Science Vs God?????

[Captain Vegetable]

Originally posted by IronPlant
Yes, I will agree, I was not there when he did all these wonderful things for you. But I have to wonder what sort of label he left, meaning, was there a name brand on your calling to faith? Was it Jehovah, Yahweh, are Zues? Was it Christian, Jewish or Muslim? Was it Buddhist, Romen Greek or maybe some other god in the vast world of gods we have now? Or did you just assume whatever wonderful thing it was that happened was caused by the Christian god?

Because when He reveals Himself to you, He makes it known what His truth is. He is the only God. The one, true God. Yaweh.

A concequence of knowing His truth is also knowing what the lies are. The God of Jewdiasm and Christianity are the same. The Musslim god is the god of destruction, and the father of lies. Zeus is a story. The triune God of Christianity is the only true God. I know, as He has revealed Himself to me as well, and reconciled my sins through the death of His Son, Jesus Christ.

And I suppose you are much better off than me and a lot of other people on this board now, now that God has had a nice little chat with you. I hardly see how that's fair. Me and others will go to hell for our doubt and our search for truth, while you get to go to heaven because HE chose to talk to you.

The potter uses one lump of clay to make a vessel with a noble purpose, and another lump of clay to make a vessel with an unnoble purpose. Who are you to question the potter?

Originally posted by IronPlant
And talking about people who don\'t believe in god as being vain and \"arrogant\" as you put it. I think a person who fallows a faith to save themselves from hell or in a fear of God and the negative things that both can cause is very \"arrogant\" and vain. That person doesn\'t believe for any other reason than to save his own ass from pain.

\"Fear of the Lord is the begining of wisdom\" - Proverbs 1:1

And I do what He asks and believe because I am compelled to. Once He reveals Himself to you, you cannot chose to turn away. If He chooses you, then you are His forever, and no one can snatch you from His hand.

I don\'t obey Him and glorify Him to satisfy a selfish need to \"get to Heaven.\" I do it because I understand it is my sole purpose. We were put here to glorify God. That is it. And as He loves me I am in love with Him. He deserves my undying praise, admiration, obedience, and faith.

[Master of 7s]

Originally posted by IronPlant
Yes, I will agree, I was not there when he did all these wonderful things for you. But I have to wonder what sort of label he left, meaning, was there a name brand on your calling to faith? Was it Jehovah, Yahweh, are Zues? Was it Christian, Jewish or Muslim? Was it Buddhist, Romen Greek or maybe some other god in the vast world of gods we have now? Or did you just assume whatever wonderful thing it was that happened was caused by the Christian god?

The name was Jesus sir. I became a Christian because I was bored thought it'd be funny to "hang out with these weirdos". Well obviously I now find myself as one of those wierdos thanks to God's indescribable love.

And I suppose you are much better off than me and a lot of other people on this board now, now that God has had a nice little chat with you. I hardly see how that's fair. Me and others will go to hell for our doubt and our search for truth, while you get to go to heaven because HE chose to talk to you.

Your sarcasm is duly noted sir, but I hardly see why it's necessary. God reveals Himself to those who seek Him and I guess I was in some way seeking Him when I decided to hang out with the wierdos. Apparently He saw all the questions I had and more to the point, how broken and busted I was. I often felt like He had no intention of letting me get away once He had me in the fold and He didn't. He loved me silly until even though I hadn't asked to be, He took away the burdens that weighed down my soul, He revealed Himself to me and gave me all sorts of gifts that I don't deserve to possess.
I don't know why God made me His personal project for a season. All I know is I belong to Him now and nothing is going to change that. If that isn't fair to everyone else in the world, talk to God not me.

You make a very hard case for anyone to believe that you've truthfully had a personal religious revelation. Sure you sound like any other "true believer", but its sort of odd how you show it. It's all nice and great to talk big, but 7 you have two big tittie girls on your post. One as your char pic and one at the bottom. Yeah, sure you can say we are all perverted if we think anything lustful about them, but really, come now. I wonder how many sins that is. 1 you had to look at them to use them, so most likely you sinned then. 2. Jesus says that lusting is just as bad as the actual act of adultre. And 3, you put it on here for us all to look at and lust after and thus you are acting as a "stumbling block". So in your little love letter to God you felt you needed to share with us, you've sinned 3 times.

Subject: Master of 7s

Kingdom: Animal

Phylum: Chordata

Class: Mammalia

Order: Primate

Family: Hominidae

Genus: Homo

Species: sapien

*YEP!! IT'S HUMAN ALRIGHT BOSS*

You make highly valid points and no doubt God will deal with me if I have indeed sinned against another, however, I am a human being and I am a man. I am a sexual animal by my very nature. If the laws and commandents do anything they prove that it is impossible for mankind to save himself from damnation.
I at no point stated that I was anything other than a human being filled with vices, problems, and issues. God may have worked a small miracle by saving my sorry ass, but He still has a LOT of work left to do IMO. I try my best to live by His word and fail miserably most of the time. God often chastises me because of my lack of faith, yet He remembers I am only flesh. However, if my avatar offends you that much I will change it.

