Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3

**Anthony** · 11 Jun 2010, 11:27 PM

I think mech meant without the 4 hour juggles, like vf.

**MechDeus** · 11 Jun 2010, 11:51 PM

Originally Posted by Anthony

I think mech meant without the 4 hour juggles, like vf.

Yeah, that. I only watched like the first minute of this video but pretty much every combo that's more than two hits is the kind of idiotic looking shit I'm talking about:

Yes, I'm perfectly fine with 2D games having that kind of juggling nonsense, but it just looks stilted and stupid in Tekken and VF.

**StriderKyo** · 12 Jun 2010, 12:17 AM

See, this is where I know the whole knock against Tekken on this site is undeserved. VF has the exact same 10-hit-juggle-80-%-damage-combo nonsense that Tekken does, and the rubber bouncing ball opponent thing is even worse in VF now:

I always get the feeling that everybody's opinions calcified some time around Virtua Fighter 2 and just never changed. Like, this 70% El Blaze juggle is exactly what you're criticizing in Tekken:

Don't get me wrong, I still think VF's awesome and probably prefer it between the two (even though I suck hard at it), but I think Tekken's totally worthy these days, and so does pretty much the whole tournament scene, inside Asia and out.

**MechDeus** · 12 Jun 2010, 12:24 AM

Originally Posted by StriderKyo

See, this is where I know the whole knock against Tekken on this site is undeserved. VF has the exact same 10-hit-juggle-80-%-damage-combo nonsense that Tekken does, and the rubber bouncing ball opponent thing is even worse in VF now

Yes, and it looks stupid as shit. The hilariously floaty jumps in VF are probably the worst jumps in the history of fighting games, I've always hated those.

**Dipstick** · 12 Jun 2010, 01:02 AM

I think one reason the 3D fighters have the juggle system the way they do is because it's visually distinct. If you just had them wailing on some guy who was staggered from a big hit, it would be hard to distinguish between when they were still able to be hit to continue the combo and when they recovered (but iirc they try that with Taka in VF anyway).

Originally Posted by MechDeus

Yes, and it looks stupid as shit. The hilariously floaty jumps in VF are probably the worst jumps in the history of fighting games, I've always hated those.

Yeah except those are been out of VF since VF4 (and even in VF3 they were much less floaty). In a weird way, making it that unrealistic makes it a touch more realistic, as jumping at someone in a real fight is an extremely high-risk maneuver, whereas in 2D fighters it's somewhere between lower risk (although jumping at someone naked in a traditional SF game is not smart) to pretty much zero risk (the way characters move around in a game like Melty Blood or Arcana Heart would make you think that every little girl on this planet could fly).

**MechDeus** · 12 Jun 2010, 01:17 AM

Originally Posted by Dipstick

I think one reason the 3D fighters have the juggle system the way they do is because it's visually distinct. If you just had them wailing on some guy who was staggered from a big hit, it would be hard to distinguish between when they were still able to be hit to continue the combo and when they recovered (but iirc they try that with Taka in VF anyway).

I don't buy it, crumple and knockback animations are usually pretty easy to identify. Plus when you hit someone in Tekken miniature explosions go off, it's not exactly a blended effect.

In a weird way, making it that unrealistic makes it a touch more realistic, as jumping at someone in a real fight is an extremely high-risk maneuver

Or just not have had jumping*/restricted it to small hops from the start. Fighting on Dural's stage in VF1 was just pure silliness.

*Who remembers Vs.?

**kedawa** · 12 Jun 2010, 01:32 AM

I don't mind having a crazy juggle system so long as there is some sort of air recovery or safe fall to balance it out.
Being taken out of the game for 20 seconds while your opponent showboats is just stupid and unnecessary.
Matches should be decided by as many exchanges as possible, not by one or two that lead into long silly deterministic combos.