee and other.

But it's hard too. it seems that people have low tolerance for problems, or else they grow to fast for me to build up a service infrastructure like hospitols big enough to keep their happiness levels high.

Have you tried issuing some key edicts at the end of the game? You can save some good ones to the last few of year, thus busting overall happiness. Try 'papal visit', pan-caribbean games or/and the combo mardi gras+tax cut+the headliner.

If this doesn't help, go to the happiness page of the Almanac, check your people needs and work that way.
Hope it helped.

[rakovsky]

Teamstar,

There was a game called Caesar II I got that had an online walkthrough about how EXACTLY to build the right city. It even had a plan for the best layout! It got boring building the same thing map after map, and the campaign made you rebuild cities. After a while, my patience ran out with no speed up function, but the goal to make 10 years or whatever.

Is there a similar walkthrough with Tropico? I hope not in a way, but a good general overview of the long-run steps would be good. It really isn't so simple.

For example, in this one, we have to build farms enough to feed 500 people. In other words, almost 20. Now I choose

1) pineapple because it is the most profitable crop that also feeds them. Now starting out buildup on pineapples,

2) canneries is the next natural step, because it brings in significant cash. So I also build

3) coffee farms because they work with canneries

4) Then expanding industry means:
   a) build more harbors and teamster offices -but how do I get the right ratio? I built one too early and actually redirected products too much and lost money!
   b) environment problems as the canneries, farms, and harbor(s) are extremely concentrated

5) Now there is the housing problem. Where should I put all the little houses? (Apartments create crime and extra pollution.) The houses take up lots of space, and I have to juggle them with where to put

6) services like restaurants, churches, hospitols.

7) Of course, now there are more environment problems from general concentration, and therefore tourist quality has deteriorated.

And I have built too many farms in one place by the canneries, so I will have to build more farms in evenly redistributed areas of the island for food, since the market place costs money.

(9) The problem with tourism is that I am trying to get 500 people as fast as possible, but I don't think tourists are factored into the 500 count. Are they? If not, I had better use industries that will increase population and money at the same time such as logging or pineapples.

Those were good point about issuing happiness edicts. Papal visit is hard if the clergy aren't close to me.

[TeamStar]

There was a game called Caesar II I got that had an online walkthrough about how EXACTLY to build the right city. It even had a plan for the best layout!

Well, I could sketch you a plan for SOME scenarios, but not for all of them and still, some other player might pop up with a different winning strategy. That's the beauty of Tropico!

Is there a similar walkthrough with Tropico?

Yes, there are some guides at GameSpy.com for the "original scenarios" like Born Again or My Corazon. You can check them here: http://archive.gamespy.com/articles/june01/tropicoguide1/.

But, as I said before, there is no universal strategy for Tropico. Try to understand the principles of the Tropican society (food, housing, work,...) and develop your own style of play. Tropico appeals a lot to your double personality  one time you are a benevolent caribbean Presidenté, leading a tourist paradise, next you are a oppressive tyrant arresting (at least) your peasants and bribing your enemies.

If you haven't already done so, you should also check the Tropico/Paradise Island Building Data (Excel Spreadsheet by Breakaway Mac): http://www.strategyplanet.com/tropico/files/tropico-tpibuildingdata.xls.

For example, in this one, we have to build farms enough to feed 500 people. In other words, almost 20. Now I choose (...)

First of all, I'll say to you: layoff of this scenario. A friend of mine got stuck with "Turista Paradiso" must have played it like 50 times. Then he got fed up with Tropico and never played it again! But if you insist on playing it, have you tried cattle for exports? You can make some heavy earnings from smoked beef...
Anyway, as far as I could check, you don't have to meet the exports requirement if you choose the mid-way option to have 500 happy Tropicans.

1) pineapple because it is the most profitable crop that also feeds them.

Don't forget to have some other low-value food resources, like corn or papaya, otherwise Tropicans will eat your pineapples.

(9) The problem with tourism is that I am trying to get 500 people as fast as possible, but I don't think tourists are factored into the 500 count. Are they?

No, tourists don't count. They'll also won't eat your food.

[rakovsky]

Teamstar, thanks for the advice. Especially about playing other scenarios. What is wrong with the Tropicans eating my pineapples? And if I have bananas and pineapples, how do I know they will eat the bananas instead?

Let's say I build 30 farms. Why should I not choose to grow pineapples on all of them if the soil is good for growing pineapples on all of them? That way I will both feed my people and export the excess (say 20 farms' worth of pineapples) for a good price. But if I chose to make 15 banana farms and 15 pineapple farms, then the yield will be the same, but this time I might have 15 pineapple farms' produce and 5 banana farms' produce. So it seems less advantageous to vary the crop.