And talking about people who don't believe in god as being vain and "arrogant" as you put it. I think a person who fallows a faith to save themselves from hell or in a fear of God and the negative things that both can cause is very "arrogant" and vain. That person doesn't believe for any other reason than to save his own ass from pain.

Ugh, did you even read what I said? I find the belief that the universe must prove itself terms that man can understand to be vain and arrogant. I did not save myself, God saved me. And when I say I fear God, I mean I respect Him. And a person cannot simply believe in God. His action in the world must demonstrate his faith or his faith is dead.

P.s. I'll change the avatar and the sig later. I gotta go to work now.

[Fe 26]

Originally posted by Captain Vegetable


Because when He reveals Himself to you, He makes it known what His truth is. He is the only God. The one, true God. Yaweh.

A concequence of knowing His truth is also knowing what the lies are. The God of Jewdiasm and Christianity are the same. The Musslim god is the god of destruction, and the father of lies. Zeus is a story. The triune God of Christianity is the only true God. I know, as He has revealed Himself to me as well, and reconciled my sins through the death of His Son, Jesus Christ.

yeah, you and every other person who has believed in something in a fundamentalist manner.

Originally posted by Captain Vegetable

The potter uses one lump of clay to make a vessel with a noble purpose, and another lump of clay to make a vessel with an unnoble purpose. Who are you to question the potter?

I'm a vessel with a an unnoble purpose? Are you trying to be insulting? Are you trying to turn this into a flame war? And why would you love a God who makes things to love and things to hate? I also don't believe your God who chooses what will go to hell and heaven when he creates it is the same God as the one in bible.

Originally posted by Captain Vegetable

\"Fear of the Lord is the begining of wisdom\" - Proverbs 1:1

And I do what He asks and believe because I am compelled to. Once He reveals Himself to you, you cannot chose to turn away. If He chooses you, then you are His forever, and no one can snatch you from His hand.

I don\'t obey Him and glorify Him to satisfy a selfish need to \"get to Heaven.\" I do it because I understand it is my sole purpose. We were put here to glorify God. That is it. And as He loves me I am in love with Him. He deserves my undying praise, admiration, obedience, and faith.

Really? We are only here for his glorification? We are not here to learn? to experience new things? to become better individuals or to obtain a individuality his own angels do not have? Not here to create, to build or to explore? Not here to become wise or to love? We are just here to glorify him? Message his ego and make him feel better about who he is? If that is truly why we are here then what's the point of most of how earthly life works? If he simple wanted glorification he could have went ahead and made us angels or some sort of heavenly servant. There is no point in bothering with a mortal life if he simple wants glorification.

Master of 7s

Nah, the avatar doesn\'t bother me. But it does create certain inconsistencies. Yeah boobs are a wonderful thing. They are perfectly natural things. But how many holy men do you know that God has spoken to that have a avatar with a boobie girl?

Just getting all these mixed signals, God and big Boobs. My brain\'s just not geared that way, well other than thanking whatever powers that may be for them.

[Captain Vegetable]

Originally posted by IronPlant
yeah, you and every other person who has believed in something in a fundamentalist manner.

Ah! But the difference is that I am correct...I cannot prove to you that I am correct, but God has proven it to me. And that is all I need.

I'm a vessel with a an unnoble purpose? Are you trying to be insulting? Are you trying to turn this into a flame war? And why would you love a God who makes things to love and things to hate? I also don't believe your God who chooses what will go to hell and heaven when he creates it is the same God as the one in bible.

Funny that you think that way...as that quote was from the Bible. Paul wrote it. So, the God I described is, in fact, the God of the Bible. God the Father, Jesus Christ, and His Holy Spirit. Here's the verse:

Romans 9:21
"Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?" - New King James

"When a potter makes jars out of clay, doesn't he have a right to use the same lump of clay to make one jar for decoration and another to throw garbage into?" - New Living Translation

"Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use?" - New American Standard

Looks to me as though your knowlege of the God of the Bible is incomplete at best.

There are a lot of things that people, even Christians, don't want to believe about the Bible...one of those things is that God chooses. He chooses who believes in Himself, as He is the one who reveals knowlege and grants faith. It's a harsh thing to understand, especially concerning Hell and damnation. But it is the truth.

