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Kendahlj
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« on: 01/26/01 at 12:07 PM »

This post is mainly for the disgruntled MrP....Smiley

I was looking at a transcript of a previous chat (November) and Poptop Dave said in the chat that secret police were out, but you can use your soldiers to patrol areas.  So the secret police have been out since November.  I guess the question I have, is can you send your soldiers to the forests and search out the hiding places of the rebels?  In one preview I read it said that rebels can pick off soldiers on the outskirts.  If so, can soldiers seek out and eliminate rebels?
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Mr.P
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« Reply #1 on: 01/26/01 at 02:03 PM »

Boy, I must have missed that one. Pity, it would have given me more time to come to terms with losing one of the great tools of oppression! Sad

But I hope that they haven't taken out the functions of the secret police, but just transferred them to the army. (Who am I going to us to keep an eye on my General's now?!)
Do you think they have kept in the spy edict? That would make up for no secret police. Smiley
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« Reply #2 on: 01/26/01 at 11:06 PM »

I'm also somewhat sad that there will be no secret police. But oh well, so the military will have to do all the dirty work I guess...

I'm wondering about the rebels' hiding place, too. Can you actually find it? What if your island is very small and/or you chop down all the woods - can they still hide?
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« Reply #3 on: 02/01/01 at 04:46 AM »

Thats a good point Apoptygma. What happens if the rebels are off in one corner of the island? Why not just chop down all the tree's there and kick ass!

Does anyone know if the rebels have a "camp", or just randomly appear and kill your soldiers?
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« Reply #4 on: 02/01/01 at 06:57 AM »

I think I remember Poptop Dave saying that you could find rebels from time to time but that you couldn't find their base.  I think that there might be some repercussions for chopping down all the trees in your island! Smiley
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« Reply #5 on: 02/01/01 at 07:50 AM »

I prefer to consider the removal of trees to get at the rebels as "Selective Pruning", in order to keep liberty and democracy vibrant in my Tropico Paradise! Cheesy

I'm getting good at this propaganda thing....It'd be cool if you could write your own text on billboards, don't ya think? Kinda like the old (old!) game "Skool Daze" and "Back2Skool".

PopTop, how about letting us write on a billboard or two?
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'When you're tired of coups, you're tired of life.' - Coffeebean

'Golf.  Now there is an exercise in tedium!  It's people in ugly clothes walking!' - Eddy

'You will remember none of this. Your brief view behind the wizard's curtain will be replaced with happy thoughts of kittens and poodles, playing in the flower garden.'
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« Reply #6 on: 02/01/01 at 07:52 AM »

selective pruning with a chain saw? Anything to keep my "liberty and Democracy" running i suppose.
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« Reply #7 on: 02/01/01 at 07:56 AM »

Go on BulletSponge, you know you want too.... Cool
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'When you're tired of coups, you're tired of life.' - Coffeebean

'Golf.  Now there is an exercise in tedium!  It's people in ugly clothes walking!' - Eddy

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« Reply #8 on: 02/01/01 at 02:33 PM »

i probably will, my citizens will curse the day i came to power (Muhahahaha).
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Assumption is the mother of all ****ups

Never bring a knife to a gunfight

Indulge the Piranas and Barracudas of your soul

Minister of excessive smileys SmileyTongue;D:-*CoolShocked

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« Reply #9 on: 02/01/01 at 02:35 PM »

and if any of those tree huggin hippie gringos try and stop me, ill send em to prison.
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Indulge the Piranas and Barracudas of your soul

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« Reply #10 on: 01/23/12 at 10:04 AM »

It's interesting to look at these glimpses of the speculation about the game design before publication. I find it sad that the transcripts of the "chats" seem to have been lost.

There seems to have been an almost frantic desire (need?) for Secret Police to act as Death Squads and for C&C ability to direct the Army on Search & Destroy missions. Folks should have been able to figure out that the NPCs would have no ability to plan ahead; a verisimilitude of thinking is not actual thinking. They also should have had a glimmer of the quantity of code needed for a Rebel C&C system. It just couldn't happen.

It's somewhat surprising that these two topics lived on and on while other gameplay features lay unrecognized and unused.

In all the comments about Secret Police, I have not read one which systematically described what was expected of such a feature if it were to be added. The nebulous ideas seemed to include:
  • Disguised Assassinations. Unrealistic as a simulation since 'disappearances' or faked accidents are only slightly less disruptive than the open operation of 'death squads.'
  • Torture. Used to gain knowledge of planned activity. Impossible since the NPCs don't think.
  • Internal Spying. The game provides extensive individual and collective information, including personal thoughts.
    • Certain possibly desireable statistical summaries are not provided.
  • Infiltration of the Rebels. There is no continuing organization to infiltrate.
The complaints about not having NPCs to "do" these tasks never took into consideration that they didn't need doing, couldn't be done or were otherwise available to the player.

I conclude that players just wanted another whistle to blow. Those who wanted "search and destroy" were looking for another 'full service' war game and couldn't settle for less.
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