Microsoft Announces External HD-DVD Drive for 360

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Originally Posted by Schlep

Point is that Blu-ray didn't deliver any kind of death blow to HD-DVD like expected, and HD-DVD actually looks more impressive just going on the events of today.

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You said that HD-DVD made Blu-ray look stupid - the above isn't the same thing. I don't think anybody has said that Blu-ray was going to kill HD-DVD right off of the bat - what has been said is that a lot of the benefits on the side of HD-DVD have evaporated over time, and when putting the two technologies and format support head to head, Blu-ray wins out in both of those categories.

I will say that I give HD-DVD credit in the fact that I'm surprised that companies like Warner Bros. are holding off on big support for Blu-ray right out the gate, instead dropping most of their initial support onto HD-DVD.

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And about the movies, my opinion is the more popular one right now. Most reactions I've seen have said that the Blu-ray selection sucks, and I agree. I'd get Kung Fu Hustle and that's about it.

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Kung Fu Hustle, House of Flying Daggers, Fifth Element, T2... a few off of the top of my head. I'd also say RE: Apocalypse, but I'm not going to claim that that is a movie for everyone.

Even still, 99% of the content will end up coming out on both formats until a winner is decided, more than likely. This isn't the early days of DVD - most companies are going to drop their titles on both formats, so that they aren't on the losing side.

And if you're going to judge either format based on the initial batch of titles... that would be silly. Want to go back and see what the launch titles for DVD was? I was there from the start, and I can tell you, the selection of titles on DVD in the early days sucked ass. For Christ's sakes, this is a video game forum - everybody here should know damn well how much launch titles mean nothing when it comes to the quality of a piece of video game hardware.

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Regardless, the point is that Blu-ray didn't impress anyone today. This looks right now more like SACD vs. DVD-A than it does VHS vs. Betamax or DVD vs. DivX.

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Didn't impress you, you mean. I still argue that most people didn't think Blu-ray was going to kill HD-DVD today, or hell, were expecting much of anything about either beyond price and some initial title launches.

Didn't impress anyone in the home theater community. HD-DVD made Blu-ray look stupid because everything was all packaged up with a bow for the Blu-ray group, and they didn't take it today, so now it's back to confusion.

It's entirely possible that the PS3 could make every person in the world adopt Blu-ray DVD and this is moot. My opinion, though, is that neither of these techs will ever reach the level of regular DVD. We'll see if I'm right ca. 2012.

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Originally Posted by Schlep

Didn't impress anyone in the home theater community.

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I trust the "home theater community" to give an accurate account of events relating to this in the same way I trust TNL (or any online game forum) to give an accurate account on any sort of game announcement. Meaning, when you have a bunch of fanboys about something, they let their personal opinions get in the way of facts far too much.

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HD-DVD made Blu-ray look stupid because everything was all packaged up with a bow for the Blu-ray group, and they didn't take it today, so now it's back to confusion.

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I agree that Blu-ray COULD have done just that, because yes, it was shaping up to be Blu-ray's victory to lose. But I only see one big slip-up - the difference in initial hardware pricing - yet we've only seen a small fraction of the players, and again, I'm not sure the price is going to make that big of a difference, unless HD-DVD really, really gains more momentum. And, again, I think if people looked at things realistically, Blu-ray wasn't going to come out with some magic deathblow today no matter what.

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It's entirely possible that the PS3 could make every person in the world adopt Blu-ray DVD and this is moot.

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I have nothing but utter confidence that the PS3 is going to be what makes Blu-ray succeed over HD-DVD. All other things being equal, HD-DVD has no "catch" like Blu-ray has, and that alone is going to be a huge difference.

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My opinion, though, is that neither of these techs will ever reach the level of regular DVD. We'll see if I'm right ca. 2012.

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And people said that same thing about DVD, CD, MP3, and so on. Especially with DVD, people gave the same argument against it that people are giving against Blu-ray and HD-DVD: nobody will be able to tell the difference. Granted, DVD brought a host of benefits above VHS that just can't exist here. However, HDTV is going to do nothing but rise in popularity, and people are going to want a video format to go along with that.

