DOA: Ultimate Official Thread

**Tigana** · 27 Oct 2004, 03:08 PM

Doa's combat system is inherently broken.

!10 frame crouch dashes, which are faster than a jab or throw make the game a battle of said crouch dashes.

edit.
Not that I don't enjoy the game, I just don't enjoy it as a competitive fighter.

**FuryFox** · 27 Oct 2004, 03:23 PM

Not that I don't believe you, but I've played a ton of DOA, and haven't seen any huge imbalance from quick crouch dashes. Hardly any characters have 'while rising' moves, and no one has EWGFs or anything so dominant. You can be thrown while ducking, and even if you dash in within 10 frames, you still have to do something afterward. You can't kill anyone with just crouch dashes.

Does anyone have match vids or details on DOA's "inherently broken" combat; I'm curious.

**Zerodash** · 27 Oct 2004, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by Tigana

Not that I don't enjoy the game, I just don't enjoy it as a competitive fighter.

I agree with you completely. I don't understand why some people are unable to enjoy certain fighting games just because they are broken. MVC2 and DOA are broken as hell, but still fun.

**Dipstick** · 27 Oct 2004, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by Tigana

Doa's combat system is inherently broken.

!10 frame crouch dashes, which are faster than a jab or throw make the game a battle of said crouch dashes.

edit.
Not that I don't enjoy the game, I just don't enjoy it as a competitive fighter.

Err, the frame data I had read has throws coming out in six frames... which is obscenely fast. I think it varies per character (I had Tengu throw me out of situtations where I had frame advantage, so I think his throws come out even faster.) There is so much throw-guaranteed stuff in this game it blows my mind at times.

The tracking in this game is bizarre, too... it seems like there is not any, but instead moves have giant hitboxes laterally. So once you start wavedashing fast enough, everything starts missing. I saw this shit back in Soul Calibur (2), and it sucked then too.

Originally Posted by Chux

Originally Posted by Zerodash

So the best-looking fighting game of this generation will largely feature gameplay from early 2000. That feels so disappointing...

Nobody complained when Third Strike came out.

Third Strike is not fundamentally broken, unlike Dead or Alive. Updating everything but the gameplay is wack.

-Dippy

**Bacon McShig** · 27 Oct 2004, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Chux

Hrm, just called my EB where I pre-ordered and they said UPS was bringing it to them right now.

Originally Posted by Roufuss

Weird, I called my EB just to double check, and they said it was supposed to be in today but the guy heard it was coming tommorrow.

The state of release dates in this industry is an atrocity.

**Tigana** · 27 Oct 2004, 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by Dipstick

Err, the frame data I had read has throws coming out in six frames... which is obscenely fast. I think it varies per character (I had Tengu throw me out of situtations where I had frame advantage, so I think his throws come out even faster.) There is so much throw-guaranteed stuff in this game it blows my mind at times.

-Dippy

Actually, you are right. I just got the frame data confused(it's been about a year and a half since I saw them for 3). Basically, 3's gameplay led to a crouch game mixup that Kazuya could only dream of, with the throws coming off the dashes.

Originally Posted by FuryFox

Not that I don't believe you, but I've played a ton of DOA, and haven't seen any huge imbalance from quick crouch dashes. Hardly any characters have 'while rising' moves, and no one has EWGFs or anything so dominant. You can be thrown while ducking, and even if you dash in within 10 frames, you still have to do something afterward. You can't kill anyone with just crouch dashes.

Does anyone have match vids or details on DOA's "inherently broken" combat; I'm curious.

There are really no competitve vids of DOA. The only strategical discussion I have ever read about it was by WCMAXI(Jason Arny) and he broke down the frame date, which I did butcher it the previous post. It was the frames for the crouch dash plus the throws for a really strong mixup game.

**Dipstick** · 27 Oct 2004, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by Tigana

There are really no competitve vids of DOA. The only strategical discussion I have ever read about it was by WCMAXI(Jason Arny) and he broke down the frame date, which I did butcher it the previous post. It was the frames for the crouch dash plus the throws for a really strong mixup game.

Funny, since that is who I ripped most of my "tech." in DoA from too.

Although I saw it as a really stupid mixup between a safe poke (a move that was safe on block, does not generate damage when countered, and pops up on (counter)hit would be ideal. I remember Ein's 7+K doing all that) and your character's most damaging throw. Couple this with massive guaranteed damage off of a lot of moves blocked and I wonder why anyone ever bothers attacking in this game.

-Dippy