Official Wii Thread: Part 4

[Finch]

Most of the games i enjoy aren't even multi player, but it'd be nice. As i've said before, i don't know anyone who likes old games irl, so online is the only way i get my old schoo multi-player fix.
Achievements... game by game it's awesome, but the whole score thing doesn't do anything for me. I like finding secret trophies, say in Super Smash Bros. Melee, but when the goals are in front of me, i feel like i'm being ocd for the sake of being ocd.

[MarkRyan]

They are required standards in console gaming from this point forward.

For standards, I'd be much happier with four-player splitscreen (plus system link) and 60 FPS. The ability to match my e-penis against others around the world isn't at all interesting to me.

I don't see how you couldn't want online play. Achievements aren't a necessity, but online play is.

Playing online idiots isn't appealing in the least, and if I'm playing with friends I'd infinitely prefer playing in the same living room. After years of playing Halo 1 LAN with 10+ people, playing online--even with friends--is boring in comparison.

[Tommy Tallarico]

The ability to match my e-penis against others around the world isn't at all interesting to me.

I only care about achievements as a way of measuring my own progress, not to compare them to others. Achievements give every game on the system a progress meter. It's a universal method of seeing that you get 100% out of your games beyond just beating the last level.

The way I see it, it's the new generation's version of last generation's unlockables. Most of the best games in the last console cycle had a bunch of unlockables and you knew you had finished the game when you got all of them. Now, it's getting 1000 achievement points.

[bbobb]

Playing online idiots isn't appealing in the least, and if I'm playing with friends I'd infinitely prefer playing in the same living room. After years of playing Halo 1 LAN with 10+ people, playing online--even with friends--is boring in comparison.

You're telling me you have no friends who don't live within few miles of you that you would like to play with but can't?

Come on now.

And as long as you have a mic, playing online with friends is a damned good time.

[bVork]

I don't care about online play if a game doesn't need it, but achievements will make me play a game on 360 instead of any other system.

[Space Pirate Roberts]

Achievements... game by game it's awesome, but the whole score thing doesn't do anything for me.

Yeah, assigning point values to them is stupid if they aren't going to balance them. For example, getting 1 million points without dying in Geometry Wars is worth a paltry 10 or 20 Gamerscore, but it's harder than all the achievements in Tomb Raider Legend put together.

[MarkRyan]

Achievements give every game on the system a progress meter. It's a universal method of seeing that you get 100% out of your games beyond just beating the last level.

Well designed games give you real rewards for progress. I agree that it's cool to have encouragement for completing games--I just got 1,000% map completion in Portrait of Ruin, and earlier this year loved getting all the star coins in New Super Mario Bros.--but I don't see achievements as any improvement to what's already common practice in games. In most cases (at least the games I've played) they're significantly worse--achievements are just a checklist of things to do, many of which are either A) things you do just by playing the game normally, or B) challenges of grinding boredom (like "Play 1,000 ranked matches online"). That lots of achievements require online play is also pretty underhanded--if you don't pay $50 a year, you can't 100% your games. Or if you're like me and just don't want to play ranked matches with online goons.

The way I see it, it's the new generation's version of last generation's unlockables. Most of the best games in the last console cycle had a bunch of unlockables and you knew you had finished the game when you got all of them. Now, it's getting 1000 achievement points.

So you prefer meaningless pats on the back to unlockable extras? When I play 360 games I honestly try to ignore achievements as much as possible. Since they're mandatory, they're usually half-assed. I don't like pop-up notifications in the middle of my engrossing gameplay to break the fourth wall (I know you can turn them off, and I do). I haven't played a single game where the achievements don't feel tacked on and artificial--unlike, say, the challenge of finding fruit in Shadow of the Colossus to augment your health, or Smash Bros. various challenges that earn you in-game unlockables and trophies.

Not that I think achievements are replacing these more organic game rewards. I just don't give a shit that achievements are there, and would rather pretend that they're not.

You're telling me you have no friends who don't live within few miles of you that you would like to play with but can't?

I just play when I'm hanging out with them, and I'd honestly prefer a good set of LAN/splitscreen/single-cart options.

And as long as you have a mic, playing online with friends is a damned good time.

I think for online games to be really fun they need to be set up as well as Halo 2. Unfortunately, nothing other than Halo 2 has a set up nearly as good.

[Joust Williams]

Some games do achievements very well. Some games do online very well. If your attitude is "sometimes they suck", then why do you do anything at all? Nothing is well-implemented 100% of the time. Do you say "Well, I'm not going to play Shadow of the Colussus because this other game that has something in common wasn't very good"? It sounds like you just want to find some excuse for not liking what Microsoft is doing. Meanwhile, you could level a trillion more criticisms at Nintendo. Like "Hey how come this is the exact same with bullshit controls thrown in"


"I think for online games to be really fun they need to be set up as well as Halo 2. Unfortunately, nothing other than Halo 2 has a set up nearly as good."

Do you even play any games? It's almost like the whole "Halo 2 killed weapon balance" garbage.

[PKBMax]

I dunno what avatar is saying. If you hold it sideways, it suddenly would suck as a pointing device (yes, technically, it will still work, but its not very good). You probably have to pause the action to do this.

"One Pixi named Tippy allows you to point the Wiimote at the screen to learn more about enemies, or discover hidden passages."

Isn't it obvious that that skill would only be used when you aren't in danger? Therefore pointing at the screen is no big deal.

[MarkRyan]

Some games do achievements very well. Some games do online very well. If your attitude is "sometimes they suck", then why do you do anything at all?

I don't want to make any sweeping generalizations because I don't own an Xbox 360 and as such I've only played the games I've needed to for work (though it's a fair number). But every 360 games I've played has lame achievements. I wouldn't say they're always shitty because I haven't played every 360 game.

Do you say "Well, I'm not going to play Shadow of the Colussus because this other game that has something in common wasn't very good"?

I used Shadow of the Colossus as an example of organic, in-game rewards as an alternative to "Yay, you did XXX," not to say that PGR and Gears of War should also have fruits that you find in the world to be like Shadow of the Colossus.

It sounds like you just want to find some excuse for not liking what Microsoft is doing.

Of course, if only I wasn't so biased against Microsoft I would automatically love everything they do, just like you.

Meanwhile, you could level a trillion more criticisms at Nintendo. Like "Hey how come this is the exact same with bullshit controls thrown in"

I don't apologize for any company, why are you bringing this up with me?

Do you even play any games? It's almost like the whole "Halo 2 killed weapon balance" garbage.

Amaze me with the revelation of games that have an online setup as good as Halo 2's party system. I haven't seen them. The people I work with haven't seen them.