I'm not totally disagreeing with you, however - there's a very serious possibility that by the time HDTV is in enough homes that you could see the same penetration rate as current DVD, a new and "better" standard could come along; digital downloads being one of the biggest possibilties. I mean, we saw that happen to audio - instead of SACD or DVD-A kill off the CD, MP3 (and other similar stuff) is doing the job. Audio and video are different markets, though, so I can see Blu-ray and HD-DVD thrive where SACD and DVD-A have, so far, failed.

Technology typically does nothing but progress, though, and once you move part of your life up a step in technology, it is hard to go back. HDTV is reaching "average Joe" price levels, and people that own an HDTV aren't going to live with regular DVD. And once you're at your friend's house and watch his HDTV, you're going to want one.

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Originally Posted by shidoshi

I have nothing but utter confidence that the PS3 is going to be what makes Blu-ray succeed over HD-DVD.

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These are my expectations as well.

Even though PS2 is a shitty DVD player, I know many people who use it exclusively to watch movies. The same will be true of PS3. Hell, I doubt I'll own a Blu-ray player before PS3. I still don't own a CD player that can handle SACD (or DVD Audio, for that matter), so PS3 will be first player for that format too. I'm sure I'm not alone on that.

The argument isn't that people can't tell the difference. The argument is that many people just recently finished rebuilding their libraries on DVD, and that HD-DVD/Blu-ray are coming along too soon.

DVD is only a 9 year old technology, and a huge majority of people don't even yet own HDTV's. VHS sales are just now waning after over 25 years of sales. As you said with mp3's, there's a good chance that Apple or some other company could release a knockout of a digital content delivery system. That throws a whole other wrench in the works.

I can guarantee that even if I had the money, I wouldn't be rushing out to buy any Blu-rays or HD-DVDs right now. I've seen demos, and it is better, but it's not the quantum leap in technology that DVDs were. The video is sharper, but that's about all that people are going to notice. There's no added surround systems like DVD brought, or special features, or more compact media. Most people have yet to even experience progressive DVDs on an HDTV.

Is it possible that one of these two will be the new standard? Sure. Is it probable? Not really. The only way I could see it happening is if the technology got so cheap that they made blu-ray/hd-dvd standard on all DVD players. I don't think it will take off on its own merits.

Oh and to counter Shidoshi's list...

8 track
Betamax
DAT
Laserdisc
Mini disc
DivX
SACD
DVD-A

And I'm sure I missed some. Especially if you count in crap like CD-i and Voom.

Microsoft is pulling of a Sega CD, HA!


this is the most retarded idea ever! they would be better off swaping the DVD in the 360 for an HD-DVD.

This is being way overblown; it's not a hardware expansion like Sega CD, it's just for watching movies. Games don't need more than 9 GB's of disc space so it's not like they're responding to a gaming demand, it's like the DVD remote kit for the original Xbox. And bluray/HDdvd are both going to fail anyway, people aren't ready to upgrade from DVD's.

I think it could work if they somehow managed to make it work with the design of the system and look 'cool'. Frankly, I don't see how its possible. I think it'll look clunky and like an afterthought.

It's just an attempt to deter stupid people from choosing PS3 over Xbox 360 just because it plays a hi-def movie format. It doesn't matter. DVD is only now becoming universally embraced, the mainstream is not even close to ready to move onto another format. DVD's won't be dethroned by another disc format, it'll take some sort of alternate delivery system to dethrone DVD the way Mp3's are dethroning CD's.

Now dumbass core system buyers can purchase a HDD and a HD-DVD attachment! Oh, and they need a separate Wi-Fi peripheral as well. Given the lack of a HDD for the PS3, it could still be $500 and be a better deal than the 360, since it includes its next-gen DVD drive and Wi-Fi out of the box. Oh, and its game lineup can't be weaker than the 360s right now.