Yes I am trying for the 500 people goal, not the expensive export goal. The problem with cattle is they destroy the enivronment alot more than pineapples, but their profits are not that much greater.


You mentioned some scenarios such as Mi Corazon and Born Again. But I do not remember these scenarios. I have Tropico Island version 2 Paradise Island. There is a scenario on it called Mucho Macho. So I figured Tropico 2 includes everyhing in the earlier versions. If not, can I download these old scenarios on the internet? They sound fun!

[TeamStar]

There is nothing wrong with Tropicans eating pineapples. As far as I can understand, people will eat the low value goods (corn, fish, goat, papaya) before they eat the high value ones (banana, pineapple...). Considering this, you can guarantee that the majority of high income crops will be exported and not eaten. A pineapple farm can be placed on a land that is better for corn, so it will produce more food if is set for corn. Capice?

an I download these old scenarios on the internet?

I think it's time for you to meet my personal Tropico Scenarios Archive:http://k-tano.com/tropico/
Have fun!

[Coconut Kid]

... As far as I can understand, people will eat the low value goods (corn, fish, goat, papaya) before they eat the high value ones (banana, pineapple...). ...

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

I do not recall (of course my memory is very imperfect) anyone else's presenting that idea before.

My casual observation is that people go to the food stuffs closest to them when their hunger meter activates them to eat. Then they eat what is there, probably on either a FIFO or LIFO basis rather than on the value of the goods. There might be a hierarchy of food supplying buildings, but that seems like an extreme complication of the code.
LIFO & FIFO are accounting terms, LIFO = Last In, First Out; FIFO = First In, First Out - which have to do with how inventories are handled. If you have a stack which is added to always on the top, when you remove something, do you take it off the bottom or the top?

[one brow]

You mentioned some scenarios such as Mi Corazon and Born Again.

On my Mucho Macho purchase, they were listed under the "original Tropico scenarios" button.  I am trying to beat Born Again without a strategy guide to help.

[one brow]

... As far as I can understand, people will eat the low value goods (corn, fish, goat, papaya) before they eat the high value ones (banana, pineapple...). ...

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

I very seldom see Corn or Papyas on the list of top exports.  That may have more to do with price than amount eaten, though.

[rakovsky]

Teamstar,

Unfortunately I was not able to download from your site. I was usuing Mozilla firefox web browser. When I click it just dowloads the "Century Tropico" Map, but no others even when I click on them! That counts for left or right click. Same for Internet Explorer.
http://k-tano.com/tropico

One Brow, clicking on Original Tropico scenarios, although there is such a box, brings up nothing. Maybe it is because I am playing on a licensed Russian edition. I could also try the other disc of the 2 disc set. (Russian version comes with 2 discs).

[one brow]

One Brow, clicking on Original Tropico scenarios, although there is such a box, brings up nothing. Maybe it is because I am playing on a licensed Russian edition. I could also try the other disc of the 2 disc set. (Russian version comes with 2 discs).

Mine also came with two disks, one mark "Install" and the other "Data". The contents of both were loaded when I installed, although I still need to using "Install" to start the game.  Maybe you should re-install?

[Coconut Kid]

... If you haven't already done so, you should also check the Tropico/Paradise Island Building Data (Excel Spreadsheet by Breakaway Mac): ...

I fear that you are wrongly attributing that spread sheet. Although Breakaway Mac may have commented on it, or somehow have been involved in the thread which provided the link -- that spread sheet was prepared and provided by Cafe Dave!

 

[TeamStar]

Teamstar,

Unfortunately I was not able to download from your site. (...)

You're right, there was an error, but I've corrected it. Flash is not the right platform for this kind of website.
Anyway, try it again, please.

[TeamStar]

... As far as I can understand, people will eat the low value goods (corn, fish, goat, papaya) before they eat the high value ones (banana, pineapple...). ...

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

I do not recall (of course my memory is very imperfect) anyone else's presenting that idea before.

My casual observation is that people go to the food stuffs closest to them when their hunger meter activates them to eat. Then they eat what is there, probably on either a FIFO or LIFO basis rather than on the value of the goods. There might be a hierarchy of food supplying buildings, but that seems like an extreme complication of the code.

LIFO & FIFO are accounting terms, LIFO = Last In, First Out; FIFO = First In, First Out - which have to do with how inventories are handled. If you have a stack which is added to always on the top, when you remove something, do you take it off the bottom or the top?

Yes, I admit my tip was based on a suspicion and not on a direct verification. But I think some sort of selection is made by teamsters when transporting food for marketplaces, i.e. taking corn to the marketplace and pineapples to the dock.

[Coconut Kid]

... I think some sort of selection is made by teamsters when transporting food for marketplaces, i.e. taking corn to the marketplace and pineapples to the dock.

I have to rely on speculation based on my very elementary knowledge of programming techniques.

