The Ambassador's Cocktail Lounge (General Chat)

[sethwbcl91]

Yeah, I think we can all agree that McCain was not a strong canidate to represent the Republicans...although like Cap., in my area Obama is "god" so I had some type of belief in McCain just to oppose the constant image of Obama...

Yeah, I wish I lived in the 80s... That is a good song though!

If I could live in any decade it would either be the 20s, 50s, or 80s...So does this mean the 10s are going to be good?

[El Meck]

So the USA got more than 2 Parties?
BUT no-one want to vote for them because they think their votes are wasted???

WE got near 20 considerable parties and 5 of them reach more than 5% (minimum to reach "seats" in "Bundestag" "Landtag"..)

What about another problem of modern elections.
The turnout.
Actually the most important elections reach ~40 %.

Germany 2009 "Superwahljahr" (super election year)
-Bundestagswahl   (federal election)
-Europawahl   (European election)
-Bundespräsidentenwahl   (Federal President election)
-fünf Landtagswahlen   (5 state elections)
-acht Kommunalwahlen   (8 local elections)

[Coconut Kid]

Since this is a "general chat" thread, I hope I may be pardoned for contributing some comments.

Unemployment: this is in the U.S. a crazy issue. First, we have no actual count. All the discussion is based on statistical sampling. The same kind of stuff that tells us how popular or unpopular senior public officals are. The only difference is that the employment stuff is done by government bureaucrats and the popularity tests are done by the media. No one here seems to be able to connect the dots between the homeless living under bridges and on the streets with unemployment. The general attitude is that all those people are the congenitally lazy who wish to suck their living from the rich who work hard to live in small castles.

Illegal Immigants: cause citizens to be unemployed. That is simply xenophobia in its most naked form. The citizens who make such claims are simply unwilling to go where the work is and to do the seasonal and gut-busting labor involved. What the hurricane "Katrina" showed was that a large part of the New Orleans population had a comfortable - but poverty row - rut. They loved their rut. It was more comfortable to complain about living at the bottom of the ladder that it was to look at the rest of the nation available.

Now tell me about the auto workers, the Boston Globe newspaper employees. Look at your history folks -- the Scotts and English "enclosures" which drove people off their settled homes. The "potato famine" in Ireland. Rather than blaming the immigrants, how about competing with them for the jobs? I'll tell you where there are some which will sweat off your obesity.

Number of political parties in the U.S.: for nearly 150 years the two dominate political parties have conspired to exclude representatives of other political organizations and lone standing independents from the ballot. You must remember that almost all election laws are state unique. Whilest competing with each other, since the rise of the Republicans with Lincoln's election, the two parties have created the myth that a multi-party democracy can't work in the U.S., especially in the Congress. Note the current verbage from Obama about "bi-partianship". Not ever is there any recognition of "multi-partianship" or an unity. Additionally, this denegrates our foreign policy because multi-party countries are regarded by our congress-persons (generally) as less democratic than our institutions.

I hope you will think about it.

[Mr.Eastwood]

Your comments are always welcome C.K. as it's nice to see new faces in here besides the usual I've also noticed you bring good talking & discussion points, which are always welcome as well.

I'm going to have to disagree with C.K. on the illegal immigration part though. It is a lot more complicated than it appears on the surface if you ask me. By throwing around xenophobe, you do a great disservice to you points and opinion; I dislike logical fallacies and Ad Hominems chaff me the most. I don't, and this is my opinion, think that illegals cause unemployment so much as they can help exacerbate an already worse situation in some areas. The unskilled labor helps drive down the wages of certain jobs; this can be a factor in people not taking certain jobs. This then leads to their status, their illegal status (that's how they drive the wages down so low), and because of this they are often abused by their employers. This is capitalism in its worse if you ask me; this is what Communist, again my opinion, and such use as reasoning for their beliefs. New Orleans is a good example of lazy people not wanting to work, the problem is, is it is a welfare city in a welfare state. People who, in some cases, have relied on the government for everything for generations are, of course, going to be cozy in their rut in life. Why work when you can get it all for free? That, however, is a different discussion so I'll stop there.

I also noticed you went from illegal immigration to immigration in general. It appeared you were trying to make a connection that those who are against illegals, for whatever reason, are also against immigration. This is Non Sequitor, so allow me to stop you there before more logical fallacies come out of hiding. It's great to want to help those in a country worse off than ours, and in the 18th-to-late 19th century, lax immigration policy may have been benifical to America, but there comes a point where it has to be checked. My opinion is we have reached this point. We only have so much in this country and to continue to allow some one million-plus people in is going to stretch our finite resources thin. We have to draw a line where we say, "replacement-level immigration only". Many people hold this opinion, but that doesn't make us bigots, racist, or xenophobes. This isn't to say that there aren't people who are, just because, but to lump all in that category ... well that is a true shame.

