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Originally Posted by Matt
Captain Vegetable, I'm both a science student and a Christian, and frankly people with your attitude piss me off.
And what attitude is that? Methinks you need to go and re-read all of my posts concerning this topic before you start trying to assess my character and demeanor.
I never said "SCIENCE IS WRONG BECAUSE THE BIBLE SAYS SO!!!" As a matter of fact, I admitted in this very thread that I do my best to marry both science and my faith.
Me - 1
You - 0
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Not that I can't see where you're coming from, though. Evolution isn't a concept that comes intuitively, and the idea that life as we know it grew out of something else isn't an easy concept to grasp unless you're familiar with the picky details. Most people that believe in evolution, big bang, etc. (including, probably, many people in this thread) only believe it because it's what they've been told to believe. This relies totally on faith and is really no different than believing in divine creation or that the Earth is flat. I did not believe in evolution myself until I was able to study it and really understand how it worked.
What do you take me for?! Some uneducated tart spouting off about evolution and it's "incorrectness" because it doesn't wash with my faith?
If so, then you've got me all wrong. I, not unlike yourself, have studied evolution extensively. I used to even be a Progressive Creationist, which is the view you appear to hold. However, after studying it, I decided it doesn't compute, and that if I was going to place my faith in God it was going to be all or nothing, not half-way.
This is not to discredit Progressive Creationism, as I believe it as valid as my, more fundamental view of the Bible, I simply don't subscribe to it any longer, as fundamentalism makes more sence.
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But, when somebody has spent their life examining the world in an educated way, it's another matter. Why on Earth do you think scientists do their work? It's to find the truth, plain and simple - not disprove the existence of God or whatever.
I never said as much. And I'll thank you very much to stop putting words in my mouth.
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These guys know what they're talking about, whether you want to believe it or not. Someone like you who has no knowledge of how the world works aside from what your religious teachers have told you has no right to speak.
"Someone like me," eh? Pike off. What do you know about me to speak this brazenly about my character and knowledge of the world?
"What my relegious teachers have told me is right?!" Do you have any idea how much the fool you just made yourself out to be? Everyone who has participated in this thread, and any of the other relegious debates knows that I don't take to kindly to being spoon fed my Bible like so many other Christians. I'm actually intelligent about what I believe. I reason with it, and I study it. I'm a fundamentalist because I reasoned with it, debated against it's principles and suppositions, and still it stood. Not because "someone told me." Of all of your uniformed accusations, this offends me the most.
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From a religious standpoint, if you do believe that this planet is a creation of God (which I personally do), the world as it exists today is an expression of his work. God speaks through nature just as much, if not more so, than he does through the Bible. By choosing to ignore the evidence that exists around you, you are shutting yourself off to what God has made and what he has to say.
Right. I guess now would be an excellent time to mention my ordination. I'm a reverend, pal. I tend to know how to think critically about the Bible, as well as how it says God reveals Himself to us. I have heard the very voice of God while meditating.
Shutting myself off. Heh. You don't know me very well, do you.
Jesus Christ is my life. I love Him with all of my heart, soul, and mind. Everything I do, I do for Him and His glory. Jesus said He is the way, the truth and the light. Therefore, I seek the truth more fervently than any other I know, because I know the more close I am to the truth, the more close I am to Jesus Himself.
To set myself in a particular way of thinking without hope of any change is the kiss of death, man. A kiss I can live without, thank you very much.
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I cannot think of any. It is difficult to disprove the Bible in essence.
However, it is not so difficult to reasonably disprove various interpretations of the bible. For instance, the belief that Moses (or whoever really wrote Genesis) did mean six days literally, that the Earth is 5000 years old, and so on. None of this comes straight from God - it's all tradition that has been adopted by humans over the years. Therefore, if something you believe is proven to be wrong, you need to change your interpretation, not your belief in God or the Bible.
With this I will agree. We cannot understand the Bible differently, but we can misunderstand it differently. If I am in the wrong about my beliefs, I seek to know the truth. I am not so unyielding. But you wouldn't have known that, would you.
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You do not understand science at all.
There is no such thing as "science fact". By its very nature, science acknowledges no facts. *Everything* in science is a theory, including the theory of gravity and the theories of thermodynamics.
Dude, as far as I knew, a consistently repeatable experiment with predictable results was defined among the scientific affluent as a "fact."
If I drop a ball from the top of my house, it is pulled toward the Earth. It happens every time. It's a fact.
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These are no different than the theory of evolution, the "Big Bang" theory, or whetever else. You just accept gravity as fact because it better fits your world view. When Creationists say that "evolution is just a theory", they are ignoring the fact that everything else is also just a theory.
I don't know what the point of this blurb is, so I'm leaving it alone.
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And, you know, what difference does it make to you how God created the world? If he created life by evolving it from single-celled organisms, then what's the problem? It's a lot more interesting than having him magically making stuff appear. If God said "let there be light" and the Big Bang happened, what's wrong with that? Are you saying that you were around at the time and it looked different? There is no reason why science should be opposed to religion - nothing in science has disproved the existence of God; if anything it gives him and his creation more dimension than it would have had otherwise.
Nothing is wrong with it, and I never stated otherwise. I came from the school of Progressive Creationism, understand it well, and I really don't give a damn if that's how you, as a Christian, want to believe. It isn't going to impact your salvation to any degree, and if you find it interesting, go for it. Jesus is all that matters. Believing He created the universe is what's important, not how He did it.
How you got those ideas about me and my beliefs I'll never know, man. I never even implied half the stuff you said I did.