When the Teamster unit goes into the "work" mode, the program has to find a 'pick-up' building with loads of goods waiting to which to assign him. It is not clear if distance between the Teamster and the building is a factor, but it appears that the program simply searches the map by distance (think concentric circles) from the unit to the nearest building with a waiting load of goods without using the factors of age or value of the goods.

When the Teamster arrives at the target building and picks-up his load, the program has to assign him a target destination. The kind of material in the load determines one or more kinds of destination buildings. All material may go to a Dock. Some material may go to a secondary (or in one case, a tertiary) processing building (factory) OR in the case of 'food' - to three destinations which serve as sources for units, Marketplace, Restaurant & Gourmet Restaurant. Some food material may also go to a secondary processing building.

I speculate the same kind of concentric circle search is made for the nearest available target. It is not clear if the secondary building targets have a limit on the 'in' queue.

If my speculation about the simplicity of the programming as need to make the program 'fit' onto older PCs is correct, it is the random, invisible selections which provide the verisimilitude of loads of valuable goods being carried to desireable targets. Some players may have observed, but not reported, a different view of the handling of valuable goods.

[Coconut Kid]

There was a game called Caesar II I got that had an online walkthrough about how EXACTLY to build the right city. It even had a plan for the best layout! ...  Is there a similar walkthrough with Tropico? I hope not in a way, but a good general overview of the long-run steps would be good. It really isn't so simple.

FORGET CAESAR II AND ANY GAMEPLAY STYLE CONNECTED WITH IT. The closest you can come to a "walkthrough" for a Tropico scenario is to open the script and read it. Tropico is NOT a game some "jumped up" expert can play through once and then write a walkthrough and draw a perfect plan for a layout.

For example, in this one, we have to build farms enough to feed 500 people. In other words, almost 20.

Bad Assumption! Fisherman's Wharfs and Ranches also supply food. You also have a lot more to build than just a food supply. It can not be the entire focus of your long range plan.

Now I choose
1) pineapple because it is the most profitable crop that also feeds them. Now starting out buildup on pineapples,
2) canneries is the next natural step, because it brings in significant cash. So I also build
3) coffee farms because they work with canneries

Bad Assumptions! Leading off from a bad assumption. Variety in food supply will increase happiness. You can make money from logging and lumber if minerals are too far away to exploit.

4) Then expanding industry means:
   a) build more harbors and teamster offices -but how do I get the right ratio? I built one too early and actually redirected products too much and lost money!
   b) environment problems as the canneries, farms, and harbor(s) are extremely concentrated

Again Poor Assumptions leading from previous faulty assumptions. You seldom need more than four Ports, one for each side of the island to cut travel time. FORGET MECHANICAL RATIOS! They don't work in Tropico. Relative locations for buildings is more important. Don't overplay Teamsters.

5) Now there is the housing problem. Where should I put all the little houses? (Apartments create crime and extra pollution.) The houses take up lots of space, and I have to juggle them with where to put:
6) services like restaurants, churches, hospitals.
7) Of course, now there are more environment problems from general concentration, and therefore tourist quality has deteriorated.

So you see that starting with nothing but the Farms in mind distracted you from visualizing the whole community. Pollution and controlling it is a topic itself.

8 ) And I have built too many farms in one place by the canneries, so I will have to build more farms in evenly redistributed areas of the island for food, since the market place costs money.

Bad Assumption! Penny pinching while losing pounds. You want happiness; food variety helps. The Marketplace is the best way to made variety easy; and it's cheaper than trying to distribute farms in easy distance for all the people.

(9) The problem with tourism is that I am trying to get 500 people as fast as possible, but I don't think tourists are factored into the 500 count. Are they? If not, I had better use industries that will increase population and money at the same time such as logging or pineapples. ...

They aren't. Commonly for Tropico, any reference to "people" means citizens. 500 is approximately the "soft" cap on numbers of citizens.

[Coconut Kid]

...  One Brow, clicking on Original Tropico scenarios, although there is such a box, brings up nothing. Maybe it is because I am playing on a licensed Russian edition. I could also try the other disc of the 2 disc set. (Russian version comes with 2 discs).

Sadly, we will never know what he was clicking on. It's very frustrating not to be able to see what foreign language editions look like.

[Coconut Kid]

Could you win "Relations" on the Russian side?

That was part of the OP's title, but he never explained what he wanted to know.

You are Agent Caribe, newly installed on a tropical island by the CIA. Its the cold war and political tension is in the air.

Both the US and Russia have different goals for your island and you have to choose which one you want to help to complete the scenario. There are 4 semi-unique endings based on your choices.

Capitalist win: Earn $1 million in exports within 50 years and have lodged over 1000 visitors in your hotels.

Communist win: Increase population to 500 people with happiness of 60 or higher within 50 years.