Really? We are only here for his glorification? We are not here to learn? to experience new things? to become better individuals or to obtain a individuality his own angels do not have? Not here to create, to build or to explore? Not here to become wise or to love? We are just here to glorify him? Message his ego and make him feel better about who he is? If that is truly why we are here then what's the point of most of how earthly life works? If he simple wanted glorification he could have went ahead and made us angels or some sort of heavenly servant. There is no point in bothering with a mortal life if he simple wants glorification.

According to your reasoning. His reasons are infalable...even if they aren't understandable.

Yes, we have a single purpose. That purpose is to glorify God. We are to glorify God in all of those things you've listed, and the reason we have all of the things you listed is because of His grace. It matters not what you think of our purpose. It remains our purpose in light of your disapproval.

[Fe 26]

Originally posted by Captain Vegetable


Ah! But the difference is that I am correct...I cannot prove to you that I am correct, but God has proven it to me. And that is all I need.

Not really, part of being a Christian is convincing others of the truth. It takes more than setting in your house and getting the nice fuzies inside while the rest of the world goes to hell. Not caring about others, not helping people do right when you could, being self centered and not spreading the word when you fully know you can, are all sins. But you also think humans have no say in it, that must make life really convenint for you.

Originally posted by Captain Vegetable

Funny that you think that way...as that quote was from the Bible. Paul wrote it. So, the God I described is, in fact, the God of the Bible. God the Father, Jesus Christ, and His Holy Spirit. Here's the verse:

Romans 9:21
"Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?" - New King James

"When a potter makes jars out of clay, doesn't he have a right to use the same lump of clay to make one jar for decoration and another to throw garbage into?" - New Living Translation

"Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use?" - New American Standard

Looks to me as though your knowlege of the God of the Bible is incomplete at best.

There are a lot of things that people, even Christians, don't want to believe about the Bible...one of those things is that God chooses. He chooses who believes in Himself, as He is the one who reveals knowlege and grants faith. It's a harsh thing to understand, especially concerning Hell and damnation. But it is the truth.

That is debatable. Of what I,ve read in regards to those verses, its referring to the nation of Israel, aka groups of people, land areas and whatnot, and not people in general. This is supported by that part of Romans being headed with "ISRAEL'S rejection and God,s justice" and not "human beings on earth's rejection and God's justice". Two popular interpretations are A. the bible is saying God will cause things to happen against or put groups of people against Christians in general so that individuals may learn and come closer to him from it. And B. Explaining how God can do anything he wants to help explain why and how God has changed the convenient with man from the old to new. Helping Jews and Gentiles come to grasp with the change in how things are to work from then on.

Originally posted by Captain Vegetable

According to your reasoning. His reasons are infalable...even if they aren't understandable.

Yes, we have a single purpose. That purpose is to glorify God. We are to glorify God in all of those things you've listed, and the reason we have all of the things you listed is because of His grace. It matters not what you think of our purpose. It remains our purpose in light of your disapproval.

I have to wonder why you are even here or even chose to reply to this thread. You have not tried to help people come to God or help others understand him nor do you think its possible for you to do so. Why would anyone waist time doing anything they truly believe has no purpose or effect in the world?

[Master of 7s]

Originally posted by IronPlant
Nah, the avatar doesn\'t bother me. But it does create certain inconsistencies. Yeah boobs are a wonderful thing. They are perfectly natural things. But how many holy men do you know that God has spoken to that have a avatar with a boobie girl?

Never said I was a holy man. In fact I'm probably one of worst Christians in the Family yet God loves me anyways. I can't figure out why.
All I said was that God gave me power to command angels. There's nothing special about that. The DMV gave you the power to drive in the form of a licence is that anything special?

Now if I had been given the power to heal multitudes and raise the dead that would be something shout about.

Just getting all these mixed signals, God and big Boobs. My brain\'s just not geared that way, well other than thanking whatever powers that may be for them.

See that's the problem. God says Don't covet your neighbors wife, don't commit adultery, don't lust after women and all of a sudden everybody thinks He has some kind of beef with sex in general.

Hello? He INVENTED sex and He specifically wired human beings (men in particular) to be the way we are to promote procreation.

As for you, be fruitful and multiply; Bring forth abundantly in the earth and multiply in it. Genesis 9:7

Moreover He says: Let your fountain be blessed and rejoice with the wife of your youth. Let her breasts satisfy you at all times; And always be intoxicated with her love. Proverbs 5:18-19

Come on do I have to break this down? Obviously God is not above innuendo if it gets the point across. It isn't sex God has a beef with, it's immoral, amoral, and loveless sex that gets His goat. Sex, that beautiful and HOLY gift from the Lord, is too often turned into something filthy and perverse by people who remove any vestige of love, caring, or devotion to the other person involved from the act.

