"The Cult of the Amateur"

[burgundy]

um, since mozart and van gogh did their work before copyright was around to guarantee their chance to profit from it, this whole argument chokes on its own throbbing gay tail

[Fe 26]

your lack of knowledge of history is astounding burg.

in that period, high society replaced the recording industry. They chose who got fame and played huge music halls.

[icarusfall]

throbbing gay tail

lol

[Vasteel]

Music, on the other hand, is (relatively) cheap to make, and it's very easy to make a "professional" sounding recording with a weekend of time and a couple hundred dollars spent. Add in all the different venues for upping music online, and you get a scene that is ridiculously overcrowded, with no quality control whatsoever.

As opposed to what, the fantastic quality control you'll find on the next American Idol winner's album?

I have seen thousands of shows in my life, and a hundred or two absolutely amazing bands that you'll never hear because recording simply wasn't affordable or accessible for them. Now those bands can get their music out there, get people to the show, and get heard. The internet has been the absolute best thing that's happened to music since punk rock, bar fucking none.

I can't speak for other forms of music, but the quality of metal music has been falling to ridiculous lows since 1996, which is about the same time that the Internet starting becoming a part of mainstream culture.

I can list dozens of "Mozarts" from 1984-1996; I can't even name a handful from 1996-2008.

As someone who was actually going to metal shows since 1992, seeing a lot of the bands you love so much when they were still relevant, I can promise you the metal scene is better now than it was then. Everything from the bills, the number of awesome bands, the strength of the scene, and even the venues (back then, most metal shows in the south were infested with skinheads at shitty biker bars). And all of this is related to the fact that DIY production is so much more accesible.

Quality control plays a large role in that disparity. Bands back then had to work harder to get heard/get signed, which means that the quality of music from those bands who did get heard/signed was greater.

Bullshit. It just meant that most people only heard bands that some douche thought were sellable. It meant that far less avant-garde shit came out, that bands were forced into lifetime debt contracts, and were forced to cater to genre norms more. The death of 'the label' best thing that could ever happen to music. Now, any band can get their shit out there and probably keep whatever money they might make.

Are you fucking seriously trying to make a case for the record industry?

Bullshit. I've heard more great music in the last few years than ever.

Truth.

With the state of internet amateurism these days I fear there may never be another as good as Mercyful Fate.

Lol! There already was one when they were still called Witchery.

Fewer avenues for publication = greater competition for publication

Greater competition for publication = greater products

Greater effort required to achieve publication = greater products

With that setup, much of the garbage weeds itself out because it never even gets off the ground. It never gets signed, it never gets heard, etc.

Consider the arena of touring musicians, and how MySpace bands are affecting it:

Keep your Ayn Rand horseshit in your boardroom meetings and out of my music.

Also, my first band never once played a show without borrowing gear from one of the other bands we played with. This was '95-'96. It was awesome. At one point the other guitarist didn't even own her own guitar. To this day I've never had a decent rig (although that will change soon as I sell off all my video games). Punk as fuck, nigga!

Weeman doesn't know what he's talking about. He's never been in a band and just likes to posture about music.

This has changed nothing about DIY music - which is the only real kind.

Truth. DIY or die.

[jyoung]

Work hard?

Before the internet you had to work hard to get your stuff noticed above the thousands of bands that were signed.

Now you have to work hard to get your stuff noticed above the countless hordes who can put out music whenever they want.

Sounds to me like you have to work even harder now.

You typed the above thinking that the finish line is a completed recording. No, the finish line is a dedicated fan base.

No doubt, getting noticed is harder now. But more important than getting heard is getting people to care about your music; that's the "finish line" for most musicians: communication.

Damnit, we have something to say! We want to communicate. Even though club audiences have made it all possible for us, that isn't enough. We know we have plenty of energy for much more.

And that's the paradox of the internet: even though it allows for a much wider net of exposure, it's difficult to get those millions of the people inside to care when

a) thousands of other musicians (some honest, some not) are blaring their instruments in people's ears

b) most people are too distracted by noise and meaningless drivel to develop interest in anything but novelty acts and extensions of music that is already known/loved.