[El Meck]

Well welcome to the "General Chat"   CK

Number of political parties the U.S government say that Multi-party countries are less democratic as a "bi-partisanship"??
the more i know about U.S. policy; the more i think "They do what they want!" 

...I'm going to have to disagree with C.K. on the illegal immigration part though...

Not surprisingly 

So you think "your" country can't take any more immigrants ??

[sethwbcl91]

My European History teacher put it shortly as this:

Parlimentary Governments (with the multi-party system) are more representative but less stable...

Where Governments (such as the US two party system) are less representative but more stable...

So you think "your" country can't take any more immigrants ??

lol... 
I would say we can't take anymore illegal immigrants. Those who come here legally, well congrats and welcome!

[El Meck]

Yes in theory the multi-party system is "less stable"
But (for example) not in Germany.
Since the 2.WW ended (West-)Germany got TWO big parties which change in government like the U.S. ones
and it is quite the same problem to differentiate them  (sure there are other parties and sometimes the big TWO had to confederate with them but these ones never reached an alone government)

CDU [conservativ, (religious), quite right-wing]
SPD [social, quite left-wing]

So you say:
illegal immigrants    OUT
legal immigrants     WELCOME
 
So why you make it more and more difficult to gain the citizenship?
Otherwise many illegal immigrants whould be legaly there, get less problems and probably whould be assimilated by the american "way of life" and don't have to work in fear and cruel conditions.

[sethwbcl91]

Yeah, that is pretty much how the US is:

Republican (right-wing, conservative, religious, family values/American tradition)

Democrat (left-wing, liberal...)


I won't disagree with you Meck, I think obtaining citizenship in the US is a little too difficult, but it is how things are now. It would be nice if the process could be easier, not the qualifications, but just the organization and process of it. But those who are staying here illegally are just putting a strain on the nation, economically/crime wise/ect.

[JakiusCeasar]

  It's still here!

[sethwbcl91]

HOLY COW, YOU ARE STILL HERE!!!

 

[JakiusCeasar]

T3 got my interest going, though I admit I won't have much time to run stuff.

[sethwbcl91]

Yeah, that is actually what got me back here too...

 

[El Meck]

CEWL a old school member 

and Seth
I joined "Cyber Nations"   

[Capitaligous]

HOLY COW, YOU ARE STILL HERE!!!

 AND I SECOND THE MOTION!

   

[El Meck]

Welcome in the League TonyGee 
   

[JakiusCeasar]

CEWL a old school member 

and Seth
I joined "Cyber Nations"   

the old school member. The League was my proposal.

[sethwbcl91]

and Seth
I joined "Cyber Nations"  

Cool! What nation are you? If you haven't joined an alliance yet then join mine!

 

the old school member. The League was my proposal.

Yep, all Jakius's idea back in the day...

[El Meck]

the old school member. The League was my proposal.

*humble bow*
 

Cool! What nation are you? If you haven't joined an alliance yet then join mine!

Name: "Nord Dakota"
and sure i want to join your alliance 

Did you read this http://tropico.strategyplanet.gamespy.com/cafe/index.php?topic=11183.0 ? 

[Mr.Eastwood]

Ahh yes ... Cyber Nations. I use to play that before WUT imploded onto itself and my alliance, FAN, was pretty much wiped out. It got old after a while so I just quit. I might take it back up though ... might ... now that the summer is on and I have more free time.

[El Meck]

Death 

[Capitaligous]

 Sorry about that, Meck. I've been really busy lately....but school gets out in 2 days! 

[JakiusCeasar]

I'm just waiting to see if we can make this faster in T3!

[El Meck]

League of Tropico in  T3 ?

That whould be cewl ! 

maybe i can get T3 as first  because the german Tropico community is the biggest 

[JakiusCeasar]

Q: In the multiplayer component, will you be able to visit islands of other presidents and help them with their administration or start trade alliances?

A: After the successful completion of any game scenario or player issued challenge, you will have the opportunity to share your country and island online and invite other players to visit it. Visitors have the opportunity to take over and reign in your place after your mandate is over - this is just for fun and doesn't grant score, campaign progress, or any other in-game benefit.
This should be the island you are most proud of and want to identify with - the one with the biggest population, the most beautifully decorated, or just the most challenging scenario that you've ever completed. Of course, you are always able to change your mind and invite visitors to another one of your islands.
There are no trade alliances between players.

If I'm reading this right, this is excellent. We can keep the traditional consensus style model AND upload the game. Also, we could take the same island and compete with each other in a way too I guess, and allow for real elections.

We can add in game benefits on our own too, it seems.

 

[El Meck]

But this doesn't matter for what we do here.
The answer refers to the function to provide a FINISHED scenario for other players.

I think we can stay as we do so far with upload a SAVEGAME.