To lust as the Bible puts it means to be filled with a strong, burning, uncontrolled desire. I think men have it the worst in this particular regard which is why I think Jesus always addressed the men when He said "Do not lust."

Looking at a pair of huge knockers could very well cause some folks to stumble, but I think that's a little silly. They're just breasts for cryin' out loud. I mean if a woman is blessed a natural pair that she can't hide even in a set of over-alls, what's she supposed to do? Wear a sweater?

[Captain Vegetable]

Originally posted by IronPlant
Not really, part of being a Christian is convincing others of the truth. It takes more than setting in your house and getting the nice fuzies inside while the rest of the world goes to hell. Not caring about others, not helping people do right when you could, being self centered and not spreading the word when you fully know you can, are all sins. But you also think humans have no say in it, that must make life really convenint for you.

Wrong-O! Part of being a Christian is spreading the word of God, not convincing people of it. Here's another verse for you, spoken by Christ Himself:

Luke 9:5
"And whoever will not receive you, when you go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet as a testimony against them." - New King James

"If the people of the village won't receive your message when you enter it, shake off its dust from your feet as you leave. It is a sign that you have abandoned that village to its fate." - New Living Translation

"And as for those who do not receive you, as you go out from that city, shake the dust off your feet as a testimony against them." - New American Standard

No force. No convincing. Simply explain God is, and that He sent His only begotten Son to die to pay for your sins. Should you dismiss my blessing, I am to shake the dust from my feet and continue on. It is not my job to bring people to God. It is God's job to do that, as I can do nothing good of my own will, but Jesus Christ living through me can.

You continuously show your lack of knowlege and understanding concerning the Bible and God and Christ, yet you insist you "know" how a Christian should act. How is that so?

I find it obnoxious that you think you know how a Christian should behave when you've had no interaction with God on a personal level.

That is debatable. Of what I,ve read in regards to those verses, its referring to the nation of Israel, aka groups of people, land areas and whatnot, and not people in general. This is supported by that part of Romans being headed with "ISRAEL'S rejection and God,s justice" and not "human beings on earth's rejection and God's justice". Two popular interpretations are A. the bible is saying God will cause things to happen against or put groups of people against Christians in general so that individuals may learn and come closer to him from it. And B. Explaining how God can do anything he wants to help explain why and how God has changed the convenient with man from the old to new. Helping Jews and Gentiles come to grasp with the change in how things are to work from then on.

Whatever you say. I have the revelation of God to base my beliefs on...all you have is an old book. Though you may read the Bible and think you understand it, you'll not fully grasp it's meaning. Surely God is not the author of confusion...but His is a spirit you do not have. And as such, cannot understand the Bible.

I have to wonder why you are even here or even chose to reply to this thread. You have not tried to help people come to God or help others understand him nor do you think its possible for you to do so. Why would anyone waist time doing anything they truly believe has no purpose or effect in the world?

I've done it elsewhere. And I don't do it to "save" anyone. I do it out of love for my Father. He's commanded to spread the Good News, and so I do. I can convert no one, but God brings those He desires unto Himself. And He may very well use my preaching to bring someone in. Even still, it is not I who have convinced them, but God who has unveiled their eyes and hearts so that they might hear, understand, and believe. All good in this world comes from Him, and so I'll credit Him with such.

You'll never understand until God reviels Himself to you.

[Hero]

Tracer, that was some good stuff.

About science - I do think it's fickle, but I dunno if it questions itself nearly as much as people hold it to be. There are certain stigmas in science that you are not supposed to question, or so it seems. I have a book that talks about such, but it's at home, and I'm at work. Maybe I'll plug it later.

[Captain Vegetable]

Hey! Hero! We doing that Bible study or not? I've PMed you 2 times about it.

IronPlant. I went back over Roman 9 with a fine tooth comb and fail to see where Paul was talking about \"the nations.\" He was talking about God\'s sovernty in all matters. Roman 9:18 says, \"God shows mercy to whom He chooses, and He hardens the hearts of those whom He chooses.\" I can\'t make it any more clear than that. It is all in God\'s hands. It is His choice.

Read The book of Romans CHAPTER 9 for yourself. It speaks of God\'s sovernty in all matters. You\'ve totally missed the mark.

Again, I seek not to convince you. Only God can bring you to Himself.

Should you persist in dismissing my message, I\'ll shake the dust from my feet and continue on.

[rezo]

Hero, if you don't question something in science because of a "stigma", then that is the error the person who isn't questioning. See Tracer's example of "Newton was always right until. . ./Einstein was always right until. . . " . That is to say, let them create their stigmas if they like. If it is at fault, circumstances will be found to prove it, and change will be necessary.

Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?" - New King James

I was created to dishonor god and glory him? would god make such contrary pots?