To analogize:

Remember when you were a kid and you played the shit out of whatever video game you had, just because you couldn't afford more than a couple a year? Remember how you used to research every purchase like mad, trying to make the best pick for your money?

Chances are, that all died when you finally starting usually emulators, or finally got enough steady income that you could buy and play pretty much anything you wanted.

That's because having everything right at your fingertips completely kills your appetite for fine dining. You eat a pinch of this, a pinch of that, and none of it really satisfies like it did when you used to savor the shit out of that one birthday game.

What emulators did to games, the Internet is now doing to music: enlarging the pool of entertainment to gargantuan levels and making the means of securing entertainment as easy as clicking a mouse, all of which makes the consumer public lazy, bloated, and easily bored, even when confronted with greatness.

So while the avenues of communication are larger, I'd argue that the rate of successful (intelligent) communication is not; it has lessened with the advent of the Internet.

[AstroBlue]

wEEman, please do this ok; please print that post out and mail it to yourself, and then in like 5 years, call an ambulance, open the envelope and read it.

[bbobb]

To analogize:

Remember when you were a kid and you played the shit out of whatever video game you had, just because you couldn't afford more than a couple a year? Remember how you used to research every purchase like mad, trying to make the best pick for your money?

Chances are, that all died when you finally starting usually emulators, or finally got enough steady income that you could buy and play pretty much anything you wanted.

That's because having everything right at your fingertips completely kills your appetite for fine dining. You eat a pinch of this, a pinch of that, and none of it really satisfies like it did when you used to savor the shit out of that one birthday game.

What emulators did to games, the Internet is now doing to music: enlarging the pool of entertainment to gargantuan levels and making the means of securing entertainment as easy as clicking a mouse, all of which makes the consumer public lazy, bloated, and easily bored, even when confronted with greatness.

So while the avenues of communication are larger, I'd argue that the rate of successful (intelligent) communication is not; it has lessened with the advent of the Internet.

This is a horrible analogy. In videogames, choice and money made them extremely limited. Since the advent of radio and such, you've had much much more of a chance to listen to a wide variety of music. All the internet has done is widen that even more. Are you also claiming that music was even better before the advent of radio?

[ElCapichan]

And that's the paradox of the internet: even though it allows for a much wider net of exposure, it's difficult to get those millions of the people inside to care when

a) thousands of other musicians (some honest, some not) are blaring their instruments in people's ears

b) most people are too distracted by noise and meaningless drivel to develop interest in anything but novelty acts and extensions of music that is already known/loved.

Thats not a problem with the internet or its distribution, thats a problem with the people. I'd even go as far to say Americans. What you also fail to understand is people have different taste and opinions. Record labels, mainly the large ones but even the small ones, tend to go with what makes them the most money. Does this mean that there aren't people who enjoy listening to the bands that aren't popular enough to get a record deal? I'll listen to anything. I like it, I''ll continue listening. Buy the album, go to a show if I can, etc. If I don't like it then I could care less. I've found a lot more stuff I like because of the internet, so you can please STFU!

Also, you seem to show a great detest for music distribution and downloading on the web, but I've seen you post in a certain thread on many occasions.

That's because having everything right at your fingertips completely kills your appetite for fine dining. You eat a pinch of this, a pinch of that, and none of it really satisfies like it did when you used to savor the shit out of that one birthday game.

Um, I don't want to portray the stereotypical American view of "I deserve what I want, when I want, and however much I want" but if I like something, then by default I will want more of it. But it's about being responsible and doing/taking things in moderation. Again, this is a problem with the people, not the method of distribution. I bought way too many games last year, but I tend to take responsibility and do things in moderation this year. Stop being such a snobby dick. It's not becoming of you.

[YellerDog]

(just because I have fun posting this)

[PaCrappa]

This guy reads too much, rocks too little. If he had a band and/or knew what was going on with being a working musician he'd know he was wrong and dumb.