You need to see Doom 3 in motion. It EASILY looks better than any other game ever made.
Sausage-in-training
I saw some new pics of Doom 3 on hardocp.com yesterday.
I'm not too impressed.
Envrionments - Nice. Very good lighting. Lots of detail. However, they're using lots of angular objects and stuff. Not many curves.
Enemies - They look good, except for the apparant polygons. They kind of make it all look low-tech, which we know it's not. They're just giving more polys to the environments than they are to the characters.
id has been and will always be focused on the tech, not the game. It almost appears like they're focusing on exhibiting the tech through atmosphere, trying to make it "spooookey" like RE or an Alien movie, instead of twitch-shoot-kill like the original.
For a contrast, look at Nintendo/Retro's Metroid Prime. Check this shot: http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories...00.html?page=1 . Notice that Samus's character model is well-formed, with lots of polys. You don't really see the polys, like you do on Doom 3's models. Prime's envrionments ( http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories...00.html?page=3 ) look just as complex as Doom 3's, yet character models ( http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories...00.html?page=7 , http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories...00.html?page=9 and http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories...0.html?page=22 ) don't suck. They're trying to get the atmosphere right by giving the game a cohesive, realistic look -- instead of craptastic polyfests ( http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?im...hfMV8xX2wuanBn ).
Quite frankly, (and having seen video footage of neither) Prime looks better than Doom 3 to me at this point. I wouldn't be surprised if the Cube actually turns out to be able to handle the Doom 3 engine.
You need to see Doom 3 in motion. It EASILY looks better than any other game ever made.
Electronic cigarette.
Lhadatt: Resolution. Doom III will be running on many puters at more then twice that Prime will run at (lessee, absolute max for Prime would 640x480, Doom III will be run by many people at a minimum of 800x600 or 1024x768, with many going for 1600x1200). That means two things: Tons more graphical power is required, and it'll look ten times as sharp.
To compare even the images you linked to, notice how crisp and clear Doom III is. That's why you can see the poly edges. Notice the shots of Prime, see the aliasing that plagues every edge, notice how much it affects every outline on Samus' suit. The two games look nothing alike, what you're seeing is only more visable because Doom III is running at a much higher resolution then Prime is.
http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories...00.html?page=7 Take this shot for instance. Look at the stair-effects running up and down the blue edges, and look at how few polygons are use to create the circle at the top of that tube. Metroid Prime will look incredible in its right, but to compare the two is just silly.
lamentations of their women
Not to mention the fact that Prime is almost finished and Doom III won't be out for another year or so.
Sausage-in-training
Andy: I will reserve final judgement until I see it in motion.
Mech:
Something I didn't bother to think about earlier is that Prime and later console FPSs will be compared to the console port of Doom 3. Ergo, Doom 3 will suffer from the same resolution and aliasing issues once it hits Xbox.
But as for the PC version.. higher rez is no excuse for crappy models with polys sticking out all over the place. Yes, it takes more power and blah blah, which is why we have 2.5 GHz chips and Geforce 4s now, but it still just doesn't look right to me.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't really care. Every Doom 3 shot I've seen so far as given me that totally inspired feeling of "blah". I'll wait til I see footage to make a final judgement, but I'm not preparing to get excited over it.
Electronic cigarette.
Well, if you'll compare just the XBox version, to place Doom III on the same res as those Prime shots, it'd look very similar. However, I can pretty much guarentee you the XBox won't have that aliasing for Doom III. The resolution will be the same maximum, yes, but it'll still look crisper then that. The final question as to how well each looks on console is going to be the framerate.
What you seem to completely miss is illustrated here:You don't seem to understand that models in Doom III are better and of a much higher poly-count then the models in Prime. Prime initially looks smoother to you because it's displayed at such a low res that it all blurs together and appears to be smoother. If you were to display it at the same resolution and size as the Doom III shots, it'd look worse in comparision (Prime could be built on the Q3 engine easily, and the D3 engine destroys that).higher rez is no excuse for crappy models with polys sticking out all over the place.
Along with that, you say it's no excuse for the models, and yet even the current console desired framerate (constant 60 fps) is about half of what PC users strive for. The real difference in is the motion and fluidness of the screen, and this game is developed for PC users.
Now with more Negro!
Are we looking at the same game?Originally posted by Lhadatt
Every Doom 3 shot I've seen so far as given me that totally inspired feeling of "blah".
http://gamespot.com/gamespot/filters...0.html?page=69
Looks prety good to me.
BTW, Prime's enviornments can't even be compared to Doom III. They are literally, in a league of their own. Check these out
http://gamespot.com/gamespot/filters...0.html?page=71
http://gamespot.com/gamespot/filters...0.html?page=68
This game is gonna rock so much, it's not even funny. I'll probably get the PC version, if only for the keyboard/mouse and the mod community. Plus, I'm not sure if I can wait the extra 9 months.
Sausage-in-training
No, I'm not missing it. My last post was not comparing the models to Prime. I was simply stating that I think they look crappy. Look at the pic of the red guy. He's way too blocky, too angular. Nice textures; they almost make its joints look skinned. However, he's still blocky and doesn't mesh well with the environment. They're spending too many polys on the environment and not enough on the character.
Now take the overall look of that pic and compare it to the overall look of the Metroid pics. To my senses, Metroid *looks* better. It doesn't matter what resolution it runs at -- how the image is constructed is what counts. In short: so what if it's high rez? Crap is crap.
Framerate doesn't exactly matter on a console. 60 FPS is good enough for NTSC.
Electronic cigarette.
Actually, he (the red guy, the redesigned Imps. They're actually blackish-grey, the red is from light-sourcing) meshes perfectly with his environment. After watching the video that was released at E3, nothing else compares. If the models from any console game at all were shown at that resolution, they'd look way more blocky then that Imp. Not even Halo on XBox comes close to that (take a look at the humans in D3); this is where resolution comes in. I'm guessing you don't play PC games, which is why you say that. You aren't used to seeing models they way they actually look, you're used to smaller blurred versions of everything.
As for overall look, every other pic shows off how good D3 is. Look at the redesigned Demon (until they release more names, I'm giving everything traditional Doom names) and the way it appears in the environment is stunning. Notice how well it flows together, it's almost seamless throughout.
60 fps is only good enough because they can't do better. Hell, they have a hard enough time sticking to 30 (note: I'm not blaming developers).
So Prime is crap?It doesn't matter what resolution it runs at -- how the image is constructed is what counts. In short: so what if it's high rez? Crap is crap.
Now with more Negro!
Okay, so you see ONE enemy that has visible polys. So automatically all the characters look bad.
Good call!
I know I don't need to say this, but this game is still relatively early, Prime is nearing completion. Doom III has PLENTY of time to tweak whatever nuances you have with the game.
UPDATE: I just downloaded a Doom III video from IGN. Go there now and get his video!!!! This game is jaw-droppingly gorgeous!! Nothing, and I mean nothing, looks better right now. Not even the mighty PDO. (well, PDO does have better overall designs, though) Even the enemy that you complain is blocky looks like butta in motion. Pics can't ever relay how good a game looks in reality.
UPDATE #2: I just tried to get the link at IGN, and all of a sudden it says you need to be an IGNinsider to get it!! But I just got it a minute ago!!! Oh well, at least I got it the first time.
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